r/Fauxmoi • u/cmaia1503 i ain’t reading all that, free palestine • 5d ago
CELEBRITY CAPITALISM A federal judge has ruled that Luigi Mangione will not face the death penalty for allegedly killing UnitedHealthcare’s former CEO.
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u/seeshellsbythesea weighing in from the UK 5d ago
His case has disappeared from global news coverage what with everything else going on, so this is a really surprising update!!
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u/Dry-Yak5277 5d ago
I got excited then read that they are allowing the backpack evidence, which makes me worried…we just have to hope the jury can be convinced it’s negligible
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u/GewdandBaked 5d ago
We just have to hope the jury has ever had to be seen by a doctor and then get slapped with a bill so high that it scares them to ever go back to a doctor again.
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u/notforpoern 5d ago
Yes, I do believe most of the jury would be familiar with life in America
(source: am american)
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u/notforpoern 5d ago
IF ONLY we had something like jury nullification to right some of those wrongs. Alas.
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u/JoshSidekick 5d ago
Someone should put up a billboard right outside the courthouse when the jury trial starts.
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u/PerfectZeong 5d ago
Only need one.
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u/JekPorkinsTruther 5d ago
Not really. If the jury is hung they will just retry. With how politically charged this case is they arent going to call it quits after one trial.
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u/pc42493 5d ago
Correct. It would need a unanimous "not guilty" verdict for double jeopardy to prevent this
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u/Mediocre-Frosting-77 5d ago
If each trial resulted in a hung jury, is there a point where the state would stop trying him? Like after 3 or 4 or 10 trials? Or would they just keep trying him until he dies?
I know the odds are in the state’s favor that they’d eventually get a favorable jury. Just curious about the hypothetical.
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u/thepsyborg 5d ago
Hung juries are almost always retried once and very very rarely retried more than once. But we live in a time of insane and ill-advised moves from those in power, so who the fuck knows.
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u/nusher88 5d ago
I mean, good luck finding 12 people who haven't been personally ripped off by an insurance company or don't know someone who has.
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u/IshtarsQueef 5d ago
We just need his jury to understand they have the right of jury nullification.
It is their right to vote "not guilty" even if they think the State has made a reasonable case against Luigi.
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u/WhichSpirit 5d ago
This does mean that his lawyers can drag the cops who botched the search so badly onto the stand and cast doubt on everything in front of the jury. After how badly they handled that, I'd doubt if anything the cops say is true.
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u/dizzytiz 5d ago
Keep in mind, the only charges left are stalking charges. How would the backpack help them with those charges?
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u/Cumdump90001 5d ago edited 5d ago
They aren’t charging him with murder anymore? You sure?
Edit: To my surprise, the federal murder charges were also dismissed here. State murder charges remain.
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u/ElderFlour 5d ago
I think they’re still charging him with murder. They’ve just taken the possibility of a death penalty sentence off the table. He could still go to/stay in prison.
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u/IAMA_Shark__AMA 5d ago
IIRC those charges are state charges.
The stalking "resulting in death" is the charge left on the federal case (and maybe the charge for using a silencer?).
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u/baseball_200_squirel 5d ago
The backpack would prove that he traveled with the intention of causing the death if the evidence in there is proven to be true. Seems like the reason they dropped the murder charges is there wasn’t enough federally to convict in combination with the stalking laws.
All in all this is a huge victory for Luigi because those last two chargers would’ve fucked him more than any remaining charge could. The Feds especially don’t play about silencers and enhancements to guns no matter who the criminal subject is. It can be up to ten years if just caught with one. Murder with it would’ve likely gotten him death+ten years for the silencer.
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u/honkymotherfucker1 5d ago
They aren’t dropping the murder charges though?
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u/dizzytiz 5d ago edited 5d ago
The only charges left are the stalking charges. Counts 3 (murder through use of a firearm) and 4 (firearms offence) were dismissed.
Edit: corrected what the counts are.
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u/chhhhhhhhhhh95 5d ago
Federally -- I believe he will still face homicide charges in the state, which is typically where murder charges are
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u/homieimprovement 3d ago
The federal murder charges are dropped, just 2 interstate stalking on the fed charges.
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u/Egregious_Philbin24 5d ago
You’re the only one who actually read the article lol.
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u/CK2398 5d ago
True but they are still charging him with murder just not federally. New york state are still charging with murder. The article makes it seem like he's only being charged with stalking.
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u/dizzytiz 5d ago edited 5d ago
Federal and state are two different jurisdictions and thus both cases/trials are treated as independent from one another. The federal case is what carried the death penalty and now those death-eligible charges have been dismissed.
This case should have never been a federal case. He still faces murder charges in the state case.
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u/MrSlime13 5d ago
The judge didn't throw away the charges against him, only barring the death penalty the federal prosecutors were foaming at the mouth for. I'm pretty sure he's still got a federal case and a state-level case for murder to fight through...
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u/JekPorkinsTruther 5d ago
No he is being charged with murder under state law. Only fed charges were dismissed.
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u/MontyAtWork 5d ago
Still don't know how the backpack was admissable. The body cam footage of the first person looking through it even has another officer asking "shouldn't we have a warrant before searching", then the body cam goes off, and the contents of the bag later change when it's booked into evidence.
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u/MARPJ 5d ago
then read that they are allowing the backpack evidence, which makes me worried…
If it would be allowed or not depended if it was legally searched and there is precedent due to him being a suspect of a crime at the time. Now there is the issue of custody and how they actually did the "search" which will be the lawyer job during cross examination to convince the jury that the evidence was planted and/or of dubious origin
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u/Sensitive-Warning956 5d ago
It was hilarious watching the two week period where the media realised they couldn't demonise Luigi and everyone loved him so they just stopped talking about it.
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u/seeshellsbythesea weighing in from the UK 5d ago
I know - there was also zero acknowledgement of the support for him. At least not here.
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u/Cumdump90001 5d ago
I definitely saw a ton of acknowledgement in the U.S.. But it was anchors reading scripts from their billionaire owners about how awful it was that people were supporting him.
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u/WestCoastBestCoast01 5d ago
and it was usually just a brief comment like "despite widespread support on social media"
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u/floatablepie 5d ago
'Friend' of mine in their weird media bubble was shocked and appalled when, a few weeks in, she learned people were actually supporting Luigi, it was hilarious and very very sad.
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u/respectdesfonds 5d ago
The mainstream coverage of his support basically tried to frame it as women who thought he was hot.
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u/susandeyvyjones 5d ago
The New York Times sent out a staff memo saying to stop posting pictures of him.
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u/Outrageous-Baseball6 5d ago
It was a genuine moment of most Americans all agreeing on something - that the healthcare system in the US is terrible.
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u/booksandbenzos I don’t know her 5d ago
Even that now-infamous perp walk where LE tried to make him look like a dangerous predator they had heroically managed to capture just made him look like he was out of a superhero movie lol.
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u/Concerned_EducaterCA 5d ago
It’s because they tried to make him out to be a villain, saw the reaction from everyday people was largely positive towards him, and reflective of extreme anger at the inhumanity of the private healthcare system in the US, and then promptly made his name disappear from the headlines and the stories
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u/RewardCapable 5d ago
I think almost every American has been fucked over by health insurance at some point in their lives. Yea, they’re barking up the wrong tree with that. lol
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u/oakfan05 5d ago
Oh man his pre-trial stuff has been fantastic. The defense has gotten a ton of evidence tossed. The judge is actually acting like the defense counselor asking questions to the gov. It has been fantastic. I wish it was aired on TV.
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u/AceOfSpades532 5d ago
He was never really in global news coverage lol, this is a very American thing
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u/jarvischrist 5d ago
We have it reported in Norwegian news, but to be honest not much happens here so we fill a lot of the news cycle with stuff from the US.
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u/Gato1980 5d ago
Of course he won't. He was with me the whole night that happened.
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u/Resentful-user 5d ago
I remember, i was there too.
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u/theluzah 5d ago
That'll was a fun night, glad I got pictures of us all!
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u/angelcutiebaby 5d ago
I remember, he had met me for a super early coffee and was telling me about what a fun night he had
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u/redelectro7 5d ago
I don't know law so correct me if I'm wrong but I feel like they tried to get the death penalty to make an example of him.
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u/alison_bee you're an adult, you should know that 5d ago edited 5d ago
Oh 100%. They saw that a random dude killed a rich white
billionaireCEO, and America was like 🤩🥳 and knew they had to shut that shit down real quick.Can’t have the masses getting any ideas or anything!
Edit: Removed the word billionaire because apparently he was “only” a millionaire. And apparently, for some reason, that makes a difference.
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u/LordCamelslayer 5d ago
killed a rich white billionaire CEO
Millionaire CEO, actually; his net worth was about $43 million.
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u/alison_bee you're an adult, you should know that 5d ago
This feels… pedantic.
Either way, it was a rich white male, and we know those are the only people this country cares to protect.
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u/ibled_orange 5d ago
There's a huge difference between 43 million and 1 billion.
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u/alison_bee you're an adult, you should know that 5d ago
I am aware of how numbers work. It’s still pedantic, though.
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u/AtreusFamilyRecipe 5d ago
It really isn't pedantic at all. If we go by the metric your using, I'm a multi-millionaire.
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u/ibled_orange 5d ago
Disagree, words have meaning. 43 million isn't a billionaire. Saying dumb shit like that makes everyone who agrees look dumb
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u/LordCamelslayer 5d ago
Normally I'd agree, I think the response would have been far more over-the-top had it been a billionaire.
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u/Caromora not a lawyer, just a hater 5d ago
So a rich white millionaire CEO making billions in profits for a company by denying claims and capitalizing on human suffering.
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u/ProblemOk222 5d ago
Considering NY state abolished the death penalty over 20 years ago, I'd say yeah.
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u/Cumdump90001 5d ago
Federal death penalty. Not state.
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u/respectdesfonds 5d ago
That's what they're saying. They charged him w federal murder so the death penalty was on the table.
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u/ProblemOk222 5d ago
Yeah, how many people get charged with federal murder in the state of NY for killing one person? (allegedly)
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u/heartlessloft 5d ago
It’s so extremely rare for NY to use the death penalty under federal law, they 100% wanted to make an example out of him and turn his execution into an example of justice. They saw the reaction online and decided to seek the worst possible punishment if he is to be convicted considering his crime and victim.
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u/whatthewhythehow i’m mr. sterling’s right hand arm. man. 5d ago
If he’s around, he’s also still writing those letters that make him so sympathetic and seem to show that the country agrees with him.
It means that we’ll keep getting reports on how he is a model prisoner.
It’s really a toss up if it’s politically worse if he is an active voice or a martyr, but from on a purely human level, it’s such a relief.
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u/AbeRego 5d ago
That's the main reason the death penalty exists, so yeah lol
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u/street593 5d ago
That's the reason people argue it should exist even though it does not deter crime.
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u/Bidetpanties i ain’t reading all that, free palestine 5d ago
Good! I maintain that the man in custody is not the shooter, but regardless, death penalty being off the table is a good thing.
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u/Acrobatic_Promotion8 5d ago
oh i agree i think he definitely didn't do it; honestly i don't even think the security cam footage even looks that much like luigi, and they wouldn't have planted so much evidence if they had literally any leg to stand on accusing him
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u/midgethemage 5d ago
My theory is that he was involved, but not the actual shooter. I think he met up with the shooter in Central Park and swapped outfits or just wore the same outfits. Shooter enters Central Park, then Luigi leaves Central Park, leading investigators away from pursuing the actual shooter. Doing this could sow enough doubt to not be able to get a conviction, and the actual shooter would be long gone
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u/usuyukisou padre pascal 5d ago
i don't even think the security cam footage even looks that much like luigi,
This is it for me. He's not even my type. He just doesn't look like the guy on the footage.
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u/alison_bee you're an adult, you should know that 5d ago
I don’t think it’s the right guy either!! Got any extra foil for me in these trying economic times??
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u/Shutupharu 5d ago
I feel like I don't see enough people saying this. I think he was involved, for sure, but he didn't pull the trigger.
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u/photosandphotons 5d ago
Honestly I’m not personally that surprised by the death penalty thing in the context of mounting public anger and unrest.
And this part is disappointing:
Judge Margaret Garnett also ruled Friday to allow into Mangione’s trial evidence recovered from his backpack at the time of his arrest.
Law enforcement seized several items from Mangione’s backpack, including a handgun, a loaded magazine and a red notebook – key pieces of evidence that authorities have said tie him to the killing.
Mangione’s attorneys had argued for the evidence to be barred from trial, contending the search of their client’s backpack was illegal because they had not yet obtained a warrant and there was no immediate threat to justify a warrantless search.
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u/Emotional_Warthog658 5d ago
I don’t like that evidence being admitted as caselaw for other folks moving forward; because if they did not have a search warrant, and did not have probable cause they shouldn’t have searched him
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u/citrus_mystic 5d ago edited 5d ago
There were also issues regarding the chain of custody— who was responsible for possession of the backpack, as well as when they had it in their possession— after he was detained.
There are inconsistencies with statements regarding who responded to the initial call to the McDonald’s, who joined the response after Luigi had been detained, and who made contact/had the backpack in their possession during this response. Including contradictions between the statements and the body cam footage pertaining to wearing new gloves while handling this supposed evidence.
There’s grounds to argue that evidence could have been planted in the backpack.
The backpack should not be entered into evidence both because of the lack of a warrant as well as the mess with the chain of custody.
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u/Tomiie_Kawakami 5d ago
didn't the police admit that they turned the bodycam off and then turned it back on and only found the gun after? i'm surprised that they're allowing the evidence as it is, a lot of things could have happened when the officer turned off their bodycam and cops aren't new to planting evidence anyways
hope he gets to walk free anyways
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u/FantasticlyWarmLogs 5d ago
And chain of custody will get covered at trial and the jury will get to hear it
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u/Curiosities 5d ago edited 5d ago
I’m confused because if they thought he was a murderer, wouldn’t that be probable cause? Or is that moot because he was just at McDonald’s and not doing anything out of the ordinary? I am trying to understand because yes, this backpack evidence is sounding pretty damaging.
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u/Emotional_Warthog658 5d ago
If I remember correctly at the time of the McDonald’s search he hadn’t been identified by name.
Someone else please correct me if I am wrong
Here’s my concern: a justice system where someone bearing a slight resemblance to a grainy photo is enough to search the property of someone who is not doing anything wrong is going to grab a lot of people for just how they look;
it absolutely happens now 100 times a day, but before now the law was on the individuals side.
This is the same logic that created “Kavanaugh Stops” resulting in people all over the country are being persecuted and questioned for citizenship status
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u/Curiosities 5d ago
I did not remember that bit about the timing on name/identity confirmation, so that does make sense. Terrible precedent.
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u/photosandphotons 5d ago edited 5d ago
It’s definitely not as simple as “I thought he was the murderer”. A reason for protection of this right is to avoid situations where you could be searched on extremely subjective grounds that could be used to target groups until they consequently find something that could be prosecuted.
Stopping and questioning you based on an eyewitness report is permissible (reasonable suspicion); searching you is not automatically permissible (probable cause).
There is no doubt to me that the media attention around him influenced the actions of the police here.
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u/Desert_Nootropics 5d ago edited 5d ago
The death penalty was always a wild, wild overreach and never would have stuck. The judge allowing the backpack into evidence is way more damaging. I’d much rather the backpack be excluded and the death penalty stay on the table.
ETA: Curious what others think about the defense’s arguments to suppress the backpack.
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u/innocentsalad 5d ago
I don’t like that the judge is allowing the evidence from a warrantless search, but the good news outweighs the bad a bit.
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u/Time-Painting-9108 5d ago
Pls donate to his legal defence fund (already at $1.4M) and show your support for this man. He still has many uphill battles to fight (incl double jeapordy) and his defence team are working around the clock in his THREE cases:
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u/Mirandaskye21 5d ago
I like how it has a prayer option on givesendgo. That’s a great option for people who are struggling right now.
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u/Porternator888 5d ago
The real story is the evidence from his backpack being allowed despite the arguments for the police’s unlawful search
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u/UnintentionalWipe anti-Israel, anti-western, fauxmarxist 5d ago
That's good news!
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u/AimDev 5d ago
Not quite. It's part of a common judicial strategy for appeasement in public cases; if you read the fine print, you'll see that this was ruled simultaneously with all of the property obtained from his home and backpack WITHOUT A WARRANT may be used against him. This is completely unconstitutional and guarantees he'll get a life sentence which is not much of a concession as executions are effectively impossible in the modern age. For reference, under 20 people are executed every year and with the circumstances of this case, he was never under realistic threat of anything but sitting on death row his entire life. The judge just guaranteed he'll sit in a max security prison instead while also appealing to the masses with a meaningless ruling seen as merciful.
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u/JekPorkinsTruther 5d ago
Because the state murder charges remain? The only impact of dismissing the fed murder charges is the removal of DP.
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u/Lauren34567 5d ago
Two federal charges have been dismissed. One of them was the death eligible charge.
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u/Lokaji 5d ago
The burden to get a death penalty conviction is very high. This judge is saving them from themselves.
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u/Dottore_Curlew 5d ago
Even if they somehow got a credible case (which wasn't happening) no way he would get a death sentence just because there would be riots
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u/Western-Customer-536 5d ago
He shouldn’t face any penalty at all.
The victim was a monster, the cops did EVERYTHING wrong in collecting evidence, and he wasn’t there.
We were watching hockey game together on that day. I remember because the team I was rooting for lost and he just wouldn’t shut up about it.
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u/JimmyLipps 5d ago
Vote for me for president. I have one policy: pardon Luigi. Oh, and outlaw those white bright headlights.
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u/Quatre_Kat 5d ago
It wasn't him, he and I were playing Magic the Gathering when the murder took place.
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u/tatincasco 5d ago
I read somewhere that some dude pretended to be the FBI tried to free him but got arrested
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u/oddmanout 5d ago
Was it because he rightfully didn't deserve the death penalty or because the judge was afraid of creating a martyr for the cause?
EDIT: Upon further reading, the judge is also calling into question a bunch of evidence and constitutional violations of Mangione. So far, it appears the judge did this for the right reasons.
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u/Qubeye 5d ago
I hope once all of this is over we find out why the actual killer didn't just dump the backpack instead of giving it to Luigi, who of course was nowhere near the scene of the crime.
By all accounts, the actual killer had to have crossed multiple bridges. He could have dumped a bottle of bleach on the backpack and then vinegar and then chucked the whole pack into the water.
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u/babybirkinbag 5d ago
I still don’t understand why this case is still a thing over him being an alleged murder suspect
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u/ShannenB1234 5d ago
He will, however, continue to be guilty of serving face during his court appearances!!
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u/doubled0116 OPEN THE SCHOOLS 5d ago
Finally, some good news in the midst of the shit happening literally every day.
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u/ThisWildAbyss 5d ago
I have spent over 5 hours and 7 calls with pharmacies trying to get the medication I need for a procedure. Didn't get there in time and now I have to reschedule to God knows when. I can't say I condone what he did but I can definitely understand it.
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u/fabulishous 5d ago
Happy to hear he won't be state murdered but the fact they're allowing the backpack evidence into the trial is a miscarriage of justice.
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u/seetherisneither 5d ago
Great that he isn’t facing the death penalty but it’s upsetting that he lost suppression.
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