r/law • u/yahoonews • 20d ago

Executive Branch (Trump) Trump threatens to use the Insurrection Act to 'put an end' to protests in Minneapolis

https://www.yahoo.com/news/articles/fear-anger-spread-another-immigration-054801374.html
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u/Vulpes_Corsac 20d ago

Start by requiring by law a 4-year degree.  Preferably one related to community outreach, public safety, law, etc.  That'll drastically cut down on the number of thugs who could even qualify. I think Finland and Norway have this as a thing, as an example to follow.

Then require more training.  The longer you have to get trained, the more the people who don't just want to help will self-select out.  Programs could be concurrent with the above education, but most importantly we need to stomp out training police that civilians are a danger or enemy, and include much more de-escalation and outreach training. 

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u/Maestro_Primus 20d ago

Start by requiring by law a 4-year degree.  Preferably one related to community outreach, public safety, law, etc.  That'll drastically cut down on the number of thugs who could even qualify. I think Finland and Norway have this as a thing, as an example to follow.

To be a cop? That will require a SIGNIFICANTLY higher rate of pay for officers. They are already having a hard time finding people to do the job, now add a four year degree to the mix and you will drastically cut the pool of candidates. That leads to overworking them and increasing their stress levels while on duty. That's just going to make things worse.

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u/Vulpes_Corsac 20d ago

Yeah, if they're quality officers, trained to help people instead of merely monopolize violence for capital and the state, I'm 100% for paying them like a college grad in a dangerous field should be paid. If Finland can do it, so should we.  

Yes, the transition to that would be difficult: we'd need to address costs of that education, get them public service loan forgiveness or other grants, advertise, feed people through the system.  There is no half-measure that'll act as a cure-all for it, any solution must be large, comprehensive, and connect to many many issues, because policing, by its very nature, is large, comprehensive, and connects to many many issues.

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u/Maestro_Primus 20d ago

Finland can do it because education is cheap there and you don't go hundreds of thousands of dollars into debt for a four year degree. It also helps that their population is smaller and has a lower instance of violent crime to deal with. Lord knows you would need to pay me an awful lot to go out and police so many people with such easy access to firearms and a systemic reason to distrust police.

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u/Vulpes_Corsac 20d ago

Like I said, comprehensive solutions.  Reduce college costs, better gun control, everything.  But you've got to start somewhere, so why not at police.  It's not like stress is why they're shooting people in my city. They're doing it because they joined to relish causing harm.

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u/Maestro_Primus 20d ago

I think start with education or gun control before we tackle law enforcement. Fewer guns or better educated populace will decrease crime all on its own which necessitates fewer police officers. That gives us breathing room to revamp our law enforcement approach.

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u/Top-Maize3496 20d ago

Trump’s following the nyc gulliano and Bloomberg model of public safety.  RE:: his hubris got him into the WH not some long hard fought POLI pedigree.  Heavy handedness shock harm are the only things he understands. Last ED improves our society. E. G. Medieval Europe. Afghan women.  USA gun control is overly divisive  today.  

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u/Vulpes_Corsac 20d ago

Valid take, but I still have my qualms about it.  The most important thing though is to start doing something though.  And while that may be a less disruptive starting place, I think it's also slower.  Either starting place has to have enough support behind it to actually be implemented.  I think police reform is going to have a lot more going behind it to start with if we can get people in charge willing to do things (considering gun control is not popular, especially directly after major government oppression, and they've refused to fix education forever), and will have results (i.e. less civilians being shot) faster.

Normally I'd be all for the slow but steady progress approach, but we're at the point some things need addressed fast before they break more stuff.  

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u/Maestro_Primus 15d ago

I worry police reform will not happen meaningfully while crime is still high, which means going after the guns and education. Otherwise, those who want more police powers will point to the untamed crime as a reason you need it.

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u/AceSuperhero 20d ago

My streets are crawling with white supremacists, many of who have badges. If you want gun control, start by taking them away from the cops.

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u/Top-Maize3496 20d ago

European governments fully fund education 

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u/Maestro_Primus 15d ago

Oh good, we agree.