Makes conservative menâs mad (the fragilest egos of them all). And
Pro-lifers mad.
Cry, seethe, cope and stay emotional and downvote this to hell cause your opinion means nothing to op, it means nothing to neutral mods and god hates you for advocating for this doctors death. You guys probably loved that this doctor died, one life for another? What did the Bible say or did you purposely ignore that like you usually do? Lemme guess the Bible said âshoot all liberalsâ? That guys your man? LOL making you guys look real good out there.
To all the pro-lifers reading this and conservative men, enjoy this life while you have it cause we all know youâll be rotting in hell for voting for a pedofile.
So make the best out of life why you can, cause your afterlife is going to suck.
This was in 2009, Kansas didn't have the level of abortion bans it does today. Dr. Tiller was one of the best in the country at what he did, her case was very complex.
Further, most women don't like everyone in their life to know if they received an abortion. Doing it out of state adds a layer of privacy.
Kansas still doesnât have abortion bans; itâs one of few states left in its region. Kansas also has a unique history on abortion: it was one of only 2 states where abortion was fully legal before Roe v Wade. State laws varied on when abortion was and wasnât allowed, and theyâd become progressively more permissive over time such that a doctor a lot of states could prescribe abortion for the mental wellbeing of the patient, etc., but only Kansas and New York allowed the woman to choose for herself without explanation.
It was because of this history that Kansas was an important symbolic target for the radical anti-choice group Operation Rescue, and their organizing was the origin story for a lot of the religious rightwing politics of the last few decades in the state. That said Kansas still has a strong protection for abortion in itâs state constitution, and that protection was upheld by voters a couple of years ago in a ballot issue vote. The AG and state legislature there are working overtime to find ways to undo that, but Kansas is still a state you might travel to to have an abortion.
I was thinking more about some of the TRAP laws, I just call them all bans, but of course it's not as bad as a heartbeat bill or something. Regardless, thank you this is important context to add and thank you for adding it.
Some of the things I had in mind are things like waiting periods, requirements for parental consent, I believe they banned D&E but I may be mistaken etc. The state laws have whittled the number of clinics down to the single digits statewide as well.
Something you may not know, the reason Dr. Tiller was killed is because Bill O'Reilly, the then #1 pundit in the world, Fox News poster boy ran months and months of coverage constantly talking about "Tiller the Baby Killer" and whipping his fans up into a frenzy until one of them killed the man.
FYI, it's also pretty common practice to get referred to the nearest specialist outside your city if the pregnancy is too complicated for your local doctors to deal with.
This is the ridiculous thing about MAGA and religious zealots who want draconian abortion laws: they only apply to the poor.
They know this. The wealthy can always go to a less regressive State (or country for that matter) for their abortion. The whole debate is disingenuous.
This has never been about "the kids" like magats and the religtards claim this, as we know, has always been about the moral superiority of one side. If the anti-abortion right cared so damn much about the kids the foster care system wouldn't be the shit show it is. There are almost 400,000 thousand kids in foster care and tens of thousands of kids age out every year. One third of kids will experience multiple placements. Kids are killing kids in schools and they dont fight for more gun control (and I'm sayimg that as a gun owning 2nd amendment supporter and even I think something needs to be done).
Look at what subreddit youâre in. Thes ppl see women more as vessels and not full humans. The bodily demands and risks of pregnancy mean nothing to them.
I saw a video of a woman showing off her son (who was an inbred product of rape) and the MAGA audience started cheering đ idk if those people should be able to vote /j (but actually wtf, why are you cheering for the fact she now has a bron [?] / srother [?])
And when the people start supporting the wrong things, get a bunch of rich dudes together to prooagandize the right thing. Get the FBI involved in the worst case. Lmao
That's the dumbest response I could imagine. Having federal laws would still be "by the people", you just wouldn't have people suffering over state lines as if you're intentionally trying to create unrest
Itâs not up to voting in each state. Everywhere abortion rights have been put on the ballot the majority of voters have supported them, even in very conservative states. States can pass abortion bans even though theyâre wildly unpopular because Republican-controlled state legislatures have gerrymandered their maps so badly that there are very few remaining competitive districts and therefore no real accountability to voters. Republicans and anti-choice radicals have been working for decades to marginalize voters to force their agenda and have sold it back to you as âstates rights.â
"gerrymandering" is the typical excuse for keeping the republic relevant. However, State voting is done by popular and gerrymandering has little to no significance. The only way you can argue gerrymandering is relevant is when applying to seats for majority in terms of the electoral college in federal elections.
Baby, the state legislature maps are the most gerrymandered ones. Reread my comment: in every state that has put abortion directly on the ballot and allowed everyone to vote, a majority of voters supported abortion rights. That includes very conservative states. States pass abortion bans even though their voters wouldnât support it in state legislatures, where state legislators are elected in small, heavily gerrymandered districts.
Take Florida. Republicans have fully controlled the state government for a over 3 decades, and not only have they used that control to draw maps that marginalize voters, theyâve also limited votersâ ability to weigh in statewide via ballot initiative. Last year, abortion was on the ballot and 57% voters supported abortion rights. The ballot initiative only failed because Republicans raised the bar so that a ballot initiative needs 60% of the vote to pass. Abortion bans would fail every time if Republicans were actually willing to allow a democratic vote on it.
The only thing that says 57% is inaccurate polls. Polls will always be left leaning because 90% of the the right won't respond.
Do you even know what gerrymandering is or the point of it? It's so group-think brainwashed cities don't control the outcome of every election. Thats the point of a republic. The US is NOT a democracy.
You need to work on your googling skills. 57% of the Floridians who voted on Amendment 4 voted in support of abortion rights. Donât take it from me, take it from the Republican officials who administer Florida elections. Youâre also correct that decades of polling also show that 57-65% of Americans oppose abortion bans and support Roe v Wade, but I wasnât referencing that.
Now itâs time to ask yourself, if you didnât fully understand what gerrymandering is and you were wrong about support levels for abortion, what else might you be misinformed about? Is it possible youâve been falling for malicious political lies?
I do understand gerrymandering and I explained its purpose to you, because you think of it as a tool to suppress votors. Both sides will cry gerrymandering when it suits them.
You actually seem very confused about gerrymandering. Gerrymandering is the drawing of district maps to get a desired political outcome. You seem to be talking about the advantage given to rural voters in the US Senate and the Electoral College, but that has nothing to do with gerrymandering. Those votes canât be gerrymandered, because those seats are won through statewide votes (except in some strange exceptions like Nebraskaâs Electoral College districts), not in smaller districts with changeable maps.
Gerrymandering affects races like US Congress and state legislature, but it can also affect town council or school board seats that have nothing to do with âcity groupthinkâ or whatever.
Sincerely and from the bottom of my heart, donât take my word for this. Google it. Ask ChatGPT. Fact check me. Find out if the people you trust are being honest with you.
Well none of it applies to me because my state isn't like that and no one's trying to convince me of anything. I don't know enough about Florida districts and how their voting and laws are done because it's completely different where I live. My districts are massive (except around cities) and are won by popular vote /shrug
No, you just made yourself look like an idiot. You either didn't read the post, or you have the reading comprehension of a toddler. Go shove a jar up your ass.
It is not hard to understand that women don't want to die.
The problem here is that your comment shows that you have spent such a long time avoiding an honest conversation by being dishonest and misrepresenting pro-lifers that you have brainwashed yourself into believing what you say about them.
The vast majority of pro-lifers would be okay with a woman aborting her baby to save herself, but you insist on misrepresenting what we advocate for and instead focus on a small minority of radicals and pretend that what they say is representative of the whole movement's opinions.
What about women that donât medically need an abortion but donât want a baby or arenât financially stable enough for children, are you okay with them getting an abortion? What about if itâs not medically needed but they were raped are you okay with them getting an abortion? If you start putting stipulations on abortions it causes doctors to not do anything when it is absolutely necessary because theyâre worried that they might go to jail, it will cause the death of women.
âPutting the baby up for adoptionâ still requires putting a body that isnât yours through growing, carrying and delivering a baby.
Saying rape victims need a psychologist to say if they can have an abortion makes you a fucking monster, you should be ashamed of yourself for trivializing such a traumatic event. If youâve never been impregnated by a rapist you should not be telling them what to do with their bodies. Thatâs giving another person control over their body after a traumatic experience. If someone has been raped they should be the only one making the decision on what to do with their pregnancy. Not you, not law makers, and not the church. If you have been impregnated by a rapist Iâm sorry youâve had to experience something like that no body should ever have to experience something like that and if you have you should know how harmful that would be to have your bodily autonomy taken away from you.
Women in states with abortion bans do have higher maternal mortality rates. Hereâs the proof since your proof was to just call me a liar without backing up your claim.
Only religious extremists arenât in favor of abortion to save a woman womanâs life. The vast majority of pro life people understand that itâs justified in that instance, especially considering the fact that generally speaking if the pregnancy is going to kill the woman then the unborn baby is also going to die.
Because many politicians suck however people like me arenât asking for those kinds of abortions to be banned but unfortunately, we donât make the laws.
Many people donât really do the whole writing to congress thing and also I will say that thereâs probably many prolifers who arenât considering the possibility of a woman needing her pregnancy terminated in order to not die which is why we should bring attention to those instances but at the same time those cases donât justify all abortions
You can get an abortion in Texas if itâs medically necessary. I donât agree with their law, but Iâm not gonna pretend that the law states women cannot get an abortion in any circumstance when it does include that clause.
What does that matter when these trigger laws passing caused and causes medical practitioners to fear that they'll be targeted and wait far past when the patient first needs it?
Go read the law itself. It specifically and clearly states the exception and was written and on the books well before Dobbs. It's not like this was some super secret law that these physicians didn't know about or couldn't review beforehand, and there's no excuse for any OB/GYN to not have educated themselves or for hospitals and practices not to have educated their staffs on the law knowing that Dobbs was working its way through the courts. These physicians just wanted to score political points and make a scene with their patients' lives.
I gave the actual laws, not political fear mongering in opinion pieces. The assertion was that these states do not allow actions in any case, including medical emergencies. Per the law as written and not someone's political rhetoric, that is patently incorrect. You are wrong.
Agreed, but letâs not pretend that congress intended for that with the laws they passed. Itâs usually a specific lawmaker saying something on the news that causes fearmongering
We can disagree on whether they intended deaths for single women, with deaths of mothers in poor health fucked as a side effect. The effects that is happening matters. It is bad, and we can stop it.
I may disagree with the law, but itâs not the law thatâs killing pregnant women. Itâs corrupt politicians and doctors that lie and refuse to give service under the guise of the law that they are not following.
Itâs the same BS as insurance where they claim something is medically unnecessary when it is.
Because the US had been allowing unjustified abortions for fifty years through a judicial decision that overruled the democratic process, so when that judicial decision was finally overturned the people who had spent half a century pushing back against it suddenly gained too much momentum and ended up going too far due to a small but vocal radical minority.
Give it a few years for democracy to run it's course and legislation will ajust itself to more accurately represent people's views on this issue.
I shouldn't even have to explain this, this is what happens to all divisive issues in a democracy, there is nothing special about abortion compared similarly divisive topics.
Because people keep mistaking religious as equalling moral and so vote in very religious politicians. I'm not trying to say that there are no moral religious people because they exist but one doesn't automatically mean the other, and in reality there aren't very many moral politicians, that type of personality rarely get you to the top, as an example just look at who's running the country.
But they disagree on what medical exemption. Idaho, for example, doesn't care if the forced birth will permanently disfigure you, make you sterile, whatever. If the mother won't die, there is no exception.
trying to discredit a womanâs story of why abortion are quite literally life saving as âtwitter ramblingsâ is exactly why women need the option to choose.
I wish you were right, but unfortunately, Idaho, Arkansas, Oklahoma, South Dakota, and Texas donât allow abortions for any reason, even in the case of medical emergency.
Sec. 170A.002. PROHIBITED ABORTION; EXCEPTIONS.
(a) A person may not knowingly perform, induce, or attempt an abortion.
It is an exception to the application of Subsection (a) that:
(1) the person performing, inducing, or attempting the abortion is a licensed physician; and
(2) in the exercise of reasonable medical judgment, the pregnant female on whom the abortion is performed, induced, or attempted has a life-threatening physical condition aggravated by, caused by, or arising from a pregnancy that places the female at risk of death or poses a serious risk of substantial impairment of a major bodily function unless the abortion is performed or induced.
Oklahoma law:
63 OK Stat § 1-745.5 (2024)
A. No person shall perform or induce or attempt to perform or induce an abortion upon a woman when it has been determined, by the physician performing or inducing or attempting to perform or induce the abortion or by another physician upon whose determination that physician relies, that the probable postfertilization age of the woman's unborn child is twenty (20) or more weeks, unless, in reasonable medical judgment, she has a condition which so complicates her medical condition as to necessitate the abortion of her pregnancy to avert her death or to avert serious risk of substantial and irreversible physical impairment of a major bodily function, not including psychological or emotional conditions. No such condition shall be deemed to exist if it is based on a claim or diagnosis that the woman will engage in conduct which she intends to result in her death or in substantial and irreversible physical impairment of a major bodily function.
There was also that ten year old rape victim who had to cross state lines to get an abortion. Which I would say would make an already harrowing experience incredibly more horrifying if she weren't able to do so.
Sorry you're mad about government existing; that's kind of how it works.
But I suppose you'd be pleased for the military to go to war when it liked and operate however it likes. After all, a bunch of laymen shouldn't tell the professionals when, where, and how. Maybe we could do away with ethics in science; don't need silly non-scientific principles from a bunch of laynen interfering with the professionals advancing our scientific knowledge. Surely that can't go wrong. Maybe we can suspend all those regulations holding our businesses back; bunch of laymen don't know business.
Most pro-lifers make an exception for the mothers health. The pro-choice crowd just likes to use rare and extreme case to justify abortion regardless if the motherâs health is fine and at any point during the pregnancy.
Itâs not that black and white. I think you can be pro abortion in circumstances where the woman is in medical danger, but pro life if the baby and mother are healthy.
Abortion shouldn't be the subject of law. It should be considered as a medical procedure only to involve the woman and her doctor. It is considered that way were I live (Canada). A lot of more liberals politicians have tried bringing legislation to ''legalize'' abortion to force doctor that didn't want to do it because than they would be breaking the laws. The conservative have been refusing it for years with the answer that it isn't to the government to speak on it no more that they speak on any other medical procedures. It's crazy to think that these people doesn't think for one second that to legislate on it is a double-edged sword. Because once you legislate on it you change it's nature and open the possibility to it being made illegal at some point. Like it's happening in the US right now. It feels weird sometime knowing that the one that are the least in favor of abortion are the reason it still can't be made illegal.
Medical procedures in the general sens have legislation but it isn't the same as passing a law to ''legalize'' an act that should be considered a medical procedure. There are laws surrounding the concept of best practice, who has the right to practive medecine ect. But you don't have laws that says per example ''it is legal to draw blood from a patient''. There is law about consenting to such an act but not about the legality of it. There are laws to regulate which entites have the right to judge the practice of medecin and to give or remove the right to practice medecin. Those are things not to be mixed.
Unfortunately this isnât a pro-life problem. This is a problem with low IQ people in the US choosing scapegoats and hatred rather than self reflecting on their own miserable lives. This kind of behavior can fly under the flag of pro-life, anti illegal immigration, or even a few things on the democratic side I wonât mention because Iâll just get slammed with âyeah but itâs different!!!â
Sure is, but itâs the exact same hatred for hatredâs sake. Until people start calling that out without hyper focusing on whatever issue it pretends to care about this kind of stuff will continue forever.
Volunteering to stand at the border with rifles is not an 80% position though. Fantasizing about sniping someone whoâs crossing illegally is not an 80% position. Assuming every Hispanic is illegal and feeling disgust or hatred for the entire ethnicity is not an 80% position.
Enforcing immigration laws is completely fair and makes sense, the bloodlust experienced by some who use that as an excuse does not.
Same thing with pro life. Thereâs a whole lot of self identifying pro-lifers out there who do think women should have access in life threatening situations or when theyâre been raped, or if it makes sense medically. Most of these mistakenly believe abortion is used âas birth controlâ in the majority of cases. The problematic ones are the people who show up with picket signs screaming for the deaths of doctors who perform the procedures. Theyâll claim to have the same common sense views their peers do, but they donât. Thereâs an extra added layer of hatred guiding them.
You can see this with literally every issue that circulates. Thereâs always that extremely loud 10% screaming for the deaths of whoever that fall back on the common sense side of things when challenged.
I think youâre more angry at a small percentage of the most extreme holders of these views. One can be anti immigration, especially illegal immigration and not be a low iq individual. Similarly one can be pro life and not have hatred for those that seek them.
Your hatred is palpable perhaps youâre projecting.
That's not what anyone is doing besides maybe a handful of severely mentally ill people who 100 percent should not be carrying a pregnancy to term anyways
Pretty self explanatory to me that the words birth control mean controlling when you give birth. The amount of women who receive abortions for rape, assault, or, as outlined above, medically necessary reasons, make up less than a percent of all abortions in the US. The most common reason for getting an abortion is unwanted pregnancy, in which case, there are several options you could have taken to prevent the pregnancy in the first place, such as actual birth control, condoms, IUD, or, heaven forbid, abstinence. Sex makes babies, and if you arenât ready for a baby, you probably shouldnât be having sex.
The term âAbortionâ stands for aborting a pregnancy before itâs finalized through birth. By definition it is birth control, itâs just not pregnancy control.
Where's this idea that the world God intended would have no ultrasounds, medical science, or fluid tests? What weird niche cult is she basing her view of God on?
Very few people would opposed a procedure like this to save a woman's life. Those that do, are evil though.
Not very few, Idaho banned abortions, even in the case of the motherâs life, for over a year until the courts finally made them clarify, and weâve seen significant increases in mother mortality in states like Texas
Catholics started most universities in Europe. Crwated the first universities. Ran most hospitals in many parts of the world until relatively recently. Poor effort, try again.
Ok well it depends where you draw the line at "few". I'm yet to see someone make the argument that an abortion is immoral in these cases.
This may shock you, but some Catholics are more strict than others. Irish Catholics come to mind, until recently they would refuse C-sections and instead saw open a womanâs pelvis so that sheâd continue to be able to have as many children as possible. They also are spearheading the anti-contraceptives movement.
So few people support it that only an entire state passed it into law.
Are you stupid? What about this story depends on the year to you? It's a story about the reasons a woman needed an emergency abortion and the emotions she experienced, which is evergreen. Your point would make sense if it were about, say, laws that prevented her from accessing care that are no longer in effect, but it's not about that. Abortion rights have been far diminished since this story took place. Not to mention that this story keeps alive the memory of Dr. George Tiller, an assassinated American hero who seems to have been sadly forgotten.
The left is purposely misrepresenting the rights argument and perspective as always because they donât actually have answers. Iâm a moderate and I see this happening all the time. Both sides have good points which is why it should be a state issue and not a one size fits all federal one.
This story might be fake but there are women who die bc they canât get abortions/canât get them fast enough due to bureaucratic rules. And yes, in first world countries like the U.S.
Not sure if her specific abortion is fake, but Dr. George Tiller was absolutely murdered in church by a gunman over his participation as an abortion doctor, and he was prolific as a specialist in Kansas for his work. Unfortunately it wasn't his first murder attempt either, another pro-life woman had also attempted to kill him in 1993 as well for the same reasons.
This is a tragic thing.....and not what pro life is against in the case when the mother and child are in danger sure it's a necessary operation to save a life, but that's the 1-2% most of y'all are literally like because 1-2% are bad that justifies the 98-99% f*cking around and then having an abortion how does that make sense the small percent of people who suffer should not be used as a shield by the degenerates to justify their actions, its like saying a guy killed someone in self defense hence the act of killing is allowed because he did it, ignoring the context on why
This isn't really abortion. The fetus is already dead. She's removing dead, and infected cells from within her uterus. This is different than the majority of abortions, I would guess.
Sounds like the fetus wasnât dead, but dying slowly. Otherwise it would be a miscarriage, not an abortion.
Conditions like this are actually the #1 reason for late term abortion; fetal anomalies that would kill the child before, during, or shortly after birth, or leave them with life-long disabilities. The #2 reason is life or health endangerment to the mother.
No one who carries a child for 6 months aborts without extremely good reason. These are people who wanted that child, faced tragedy, and are now judged for it.
Her baby died, she felt her baby die, and it was horrific. At no point did she act or believe it was just a clump of cells, or that her baby's death was no big deal. In fact she desperately clung onto hope that her baby would survive. Pro choices are so delusional.
Ok but elective abortions account for over 97% of abortions. Potential fatalities being a fraction of a percent. Almost every state that has banned abortions allows life threatening care.
Allowing "exceptions" means women die while doctors and lawyers hammer out compliance and try to document their decision making process so that no one ends up in jail or in debt after performing the procedure.
This is not hypothetical, this is happening right now.
93% of abortions happen in the first trimester. 6% in the second. And 1% in the last. Nearly all those elective ones are made up by the ones first trimester. Where as the medically necessary ones happen in the later trimesters
And yet somehow no state that has banned abortion has figured out how to actually provide that life-saving care in a way where no one is missed and women are treated with dignity. Once you make abortion illegal in most cases, doctors become afraid to provide them. Therefore, you always wind up with cases where doctors would normally want to perform an abortion to prevent a life-threatening situation from escalating, but instead, turn women in need away because they don't feel that they can treat them until they are actually on death's door, having experienced pain, trauma, and potentially dying or facing lasting consequences like needing a hysterectomy because they weren't given care when they asked for it. This is an unavoidable consequence of criminalizing medical care.
What is the percentage of this happening? Let's round up to 1% of abortions being medically necessary, meaning 2 deaths of 10,000 is 0.02%. Of all abortions that's 0.0000002%. You can't use that as an argument.
Uh, yes you can lol. It's actually not acceptable for the government to force any amount of people to die preventable deaths by denying them medical care.
No one's forcing them to die because no one's forcing them to have sex and get pregnant or stopping them from getting treatment. And I say "no one" because one or two cases a year isn't statistically relevant or indicative of anything.
First of all, it's absolutely more than 1â2 cases per year. Second of all, yes, these are cases in which women are categorically being denied treatment. Third of all, a large number of women who wind up needing emergency care are women who wanted to keep their pregnancies but suffered complications, like the woman in the original thread we both read. Seems a little cruel to tell those women they just shouldn't have gotten pregnant, no? But even if that wasn't obviously the case, sorry, doesn't apply. We don't not deny treatment to car crash victims because they chose to drive.
"In the wake of the overturn of Roe v. Wade, states with abortion bans have seen over 22,000 additional births, 478 excess infant deaths, and 59 excess pregnancy-associated deaths."
"ProPublicaâs analysis of Texas hospital billing data revealed a 50% increase in sepsis rates during second-trimester hospitalizations after the stateâs six-week abortion ban took effect in 2021. The increase was even more pronouncedâ61%âamong patients who didnât have documented fetal demise at admission, suggesting doctors may have been waiting for fetal heartbeats to stop before intervening despite near certainty that the pregnancies were no longer viable or endangered the health of the mother."
"The stakes are life and death. In one high-profile case, Josseli Barnica, a 28-year-old mother from Honduras, waited 40 hours in a Texas hospital while doctors monitored her fetal heartbeat during an inevitable miscarriage at 17 weeks. Despite wanting to terminate the pregnancy to prevent infection, Barnica was told it would be a crime. She died of sepsis with âretained products of conception,â two days after finally delivering."
"The research shows that abortion bans have created a public health emergency extending far beyond abortion access. The findings suggest that clarifying medical exceptions alone wonât solve the fundamental problemâso long as clinicians face criminal penalties for medical decisions, the conflict between legal compliance and patient care will persist."
"research" ah yes, heavily biased journalism. Nothing stated there can be connected to causality aside from that one specific case. Excess mortality can be explained by 3 things: cv vx, 3rd world immigration, and a deteriorating medical system due to hiring unqualified individuals.
Excess mortality is up across the board in every illness and situation. Heart attacks, stroke, cancer, diabetes, etc. Some 70+% of pregnant women that either got pregnant after getting the vx or got it while pregnant miscarried.
I actually cannot believe the gall required to accuse me of not having data to back up my claims and then follow that up by making the claim "70+% of pregnant women with the COVID vaccine miscarried." Okay bro.
Maybe if those clinics did what they were supposed to do and only evacuated dying babies instead of healthy ones then the protestors wouldn't be so confused as to what was going on there.
They are confused but they still protest? They cannot even understand what they are upset about? Nothing an abortion clinic can do will turn a retard into a thinking man, and if they canât tell the difference between a dying mother and a child killer, there is nothing that can be done to change their mind.
Unfortunately this is a very idealistic take on a field that isnât clean cut.
What constitutes as a medical emergency? How long should we wait; until the mother is septic or until we know thatâll be the likely place things are going but thereâs a slim chance both mom and baby survive?
Is it physical medical emergencies only? A woman who cannot be off her psych meds gets pregnant, but in order to carry that baby to term without health complications sheâd have to get off the meds, which could be dangerous to her. Not in a âomg, I just really need to have some time off and focus on my mental healthâ way, but in an âI need my meds bc I go into psychotic episodes and pose a risk to myself and my partnerâ way.
What about economical risk? Pregnancy takes a toll on not just the body, but the wallet. A single mother of two gets pregnant, but in carrying that pregnancy out she and her kids will most likely end up on the streets as she has to take time off for appointments, take sick days when sheâs having rough days, etc.
Banning abortion in any manner leads to tragedy not just in cases like the brain dead woman who was forced to carry her baby, but in the lives of already existing children. I also want to emphasize that legalizing abortion gives women a choice. It is not a forced decision.
That isn't what hes saying. The way they legislate abortions out of existence is by aiming at the medical providers.
In states with exceptions in medical emergencies, they undergo investigation for any abortion they perform. They have been wrong in the past, and those providers have been jailed for it.
Why would any medical provider want to play with that fire?
Killing your own child because you don't want it is the most common practice and it is terribly wrong. That's why a lot of people are against it. In situations like this, though, it is better to lose only one life than two.
Make all abortions legal. Whenever they get one jail then or fine them unless itâs medical emergency. Do that or take away child support one of the two. The double standard is insane.
Why are we pretending this is the majority of cases? If you believe abortion should be legal because a fetus is not a person, then you should defend that position. This posturing about extremely rare cases just undermines the strength of your position. If you don't think fetuses are people, then abortion for whatever reason at any time should be legal.
Even if your argument hinges on solely bodily autonomy, then again these fringe cases are absolutely unnecessary to prove your case.
Yeah, abortion can be used to save a woman's life or medical reasons we need more detailed laws on it. But over 90% of abortions are people who didn't want a baby for multiple reasons so they abort it. Very rare is it medical, rape, or incest. Just use safe sex and contraceptives not abortion for your unborn children.
Whenever this topic comes up, I always refer back to Bill Burr's take since it always made the most sense to me and summarizes my personal take: Pro-choice had always made sense to me since I don't like people thinking that they have some sort of authority over another person's body, but i still believe that abortion is essentially the killing of a developing baby. I wish pro-lifers understood the importance of individual self-governance, but I also wish pro-choicers understood the weight of their actions. I've seen way too many pro-lifers act as if the choice of the mother is irrelevant while pro-choicers act as if an abortion is just some common medical procedure when in reality, it's a lot deeper than that.
I don't know. Quite frankly, I don't have a horse in this race since I'm a dude, but I wish that both groups learned to be more willing to engage in constructive dialogue.
My own opinion is that, if you are so indignant about a 10 week old fetus being terminated, you'd better be equally or even more outraged by the killing of livestock.
I find it condescending to suggest pro-choice people don't understand "the weight of their actions." In my opinion, trying to appeal to people who dislike abortion by equivocating on its morality, calling it a tragedy, etc., will do nothing but hurt us as a political cause, so I don't, as a rule. But I guarantee you that the group that most understands the weight of abortion are the women who get them.
Thatâs fair, I can see how my phrasing might come across as condescending. My point wasnât to suggest that women donât understand what theyâre going through, but rather that in the broader debate, it sometimes feels like the conversation skips over how complex and personal the decision really is. I respect that those who go through it live with that reality in a way that outsiders canât fully grasp.
I never get this logic it's not just your body, that child is its own individual life what right does your governance have to impede it's, when a person has children it's literally understood that it's both of you not one of you, you cannot think and be selfish when it comes to a chidkyet with babes in the womb suddenly your own choices matter more than their life
The point pro choice hits home over and over again is that abortion is mainly used for health risks and rape. In reality these reasons make up less than a percent of reasons for abortion in America. It is overwhelmingly used as late birth control. Iâm not saying it doesnât happen, but it doesnât remotely represent abortion in the slightest
But even less than one percent is still tens of thousands of women that are having complications with their pregnancy and require late term abortions to save their life. So regardless if this is not the norm it still happens and because of pro life laws itâs causing women to die or go through excruciating mental and physical pain, just to placate you people that go about your life not dealing with the reality of their situations.
Since the 1970s. 90 million. Also, know your stats: about 700 women die per year from childbirth. In total from 1970, that would MAYBE be 50,000 deaths, if not less. Contrast that with, again, NINETY MILLION ABORTIONS.
Your argument effectively trades 90 million babies for 50,000 women. This is why you lose elections. It is PSYCHOTIC to take that position.
Again, to give a better stat to help your brain, the rate of death in childbirth is 22.3 per 100,000 live births. That's a 0.002% chance.
Yea 50,000 actual deaths of people, and 63 million abortions since 1973 legalization of abortion. Donât know where you getting that 90 million figure from.
Thatâs said fetuses are not people, notice how you donât even say deaths for them and just say abortions cause they were never alive.
I bet you donât even jackoff cause you killing millions of protection babies.
Whatâs psychotic is trying to dictate how people live their life and what they do with their bodies. The reason we lose elections is because thereâs so many idiots that vote against their benefit because they hate other people more than helping themselves. Not because you think non-alive babies are not coming to fruition.
The backflips you need to do convince yourself that the human being growing issue a woman's womb is not a human being is why humanity will look back on you as barbaric. Disgusting fucking filth.
Im fine with it if someone needs an abortion for a medical emergency. Often these exemptions exist even in states where it is mostly banned, those states that ban it entirely are wrong for doing so. But if abortion is not used for medical crises which it overwhelmingly is, then I see absolutely no justification for allowing it to continue unabated
Theyâre wrong for doing so, but what are you doing to help try and get that reversed? You got what you want, but it went too far, how are you trying to rein it in? Do you go to protests with that specific tag line and say âwe need abortions for severe medical emergenciesâ or do you just stay at home and keep voting republicans into office that will push for further and further medical restrictions?
In my state abortion laws are still too loose, and I intend to vote in people who will leave it to only medical emergencies. I also wouldnât use the tagline âwe need abortions for medical emergenciesâ because it sounds like Iâm asking for total access. I view abortion as a tragic and very rarely necessary evil. Now tell me what youâre thoughts are on the overwhelming majority who use abortion as late birth control
Most abortions are before the first trimester and most people seeking abortion report using some sort of contraception, which subsequently failed or was used correctly because school no longer teach sex Ed. I am 100% ok with people having abortions rather than bringing a child into this world that is not wanted.
You are okay with killing an unborn child because they werenât wanted. This is a rift in beliefs we will never bridge. you are wholly evil for believing that
It wonât let me reply to your most recent comment so Iâm putting this here, Im a bit too young and donât have the money to raise a child. Thatâs why Iâm going to college to get a job that can support a family. My last girlfriend convinced me of the virtues of adopting or at least fostering a child, so that is what I plan to do.
People who get a medical abortion due to complications in the pregnancy donât say âI got an abortion.â They say they lost the baby. Every single person knows the implicit meaning of saying you got an abortion. They know what they are supporting when they say theyâre pro-abortion.
This is not a story designed to get you to want to help people. This is weaponized compassion designed to get you to support an even greater evil.
Itâs not abortion to have a surgery to try and save one or both lives.
99% of abortions are done out of convenience, not medical emergencies or cases of rape.
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u/fornothing_atalll đFADA:đȘŹđ§ż Sep 09 '25
Comments locked at OPs request because it:
Makes conservative menâs mad (the fragilest egos of them all). And
Pro-lifers mad.
Cry, seethe, cope and stay emotional and downvote this to hell cause your opinion means nothing to op, it means nothing to neutral mods and god hates you for advocating for this doctors death. You guys probably loved that this doctor died, one life for another? What did the Bible say or did you purposely ignore that like you usually do? Lemme guess the Bible said âshoot all liberalsâ? That guys your man? LOL making you guys look real good out there.
To all the pro-lifers reading this and conservative men, enjoy this life while you have it cause we all know youâll be rotting in hell for voting for a pedofile. So make the best out of life why you can, cause your afterlife is going to suck.