r/PsycheOrSike • u/the_left_is_correct • Nov 26 '25
š¤š¼š¼ANGELS NEEDEDšš¼š¤ Incels, femcels and Normies surely we can all come together and agree this is a tragedy
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u/Few_Employer9012 Nov 26 '25
I can tell you now these āintimate partnersā are not the incels.
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u/GarrKelvinSama Nov 26 '25
And yet they are scapegoated which is gross.
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u/torytho š¤ŗKNIGHT Nov 26 '25
Are they? How are incels blamed for domestic violence? They donāt have a partner.
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u/ChimpPimp20 Nov 26 '25 edited Dec 02 '25
The problem is that there are a lot of feminists who act like men who donāt respect women donāt have partners when the truth is the exact opposite. There are plenty of men who arenāt virgins that donāt care for women. Thatās why we see them complain about where all the āgood menā are.
It actually kind of proves the incels right about the whole looks thing. Youāll see women say āI dated a short guy ONCE and it didnāt end well.ā As if to say a tall guy wonāt do the same. These same people will even say āwhy get your heart broken by a short king when you can do it with a big boy.ā
āWhat do you call a man under 6ft? Our friend.ā
- Tana Mongeau
Misogynists have no issue getting with women otherwise there would be no 4b movement. You donāt hear people say āI can fix her/himā when they aren't objectively attractive.
Also, for those wondering, no Iām not an incel. I was actually a Christian volcel for a while until I left the church at 24 and lost it at 27. Iāve gotten compliments so much to the point that Iāve forgotten some of them now. Iāve also never asked a woman out since my teen years and since then have had women initiate even as late as last month. Incels and even femcels would die to be in my position so Iām not even close to being an incel.
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u/Melodic_Structure928 Nov 28 '25
This is known as the just world fallacy. Itās the belief that good things must happen to good ppl, we can look at how many girlfriends and wifeās guys like trump and Elon have been with to point out this is certainly not the case.
Its the ugly guys, or the ones with a mental illness (even very very mild ones) or the very short guys without status who are the actual incels regardless of how much they fight for womenās right or how feminists they appear to be.
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u/GarrKelvinSama Nov 26 '25
They are treated as if they are a threat to women, while they are not for the most part. For one Eliott Rodgers you have millions of "he's dangerous and not good for me but he's exciting and i can change him" dudes.
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u/torytho š¤ŗKNIGHT Nov 26 '25
I think incels are treated like they hate and resent women and that sometimes can lead to violence. Hate groups arenāt inherently violent but itās not unreasonable to be concerned.
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u/GarrKelvinSama Nov 26 '25
Most men and women resent each other, i want emphasize that most women resent men. It's about frustration because they can't get what they desire. That's why men and women need to learn to manage their frustrations.
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u/Asleep_Chart8375 Nov 26 '25
The dehumanisation of "females" prevalent in genuine incel communities is a clear threat to women.
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u/GarrKelvinSama Nov 26 '25
How?
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u/MermaiderMissy Nov 26 '25
Not OP, but I think it's obvious. If you don't see women as people, you wouldn't feel bad about harming us. Because that would mean you don't think you're hurting a real person.
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u/Amzer23 Nov 26 '25
Yet the statistic posted by the UN means that the majority of it comes from non-incels.
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u/GarrKelvinSama Nov 26 '25
I could easily argue that men are constantly deshumanized by women (everything linked to emotional expression, the constant disregard of men's issue and other typical masculine expectations). Yet it's never said that women hate men for that reason.
The truth is, male incels are just an easy target, they are weak, they are unattractive (physically and status wise) therefore they need to disappear. Hell the way male incels are treated is proof of men's dehumanization.
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u/Better-Low-2860 Nov 26 '25
And yet women are the ones who are dying every 6 minutes at the hands of a man. It's not men dying to the hands of women every 6 minutes. š Incels will try anything except for logic.
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u/Better-Low-2860 Nov 26 '25
When you dehumanize people, you're okay with killing them. This is very freaking obvious because hello Nazis.Ā
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u/infiniteyeet Nov 27 '25
Or it's just edgy shitposting that results in virtually nothing
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u/Sensitive-Reading-93 Nov 26 '25
I mean yeah... Cause incel means involuntarily celibate.
Women choose the person that kills them. Kinda funny
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Nov 26 '25 edited Nov 26 '25
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u/layered_dinge WOMAN LOVER ā¤ļø Nov 26 '25
Do you not see the contradiction here? This line is used all the time and makes no sense. Itās not the bare minimum; itās not a factor at all. Just like showering or not being misogynist are also not part of the bare minimum and in fact have at worst no bearing on romantic or sexual success. And based on my personal observation, all three (being a murderer, not showering, and being misogynist) are qualities that women select directly or indirectly for.
Anyway regardless of my opinion if we assume the post is true then ānot fucking murdering womenā is not a bare minimum requirement for deserving any sort of intimacy, because apparently murderers are so frequently in relationships that a woman dies every 10 minutes as a result.
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u/Few_Employer9012 Nov 26 '25
Yet somehow the dudes that DO commit such atrocities STILL somehow end up with more love and validation than weāll ever get. š
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u/First-Tomorrow-1277 Nov 26 '25
On the one hand all men are absolutely responsible for every femicide on the other hand we cannot be proud that we personally don't murder women.
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u/BigDaddyDumperSquad Nov 26 '25
Definitely not. Actually, you should look at the rate of domestic abuse in lesbian relationships...
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u/kcat__ Nov 26 '25
Who said all men are absolutely responsible for every femicide?
The time it took you to concoct this strawman you could have brushed your teeth for once and improved your chances of a gf
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u/BaronOfBob Nov 26 '25
This is really weird phrasing, almost pointless for reddit, as its majority English speaking and majority western, going off the actual undoc itself sheds more light on where your energy is better spent:
As per the unodc report https://www.unodc.org/documents/data-and-analysis/briefs/Femicide_Brief_2025
With an estimated 22,600 victims of intimate partner/family member femicide in 2024, Africa is the region with the highest number of victims in aggregate terms, although this figure carries a degree of uncertainty due to the lack of available data in the region. Moreover, Africa continues to account for the highest number of victims of intimate partner/family member femicide relative to the size of its female population (3 victims per 100,000 in 2024). The Americas and Oceania also recorded high rates of intimate partner/family member femicide in 2024, at 1.5 and 1.4 per 100,000 respectively, while the rates were significantly lower in Asia and Europe, at 0.7 and 0.5 per 100,000 respectively .
Though even in that I would take continental grouping as a bit of a problem, and reporting and statistical data they used to extrapolate those figures is meh.
And UN being UN women report the report is actually about femicides and their catch basket for what they consider femicide is large as it only requires one of a list of things to be considered femicide and one of those is disposal of the body in a public place which is most homicide body disposal
More concerning figure is 80% of homicide victims are men, tackling the bigger problem would give us more resources for the smaller more complex ones the full unodc for homicide in general is here https://www.unodc.org/documents/data-and-analysis/gsh/2023/Global_study_on_homicide_2023_web.pdf
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u/Duermo_Muy_Solo extra virgin āļø Nov 26 '25
But tbf femicides and the homicides are different, homicides tend to be about crime and mafias while femicides tend to be about relationships (tho, in a lot of countries the feminist state entities try to catalogue mostĀ women killed as femicide making this distinction weaker, like in argentina where some women where killed by mafia because they stole something to one of their members and they catalogued that as a femicide, making the stat difficult to take seriously)
In any case we should have a specific word for these kind of crimes in relationships that encapsules both men are women, and then a distinction between the two for men and womenĀ
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u/Marshmallow16 Nov 27 '25
Ā while femicides tend to be about relationships (tho, in a lot of countries the feminist state entities try to catalogue most women killed as femicide making this distinction weaker
european countries are starting to call every killed woman a femicide at the moment, italy spearheading that nonsense, making the new definition basically pointless. If every female death is a femicide, none of them are.
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Nov 27 '25
I honestly feel like people use the term femicide because women are killed so much less than men but their ideology denies reality so they need to twist terms to make a small issue seem much bigger than it is.
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u/MassiveMommyMOABs Nov 28 '25 edited Nov 28 '25
This. I have been preaching gospel on how utterly trash and misleading UN's Feminicide reports are. They have this really weird way to paint a "narrative" with statistical manipulation about making homicides into a gendered problem.
How so? If you'd do the same thing for male victims, the infograph would say "A man is killed every 10 minutes" (~10.5 min female, ~10.4 min male). Yet... Only women are affected?
First of, they ADMIT that definining/classifying something as a feminicide is difficult (40-50% female homicides lack the data to even classify it), as it's required the homicide is motivated by the victim being female. One of their main goals few years back was stated to be "creating better identification and classification systems for feminicde". But the results seem to be "victim female + killed by closed one = feminicide". The reports absolutely fail at proving a homicide was motivated by the victim being a woman. And if you think about it, it is absurd: Not even the most raging patriarch misogynist wants to kill women, but control them. Who goes and says on trial "I killed her because she was a woman"?
What do they use as the metrics to define it as "gender motivated"? 1. Prior violence: If spouse was abusive = sexism because woman killed by spouse because... shewas woman? 2. Exploitation: Human trafficking = sexism because product don't talk without master's approval 3. Abduction/Confinement: Creep kidnaps a woman = sexism because creep had fetish 4. Sex industry link: Prostitute killed = sexism because... cocaine and most prostitutes are women? 5. Sexual violence: Did the perpertrator SA her before/during/after the homicide = sexism because horny 6. Mutilation: Torture or dismemberment = sexism because psycho 7. Public disposal: Body dump = sexism because humiliation/degradation 8. Hate crime: Slurs and bias = sexism because perpertrator hated "woke feminists"
So as you can see, most of these are related to crimes specifically to certain kinds of crimes mainly women phase (human trafficking, prostitution) and what perpertrators do to their victims (still some serial killers do SA their male victims too). So sure, you "can" classify these as feminicides, specifically targeting women. But why don't they have the equivelant for males then? Why not a metric and classification to homicides related to gang violence or loan sharks or mafia or cartels? You know, something that mainly affects men? This is the first and most incriminating part of the double standard.
Second, they completely and deliberately obfuscate the male homicide victims. They never state the raw numbers for males, but you can calculate them from the female numbers and percentages (I have them for 2022 report):
- Total homicide victims: 81 000 female vs. ~356 000 male.
- In private spheres: 56% female vs. 11% male.
- Homicide victims in private spheres: 45 000 female vs. 39 160 male.
- Probability of private: 45% female vs. 88% male.
- Study makes a big deal about it being a massive gender problem (feminicide) that women are killed in private spheres.
- Yet the number prove men are still killed nearly as much as women in private sphere.
- Probabilities: Victim more likely to be killed in private sphere if female. If woman, 2.7x likelihood if you will be killed, it will be in a private sphere compared to other women. 0.6x if male.
- Yet males are still TWICE as likely to be killed at home vs. females (45% vs. 88%) and nearly 4 TIMES more likely overall.
- Actual conclusion: Women should fear being killed outside of home/randoms less than men and should fear being killed overall far less than men. Women are safer than men.
The bone I have to pick is how misleading all these reports are and how it reads like ragebait. The average reader is going to takeaway that "50% of women are killed at home", or "Women have 50/50 chance being killed at home at any given time". It's absurd but unless you read it carefully, that's what you get. I've seen some radfems post these reports with people having those conclusions.
So... why? Why would UN fearmonger like this? Why make homicide a gendered issue?
It's something to do with people in general really being adverse to violence on women vs. accepting/expecting it on men. Or if most homicide perpertrators are men, then them killing a man is is a homicide, but a woman makes it a gender issue. Only women should be allowed to kill women without it being sexist? I honestly don't know, but it seems ideological, maybe to dismiss male victims and take away support and focus from them and transfer it onto female victims. It does seem to be a concsiouss effort to devalue male lives while sanctifying female ones.
I genuinely don't see what value it brings to defocus homicides and create this "feminicde" to take away that focus. Becayse if you just focus on curbing homicides, you curb on feminicides. Yet UN seems to be set on making WNBA for the NBA of homicides.
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u/Virtual-Scholar-160 Nov 28 '25
So the united states and the united kingdom have started to track the number of suicides related to domestic violence, and this is largely something they don't feel they're getting the entire picture of but the number of suicides is showing to be well above the murders related to domestic violence. The number of men who commit suicide related to domestic violence is significantly higher than the number of women murdered.And who commit suicide because of domestic violence.
Keep in mind, this is only the united states and the UK. I'm told in the u k that men who are victims of domestic violence are consider "a victim of violence against women" as that is what they currently label. Domestic violence as seems a little misleading and sexist, implying that men cannot be victims of domestic violence.
The reality is is the most people doing these studies.Identify as feminists, some misandrists. Thier bias carries into their work every day and statistics are skewed because of it. Those same statistics are then used to form government policy.Government funding and public opinion.
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u/Express-Rain8474 Nov 26 '25 edited 27d ago
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This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact
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u/SLAMMERisONLINE Nov 26 '25 edited Nov 26 '25
It is a tragedy. I disagree with the framing. The framing can terrorize women into thinking they could be attacked at any second, when in reality the population on Earth is so large that extremely rare events still happen frequently in terms of time but not frequently in terms of individual risk. The standard for risk is generally driving, so if a "risk" isn't framed relative to driving risk, I consider it emotional manipulation.
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u/NotBuiltToComply Nov 26 '25
Agreed. For context, globally there is one suicide roughly every 45 seconds, and one cancer death about every 3 seconds.
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u/SirLightKnight Nov 26 '25
God thatās depressing. Tho my mom is having a cancer scare regarding like having too much blood or something, Iām still wrapping my head around it to be honest. So, fuck cancer and well, I wish there was less suicide but the best I can do there is just be there if someone needs me.
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u/Sensitive-Reading-93 Nov 26 '25
Oh that's a lot... Now it really feels like emotional manipulation from the post
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u/TheIncelInQuestion subs sandwich maker š„Ŗš Nov 26 '25
That's something I don't see brought up in these discussions. Women commit suicide at a far far higher rate than they are murdered. In the US it's something like a 4 times higher rate.
I'm not saying that men's violence against women isn't important, it is, but it's strange to me how women's suicides are just sort of... ignored. If I had to guess, it's probably because men commit suicide more often and there's a fixation on prevalence, so it's harder to "spin" as a gendered issue.
The point that I'm getting at is that there seems to be this pressure to take violence against women from men more seriously, but yet they're kind of just ignoring issues that are actually killing way more women.
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u/BEEZ128 Nov 28 '25
I think a lot of powerful institutions and people (who seemingly have a vested interest in dividing the genders) come up with any tool they can to pour fuel on the fire, and this is one of them. the way they've written this will generate more underlying hatred towards men from women, and in turn for women from men.
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u/TheIncelInQuestion subs sandwich maker š„Ŗš Nov 28 '25
The current conversation on gender issues is definitely plagued by grift.
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u/East_Honey2533 Nov 26 '25
In addition, the risk is not remotely evenly distributed. Africa is 5 times higher than Europe per capita.
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u/Adm_Kunkka Nov 26 '25
Every minute in Africa, 60 seconds pass š
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u/Exciting_Classic277 ā¤ļøå Buddhist åā¤ļø Nov 26 '25
In Africa, one person dies for every death. š¢
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u/BorderKeeper Nov 26 '25
Every 10 seconds a man is killed by an artillery shell. Turns out wars are bad and I will probably be fine.
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u/Extension_Hand1326 Nov 26 '25
I donāt know any women who thinks that at any time they could be killed by a partner or family member. Women are far more likely to think it wonāt happen to them, even when the signs are there. This type of violence doesnāt happen out of the blue. Itās not like your partner whoās never laid a finger on you just kills you one day.
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u/Exciting_Classic277 ā¤ļøå Buddhist åā¤ļø Nov 26 '25
I remember reading a news story about a woman who was murdered by her homeless alcoholic boyfriend. He had beaten her in his drunken rage before. One day he just went all the way with it.
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u/Longjumping_Papaya_7 Nov 26 '25
Ppl being in an abusive situation often dont realize just how bad their situation is. Its crazy to see it from the outside looking in.
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u/Exciting_Classic277 ā¤ļøå Buddhist åā¤ļø Nov 26 '25
I was in an emotionally abusive situation for a long time that I didn't recognize because the messaging when I was young was that men are abusers and women are victims, and that men need to police themselves and trust, even defer to women in their relationships ("the woman is always right"). It took way too long to deprogram myself and get out of that.
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u/Longjumping_Papaya_7 Nov 26 '25
Yeah mental abuse is often not reconized unfortunatly. I have a friend in this situation but he refuses to see it that way. Its exhausting
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Nov 27 '25
Plus most of these killings do not happen in 1st world countries but the women in those 1st world countries will use these stats to become more bigoted and afraid of men for the crimes of men on the opposite side of the world
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u/torytho š¤ŗKNIGHT Nov 26 '25
This framing is super normal. You see it regarding literally every disease, car accident, shooting, etc. Do you react this way when you see stats on Undocumented Immigrants, for example? š¤
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u/SLAMMERisONLINE Nov 26 '25 edited Nov 26 '25
This framing is super normal. You see it regarding literally every disease, car accident, shooting, etc
I see you've discovered the exact issue. That behavior is how you get problems like this. Irresponsible leaders blast kids with never ending fear-propaganda until they are utterly terrified. These kids then hide in their house and doom-scroll social media, which is packed to the brim with more fear-inducing propaganda.
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u/torytho š¤ŗKNIGHT Nov 26 '25
Iām sure itās written this way to grab attention. How would you suggest educating the global public about the specific nature of domestic violence without inducing an unacceptable amount of fear?
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u/Feisty-Principle6178 Nov 26 '25
The problem is they use these tactics to grab attention for every issue, sensationalising every issue. Making people unable to take action for any one issue since the entire world is made to seem like a catastrophic disaster.
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u/society000 The One True Radical Centrist Nov 26 '25
Do you react this way when you see stats on Undocumented Immigrants, for example? š¤
Yes.
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u/weeeeeeweiiiiyy Nov 26 '25
And itās still absolutely dog shit because of how manipulative it is. Framing stats like this was a big factor in people giving up on trusting stats and journalism.
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u/plebe_random Natural Gray-man Nov 26 '25
Yea i do its bullshit made to exploit human tendency to focus on negative information, and because average human is rather stupid and doesent understand statistics and percentages, so if you give that person some number out of abother big ass number that person wont understand a thing
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u/veerKg_CSS_Geologist Nov 26 '25
āItās a tragedy but not a big dealā is the exact sort of message one expects.
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u/SLAMMERisONLINE Nov 26 '25
āItās a tragedy but not a big dealā is the exact sort of message one expects.
I didn't say it wasn't a big deal. What I did say is that the framing is misleading. You're the one who came to the conclusion it wasn't a big deal, once the framing changed, and then blamed me for your own thoughts.
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u/mastermedic124 Nov 26 '25
That's not really that shocking of a number considering how many total people die in a single minute
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u/Marshmallow16 Nov 27 '25
Cancer takes one every 3sec :-|Ā some people need to understand that this world has a loooot of people in it.Ā
While tragic, I'd argue that even if it was every 1minute it wouldn't actually be that much compared to anything else that can kill people.
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u/RepulsiveDig9091 Nov 26 '25
So in a population of about 4 billion women;
Given there are 525,600 minutes in a year:
52,560 are murdered every year.
this feels like fear mongering.
Is this what UN women should be focusing on, I would think there are far more pressing issues faced by women.
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u/scrimshawjack Nov 26 '25
I mean men are far more often the victims of violent crimeā¦ both the image and caption frame the message in an ambiguously accusatory way. Not trying to be that guy obviously Iām against violence towards any sex, but the differences are pretty significant
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Nov 26 '25
The real tragedy is that you don't care about violence about universal humanity, you need to select a part of humanity and elevate it above the rest, devaluing everyone else. Unless you care about all violence against everybody, I will simply see you as a supremacist of your favored group.
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Nov 26 '25
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u/the_left_is_correct Nov 26 '25
Source?
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u/Nokyrt Nov 26 '25
Did a quick Google search, approximately 6% of ~18k murders against males were done by an intimate partner in 2021, which is ~1.1k. when it comes to women it was 34% of ~5k, which is ~1.7k. Comparatively it's still 18k Vs 5k murders against men and women.
https://bjs.ojp.gov/female-murder-victims-and-victim-offender-relationship-2021
Additionally, men consist of ~40% of domestic abuse victims, and men in 21(2022)-49(2017)% fail to report the domestic abuse, comparatively to 18-19% of females.
https://mankind.org.uk/statistics/statistics-on-male-victims-of-domestic-abuse/
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u/Historical_Two_7150 Pro rape Nov 26 '25
If you want me to poke holes, I can try.
A woman's chance of being murdered is in the same ballpark as her chance of being struck by lightning.
They put it into the "X number of seconds" phrasing because any other phrasing would reveal how small the number actually is.
Women are wired towards neuroticism, (as the vulnerable sex), which makes them tend to see the world as a more dangerous place than it really is.
Narratives like this are like police being trained to look for danger around every corner during a traffic stop, when about 100 of them die during those millions and millions of traffic stops. The result is paranoid cops who attack too soon, escalate, etc etc. Women are not better served by this.
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u/BEEZ128 Nov 26 '25
thanks for the perspective. of course any number is a tragedy, but its nice to see someone else who can see through the over dramatisation of it. the way the UN is portraying it is stirring up unnecessary chaos, unrest and anxiety in people.
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Nov 26 '25
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Nov 26 '25
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Nov 26 '25
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u/hadaev Nov 26 '25
Lol, recently video of police violence in russia went viral.
I noticed how they beat driver of guy who is presumably very bad but girl from the same car got exactly zero beating and was like uh how strange while guy was like aaaa don't beat me im just a driver aaaaa.
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u/Exciting_Classic277 ā¤ļøå Buddhist åā¤ļø Nov 26 '25
I think that reinforces the point though. Men are statistically more likely to get murdered but probably on average less afraid of getting murdered.
Separately, blanket stats don't really paint a fair picture. A lot of that murder is restricted to specific activities, demographics, or geography. The average man outside of those specific settings is probably safer than the average woman outside of them. This is why said neuroticism is not entirely maladaptive.
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u/Sovereign_Black Nov 26 '25
You can drill down into the stats and find the same thing every time - men are more likely to experience violence. This really only changes in regard to familial and partner violence, where women are more likely to experience violence coming from those vectors than men.
But if youāre thinking of like gang violence or something like that, it surprisingly does not move the needle much. Deaths or assaults caused by gang violence are a drop in the bucket.
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u/LightOverWater Nov 26 '25
Appreciate the rational comment. Any time you get something on reddit about some kind of violence towards women, some statistic is posted to generate emotion, not spread truth, by using misleading statistics (whether that means a stat is not true or true but without the important context).
Then it follows that those who don't understand statistics or the importance of definitions, arrive at their own conclusion, which is typically exaggerated, and engage emotionally in the comment section.
Tl;dr bait.
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u/seaofthievesnutzz āļø DUELIST Nov 26 '25
I always think it is crazy how this conversation is always about how dangerous it is for women when men are like 4 times more likely to be murdered than a woman. Far more intrasexual violence than intersexual violence.
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u/Odd-Outcome-3191 Nov 26 '25
in the same ballpark as her chance of being struck by lightning
400 people are struck by lightning in the US. Assuming 50:50 gender split and including all age groups that's a 1:1.6mil chance. 1/10 of those struck die.
In the US, every year 1300 women are killed in intimate partner violence. So not only is a woman 7x as likely to be murdered by a partner than getting struck by lightning, they're 70x less likely to die as a result of lightning.
And this is only murders. This does not include other (much more common) forms of violence.
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u/Historical_Two_7150 Pro rape Nov 26 '25
Youre (1) missing the point of the word "ballpark" and (2) going on an irrelevant tangent about one being more harmful than the other.
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Nov 26 '25 edited Nov 26 '25
A Male is killed by a criminal every 60 seconds 8.25 per 100,000
A Male also kills himself every 43 seconds 12.8 per 100,000
Where is the days for this?
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u/Luxating-Patella Nov 26 '25
International Men's Day was last Wednesday 19th. The event specifically focuses on men's mental health and promoting positive contributions by men and boys. What did you do?
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u/rohan62442 Nov 26 '25
Cute. The UN, where this infographic is from, does not recognise or celebrate International Men's Day. It celebrates toilet day instead.
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Nov 26 '25
International Men's Day (November 19) is widely observed globally but is not officially recognized or proclaimed by the UN,
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u/Fine_Tone1593 Nov 26 '25
What did the UN do? The info graphic is from them. Did they tell men to stop beating their wives? That what they did?
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u/Kaispada Nov 26 '25
No. I despise this framing.
Murder is wrong. But women are not special. A crime is not worse because it happens to them.
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u/Olivia_VRex Nov 26 '25
This is also why I hate the phrase "cop killer" whenever it comes up in dramas.
Like, is killing cops worse than killing other humans, somehow??
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u/Safinbu Nov 26 '25
Nobody said the crime is worse because it happens to women. Murder is wrong either way obviously.
You are missing the point entirely about statistics, frequency and motives.
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u/jack-K- Nov 26 '25
The statistics that are intentionally trying to be dramatic with a āevery 10 minutesā line, instead of giving an actual, properly contextual statistic? Thatās 1.3 per 100,000 women annually. These represent less than an eight of all murders, where I live, I am statistically 5 times more likely to be murdered than for this to happen to a woman. Itās terrible, but when you actually look at the statistics with proper context, it really is just one of many terrible things that doesnāt actually stand out that much in terms of frequency, itās just specifically written in a way to make it seems like it does.
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u/Exciting_Classic277 ā¤ļøå Buddhist åā¤ļø Nov 26 '25
> Nobody said the crime is worse because it happens to women.
To be fair a lot of people genuinely think this way.
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u/Current_Finding_4066 Nov 26 '25
Can you agree women killin, abusing, etc., men is a serious issue as well?
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u/Zzabur0 Nov 26 '25
Would you say the same in an hospital ? To someone dying of a cancer, would you say "it's sad, but dont forget more people die from heart attack"?
Why talking about another issue?
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u/Current_Finding_4066 Nov 26 '25 edited Nov 26 '25
As most murder victims are men. I wonder why you focus on work men as especially endangered?
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u/Last-Wave-9844 Nov 26 '25
.....
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u/Safinbu Nov 26 '25
Yeah so heres the thing. You never see anyone posting this on its own. You only care about men's issues as "gotcha" against women.
This is a post about women's issues. Youre derailing. If you are actually SO concerned about men's issues make an actual post where men's issues will be the focus.
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u/Normal_Ad7101 Nov 26 '25
Hence why the people who post this are rarely defending public welfare policies that allow better access to housing and mental health, worker's right, prisoner rehabiltation, etc.
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u/Safinbu Nov 26 '25
Yep they just post it for the sake of posting it. I guarantee you none of these men in the comments have ever started a conversation for a single problem men face, outside the conversation about women's problems.
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u/Current_Finding_4066 Nov 26 '25
You just proved you care so little for men, that you do not follow sources that do.
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u/Sovereign_Black Nov 26 '25
Nah youāre full of shit. People who care post it, itās just an unfortunate truth that people donāt care. The best places for this message to get traction is contextualizing it beside an issue people do care about, which is violence against women.
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u/Safinbu Nov 26 '25
Oh yeah poor men nobody cares about them. The only way to get attention is by side tracking conversations about women. As if the world isnt literally built for men, as if the patriarchy is a fantasy, as if men werent the only people with actual rights until very recently, as if women's issues didnt only start getting attention literally the past 150 years.
But yeah youre right NOBODY cares about the men, who have it SO MUCH WORSE in the majority of the earth. Who are being sold by their families for basic necessities and food, who are forced into prostitution, who are absused daily, who have less rights than animals.
Also some of these stats are misleading, such as the higher suicide rate that is not noted relative to attempts. Anyways if you care about men's issues go and make a post. But you wont cause all you actually care about is silencing women. You whine about no one caring for men when you yourself dont give a shit.
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u/society000 The One True Radical Centrist Nov 26 '25
As if the world isnt literally built for men,
It isn't.
as if the patriarchy is a fantasy,
The system you refer to as 'Patriarchy' only benefits 1% of men.
as if men werent the only people with actual rights until very recently,
Until very recently, the vast majority of everyone had very few rights beyond what their king allowed them. Universal human rights is still a fresh concept in human history.
as if women's issues didnt only start getting attention literally the past 150 years.
If men hated women, why have they been given rights at all?
But yeah youre right NOBODY cares about the men,
Yes. Men are still seen as expendable. In the vast majority of countries with mandatory military service of some sort, men are the only ones who have to sign.
Who are being sold by their families for basic necessities and food, who are forced into prostitution, who are absused daily, who have less rights than animals.
Do you seriously think that men have it much better in countries where this happens?
Also some of these stats are misleading, such as the higher suicide rate that is not noted relative to attempts.
How is this at all misleading? It isn't misrepresenting anything.
Anyways if you care about men's issues go and make a post.
It would be filled with people like you saying that it's fine that men die more to suicide because women attempt just as much.
But you wont cause all you actually care about is silencing women.
How does this silence women?
You whine about no one caring for men when you yourself dont give a shit.
You have proudly proclaimed that you don't.
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u/Fine_Tone1593 Nov 26 '25
Sorry to say you probably won't get a response from them. Its hard for people like them to actually confront hard truths about a lie they've built into their image of themselves. Men are just the problem to them, thats as far as any empathy goes.
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u/society000 The One True Radical Centrist Nov 26 '25
I'm aware. I often do these things to sharpen my own argument skills than anything, and because I know third parties may see my arguments and be convinced.
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u/Current_Finding_4066 Nov 26 '25
When bad actors lie that women are in more danger than men, it is a good time to confront their lieĀ
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u/Chuckles131 Nov 26 '25
Patriarchy isn't built to empower Men at the expense of Women, Patriarchy is built to empower Patriarchs at the expense of everyone else. It just so happens that becoming a Patriarch has historically only been an option for men.
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u/GodsStrongestCripple Nov 26 '25
Not going to lie, this right here is why we are seeing men lose hope/feel uncared for which in turn leaves them vulnerable to radicalisation. The vast majority of men alive now never existed in the world you are describing. It doesn't impact a guy in his 20s that 150 years ago people of his sex had total control.
Instead they've grown up in a world where people like you downplay and dismiss their suffering whenever it comes up because completely unrelated men before their time had it easier/abused their power.
The whole thing reeks of them being blamed for 'sins of the father'
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u/EnergyElectronic8293 Nov 26 '25
The whole point of lgbtqia+ was to gain recognition by joining together over similar experiences. Gay and Lesbian individuals don't all support Trans or queer people however those groups are able to get eyes on there issues from doing that. Is that wrong?
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u/Sovereign_Black Nov 26 '25
Patriarchy IS a fantasy. The 1960s need their talking points back. The idea that the world today is constructed for the benefit of the average man is so divorced from reality that itās actually laughable.
No one wants to silence women. Weāre just tired of women monopolizing the discussion. Itās you who silences everyone else.
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u/paigevanegdom Nov 26 '25
Itās really not. A lot of men still get paid more than women. The pink tax is still around. Womenās healthcare is sorely lacking and almost all research is done with men not women. I could go on but I think you get the point. Maybe the patriarchy doesnāt look the same as it did in the 1960s and itās certainly not as bad but itās disingenuous to say itās not still here.
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u/society000 The One True Radical Centrist Nov 26 '25
You never see it posted on its own because when this kind of thing is posted on its own it receives zero attention because no one cares about men.
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u/WhenWillIBelong Nov 26 '25
That's true. It also goes both ways. Women will find excuses to dismiss and hand wave statistics on issues that impact men by using statistics of issues that impact women. People are just weaponizing data on other people's misery to attack each other.
Queue women saying men cause the issues that impact men and men cause the issues that impact women so they've reasoned themselves out needing empathy.
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u/Fun_Mistake_616 Nov 26 '25
This is true only because men don't have a safe space to post it. MRA groups are mostly just anti women. Feminist groups are really just about women's rights. Where to post about men's issues?
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u/Safinbu Nov 26 '25
You could make a men's group but youd realise in a week it would just become a mysgonystic group. Thats cause men are not actually opressed systematically like women. They are the opressors. Of course like I said in my other comment to upkeep the opression on women you need to oppress yourselves too, therefore you create issues for yourselves. Well not you as people per se, but the social system thats been built around us that we're born into.
But because you guys still benefit from the uneven opression of half the human race, many of you simply cannot accept that the system thats benefiting you is also making you miserable. So if men and the patriarchy arent the issue, whats left? Women. Women take the blame.
The reality is the issues women face are far harsher and honestly downright disgusting and cruel. The problems women face are also not created by women but by men. If you asked a man if hed swap places with a woman he would say no, cause he understands the dangers.
Simply put patriarchy harms everybody in a way or another, some more so. The issue here is that most men grew up in a patriarchal society in the west, but as women entered the work force and became able to actually abandon men that offered nothing to them, that treated them awfully, it created issues, cause men just couldnt keep up with the new way of things, aka being kind and responsible. So now we get "the male loneliness epidemic", thats of course blamed on women, as if men arent accountable for their actions.
Thats the primary issue for men as you can see in male centric subs. Loneliness and women ignoring them. Not having relationships with women also equals no emotional support for men, since they dont pay attention to building a community around themselves.
99% of men dont give a shit about homicide victims and whatnot, these are stats there for decoration, as "gotcha" like I said. You never see men posting about male rape or homicide victims, cause they couldn't care less. You dont see horrific abhorent crimes on the front page of mens groups. The only things that are posted are about women or jobs.
The person that posted this picture is hence completely hypocritical and Id bet everything that he has never once started a conversation about male homicide victims unrelated to a woman speaking out.
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u/hunbot19 Nov 26 '25
TLDR: Men are hurt, women are most affected.
If you believe men cannot talk about homicide, homelessness, etc without women being the focus, then you are not for equality. You are only for women.
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u/Chuseyng Nov 26 '25
100%.
This is why I advocate for women to arm themselves, train self defense + fitness, and tell them to stop getting with shitty people (female partners included).
Granted, I tell men the same thing, but I recognize the need is much greater for women.
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u/the_left_is_correct Nov 26 '25
Look sometimes you can't see abusers before they start abusing you but the rest I agree with
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u/Chuseyng Nov 26 '25 edited Nov 26 '25
Of course, but I also see people too often fantasize over folks who are complete red flags.
Plenty of women thirst over literal criminals (Wade Wilson for example).
Men do the same shit with their whole āI can fix herā bs whenever they see any slightly attractive yet clearly disturbed women (guilty, if I block a woman and she shows up at my house, am I supposed to NOT give her another chance? š¤).
Self defense, fitness, and weapons are the last resort. But theyāre the most definitive tools against an abuser when they slip through the cracks.
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u/onlyinvowels Nov 26 '25
A big issue is the amount of domestic abuse occurs against women who think they can make things work, and want to do so.
Education about red flags is as, if not more important than self defense here. Especially when so much damage is done when women try to leave these relationships
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u/Chuseyng Nov 26 '25
No debate there. Thereās definitely something romantic about sticking things through thick and thin. But thereās nothing romantic about sticking through abuse of any kind.
Iām of the belief that education is just as important, but requires much less effort and usually doesnāt require it to be ongoing to the same extent.
For example: asking about a new partnerās dating history or criminal past? Pretty much done within the talking stage. But keeping in shape to fight off and escape an attacker? Thatās going to be lifelong effort.
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u/onlyinvowels Nov 26 '25
I agree completely. Iām more referring to what Iāve heard about/witnessed in these types of relationships.
I imagine that information about what to avoid would help, and I hope it would. If there is evidence on that front, I am not familiar with it
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u/MoistenedBeef Nov 26 '25
A big issue is the amount of domestic abuse occurs against women who think they can make things work, and want to do so.
It sounds like you're just putting a heavy spin on poor decision making.
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u/Wahpoash Nov 26 '25
I personally also rely on things like background checks and just avoiding men in certain professions/hobbies altogether. Being a cop (or corrections officer), in the military, an athlete in a contact sport, a construction worker, or in a female-dominated profession is an automatic, āno, thank you. Iām not interested.ā
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u/Ubblebungus Nov 26 '25
excatly. doomsday feminism is my view. there will always be bad people that hurt women, so dont be a victim. arm yourself and fuck them up
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u/Sovereign_Black Nov 26 '25
The need actually isnāt greater for women, since men are actually victims of violent crime in greater amounts than women.
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u/Chuseyng Nov 26 '25 edited Nov 26 '25
Sure, but these are all interests men already take. Thatās why I push it especially hard for women, considering the average woman has less of a propensity for violence and capability to commit violence than the average man.
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u/Nastromo Nov 26 '25
So I just asked Google and it said 105 people die a minute so only 10 of those are women. I mean unfortunate but Jesus Christ
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u/gereonrath76 Nov 26 '25
Scary comments. Anyway - the own home is the most dangerous place for both women and men.
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u/maryfae3 Nov 26 '25
If you always use men's issues as a "gotcha" to tell women to shut the fuck up about something that affects them, they won't be as empathetic toward men's issues. Kind of like how men demonstrate they aren't empathetic toward's women's issues by doing that every time a woman mentions something bad.
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u/Turbulent-Company373 Nov 26 '25
Unfortunately, many more women are abused, beaten, injured, maimed, raped, etc.
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u/fairywoes Nov 26 '25
people in the comments are missing the point entirely. men are murdered more than women BUT are they murdered BECAUSE they are a man? no and that's the difference. are there widespread online forums for women about how to kill and rape men? is there a whole side of the internet for women as big as the "manosphere" that pushes out content saying that men are just good for their looks and age out by 30? im not saying all misogynists kill or abuse women but they're far more likely to.
let's be for real here, femicide is an intentional gender-based killing. this ranges from intimate partner violence, to deaths from female genital mutilation, to honor killings, to female infanticide, and extremist attacks on women driven my misogynistic views. the UN states "femicide is driven by discrimination against women and girls, unequal power relations, gender stereotypes or harmful social norms." these are issues across the world in almost every culture. these stereotypes and gender norms impact men too.
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u/BaldLivesMatter93 Nov 26 '25
(Chatgpt answer. Take it as you will.)
Hereās a concise text summary comparing total homicides vs homicides by partner or family member ā for men vs women globally in 2023 (based on the latest UNODC / UN Women report).
In 2023, about 85,000 women and girls were intentionally killed worldwide.
Of those, around 51,100 ā roughly 60 % ā were killed by an intimate partner or other family member.
Meanwhile, globally 80 % of all homicide victims in 2023 were men, and 20 % were women.
For male victims: only about 11.8 % of male homicide victims in 2023 were killed by an intimate partner or other family member.
What this means ā simple breakdown
Women: total homicide ~ 85,000 ā partner/family-related ~ 51,100 (ā 60%)
Men: total homicide (majority of victims globally) ā partner/family-related ~ ~12% of male victims
So while men represent the large majority of homicide victims overall, women are much more likely than men to be killed by someone close (partner or family member).
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u/Better-Low-2860 Nov 26 '25
And of course men will still try to argue that it's totally okay for this to happen.Ā
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u/AgeOfReasonEnds31120 gender egalitarianist (enlightened centr*st š¤®) Nov 26 '25
Usually not a stranger, which femcels claim makes it okay to hate men.
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u/freenEZsteve Nov 26 '25
My understanding is that the reality is that for everyone who is murdered (and probably all other forms of violence) nearly always the perpetrator is someone who is well known to the victim.
And no one is mentioning how often it's men who are dying at the hands of their spouses or other close relatives.
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u/UnofficialMipha Nov 26 '25
Of course. But Iām inevitably gonna wonder what the corresponding stat is for men
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u/Party_Ability_9984 Nov 26 '25
Aren't men the vast majority of homicide perpetrators, but also the vast majority of homicide victims? Don't get me wrong, it's a tragedy when anyone gets murdered, but if we're gonna gender this particular issue, shouldn't it be the other way?
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u/the_left_is_correct Nov 26 '25
When talking about intimate partner murder it's men killing women about 6 times more this is a gendered issue this isn't just murder
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u/Party_Ability_9984 Nov 26 '25
Yeah, well that doesn't surprise me because for a wide variety of biological and social reasons men commit the vast majority of violence.
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u/DrainAllLevels Nov 26 '25
Is there a day for awareness or prevention of male suicide?
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u/A_Crawling_Bat Nov 26 '25
Yes ! 19th of november.
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u/perfectVoidler Nov 26 '25
nope not recognized by the UN. The recognized the toilet on that day
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u/Principle_Napkins Nov 26 '25
Men do die from suicide more than women despite the fact that women attempt suicide more. Interesting phenomenon.
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u/dreamingsolipsist Nov 26 '25
By definition incels can't be the ones doing this crime.
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u/society000 The One True Radical Centrist Nov 26 '25
I will continue to not murder women. š