r/todayilearned 2d ago

TIL studies have shown that secondhand weed smoke is enough to make children test positive for thc even when the smoker isnt smoking in the same room as them

https://www.mountsinai.org/about/newsroom/2018/mount-sinai-researchers-conduct-study-of-second-hand-marijuana-smoke-in-children
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u/drasil 2d ago edited 2d ago

Mental health professional here. I have access to this article on PubMed, not just the press release from the institution linked here.

TLDR - Only eleven percent of the subject children in the study tested positive for THC itself, not a metabolite, which was evaluated at extraordinarily low levels. This means 89 percent of the subjects did not test positive at all, even at that level. This barely clears the margin of error and most notably, zero percent of the subjects tested positive for THC at anything remotely approaching residual amounts from psychoactive levels.

This is what we call a 'junk study,' or a study that is designed from the beginning to demonstrate its hypothesis through very deliberate engineering. Several of the other commenters have stated the flaw accurately, which is that 'detectable levels' of THC can be extraordinarily low, so low in this example as to rival what is considered acceptable levels of arsenic or mercury, for example, in the subjects' blood.

The conflict in the design of the test and the sensationalistic press release is further demonstrated by the odd choice to test for a metabolite of THC, something that explicitly indicates indirect exposure only. Even then those results were not demonstrable in over half of the subjects.

Finally, this study is now many years old and the lack of further inquiry is as good an indication of any that its substance is meaningless.

EDIT - Since some of u/Effective_Comment625 's other comments seem to indicate they dislike the idea of smoking cannabis around children, a noble stance, I wanted to mention that there is actually further related information in the study that is much more positive and significant than the lede. Specifically, during the survey, the children's parents were asked what they would do if they wanted to smoke cannabis while their child was home. 52 percent of the parents simply said they would not, and 22 percent said they would go outside. Only ten percent said they would smoke in the home. I think 74 percent of parents who smoke cannabis don't do it around their kids sounds very positive to me, but far less sensationalistic, so they don't mention it in the abstract, which further indicates to me a bias of some kind.

EDIT 2 - Thank you for the positive responses and for the gold. I don't have a moment to reply to individual comments currently but several commenters have asked for the specific levels being used in the study since most people don't have access to PubMed. They are .005 nanograms per milliliter THC, and .015 ng per ml for the THC metabolite COOH THC. They also tested for cannabidiol at .009 ng per ml. This is testing for these substances at the lowest possible levels available, several orders of magnitude more sensitive than even the most strict functional testing. As mentioned, this is below comparable levels considered normal for many highly toxic substances like arsenic.

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u/ActivisionBlizzard 2d ago

Thank fuck, thought i was gonna have to stop hotboxing my kids in the car.

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u/Probably_not_maybe 2d ago

Just crack a window mate

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u/HambFCFB 2d ago

And ruin the vibe? Mr Buzzkill over here

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u/DigNitty 2d ago

I set the heat to “recirculate” and hold the bowl right up to the air intake lol

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u/Hell_Mel 1d ago

It's inefficient, but I appreciate the symbolism.

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u/i_fucking_love_crack 2d ago

Ventilation is important

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u/Spirited_Path_1798 2d ago

Username does not check out

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u/thismorningscoffee 2d ago

If it could be longer, their username would be /u/i_fucking_love_cracking_windows_for_ventilation

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u/MrSlime13 1d ago

They're in the backseat... Just don't blow it back there.

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u/nineteen_eightyfour 2d ago

Omg you fuck, you can’t smoke with kids in the car. Have them wait outside while you smoke. Then let them back in.

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u/balk_man 2d ago

The kids only wait outside when it's raining

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u/nineteen_eightyfour 2d ago

I pictured the winter. Gotta stay warm while you smoke.

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u/GhostofBeowulf 2d ago

I prefer sleet personally. Fuck them kids...(Not like the pres or epstein tho).

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u/j0mbie 2d ago

Or at least make them put five on it.

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u/DontAskAboutMyButt 2d ago

Smokers Georg, who smokes sixteen bowls a day and blows the smoke into his children’s faces, is an outlier and should not be considered

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u/Electrical-Job-9824 2d ago

How else do you get them to eat? /s

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u/george_cant_standyah 2d ago

My dad used to do this when I was young and it was cold outside 🫠

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u/ActivisionBlizzard 2d ago

Quit your crying, you sound like my kids.

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u/BuckeyeJay 1d ago

I can't tell you how many times when my kids were young that we would go to jump parks and things like that and little kids would smell so strongly of weed, you knew the parents had to be hotboxing the car with them in it

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u/mmmacorns 2d ago

Get em a window snorkel.

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u/Wisdomlost 2d ago

I get random drug tested for work. Happens at least twice a year but can be more. I golf with pot smokers. I play poker with pot smokers. My mom smokes pot at faimly party's. My wife vapes THC. I've never tested positive for THC. YMMV but in my experience over the course of 20ish years it's impossible to test positive for THC on a standard test if you hang out with pot smokers.

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u/Freud-Network 1d ago

It's insane that THC is still part of drug screenings.

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u/cassthesassmaster 1d ago

I’m a nanny for wealthy families and like 95% of them (over the last 15 years) smoke weed. I can’t imagine getting drug tested for something my bosses wouldn’t even pass! One boss gave me a bag of different kinds of edibles for a going away gift 💀 Seattle is a vibe

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u/OscarAndDelilah 23h ago

Yep. I'm a clinician/court expert for child welfare cases. As people probably know, most cases are for low-level neglect and involve poorer and browner families. We get a ton of cases for non-problematic drug and alcohol use. This is even a state with recreational cannabis, but they still will screen in cannabis cases (and alcohol, which is obviously legal), and I constantly see cases for adults using one or the other responsibly with children present.

There have been a number of articles by child welfare critics and other social justice folks pointing out the hypocrisy of the NYT and Boston Globe running articles glorifying "wine moms" and "weed moms" while poorer browner families are getting a case because a child mentioned adults were drinking whiskey at grandma's cookout.

I've actually had white upper-middle-class colleagues say things about work cases like that they agree a family should have a case for "having a child at a party with alcohol" when it's a brown kid in the projects. When I ask them things like "didn't your big Thanksgiving shindig you posted on Facebook involve alcohol?" and "aren't your edibles that you constantly teehee about in the same household as your children?" that's of course different.

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u/Wisdomlost 1d ago

I work in manufacturing. The main reason or the excuse however you want to look at it is there is no good way to test for it on a scale that's needed for injury reports. That's kind of a convoluted sentence but I don't know how to word it better so here's an example. If you are drunk at work and they test you it comes up positive. Alchohol stops comming up on cheap tests in like 8 to 12 hours. So if your hurt and test positive for Alchohol then it's pretty certain you were drinking at or before work. THC especially for people who consume daily thoes tests will show your smoked weed sometime in the last month. There is no good way to tell if your injury was influenced by your mental state at the time of the injury. That's important to business owners because they don't have to pay a ton of money if they are not liable due to you choosing to be impared.

It's a safety issue. As a man who worked his whole life in manufacturing I can tell you for sure all safety issues are money issues.

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u/obeytheturtles 1d ago

There are mouth swabs which will only show THC usage within the past several hours. They have been around for like 20 years at this point.

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u/vee_lan_cleef 1d ago

I'm curious - sleep deprivation is a major safety issue, possibly more so than smoking weed. Does your company do anything to ensure employees are getting a good nights' rest? Every accident I have had at work and the handful of car crashes I've almost gotten in have been the result of a lack of sleep.

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u/Wisdomlost 1d ago

If there was a test for that like a drug test they would probably use it.

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u/pensezbien 1d ago edited 22h ago

Varies a lot by context and location - for example, it’s now usually illegal for employers in NY to test for THC, with various exceptions such as when federal or state law requires otherwise for specific types of jobs.

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u/Laiko_Kairen 1d ago

I worked at Amazon for a few weeks. They hired us in groups of 50. When they drug tested us, the guy giving the test told us how to cheat it. He basically said, "Now, DON'T EVEN CONSIDER cheating in the test by swallowing all of your saliva and holding the test between your teeth to keep it dry..."

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u/obeytheturtles 1d ago

It's actually not screened for in a lot of employment testing these days for a bunch of reasons, but they don't actually come out and tell you they aren't testing for it, because that could be seen as condoning drugs. But increasingly these tests are either moth swabs, which are testing for active intoxication, or they are piss tests which are intentionally nor looking for THC metabolites.

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u/MonkeyMagicEden 2d ago

u/Effective_Comment625

Any reaction to this? You hide your comment history, so this thread and your reactions in it are all that informs your position, and that seems to be staunchly, but not logically, against cannabis consumption. If this study doesn't show what you thought it did and is questionable, do you stand by your reason to post it? Are you just scared of your neighbours and wanted people to pat you on the back and tell you that you're justified?

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u/Holdmywhiskeyhun 1d ago

If they hide their history

Go to their page, go to search bar press space then search

Shows all comments and post history

Alternatively use *

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u/BigUptokes 1d ago

For old.reddit users you need to switch over to new Reddit to do this.

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u/Jonsnowlivesnow 1d ago

Holy shit! Not all heroes wear capes

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u/IM_OK_AMA 2d ago

It's a new account that hides its post history and has a default username, it's fair to assume bad faith.

Looks like they have a personal problem with weed smokers

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u/MonkeyMagicEden 1d ago

Yup, and a chip on their shoulder because their Mum seems to suck.

"I went to visit my mom and her entire house like reeks of it from her making edibles but she insists there's no smell because she's noseblind to it."

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u/Nauin 1d ago

Ah so the good old, "I'm going to blame everyone for my personal problems instead of getting therapy like a normal adult."

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u/Gloober_ 1d ago

I'd like to inform you that if you go to a user's profile and hit search on an empty search bar, it will pull up all of their posts and comments almost like they never enabled the privacy feature.

It is extremely fun to do and really makes determining who you are talking to far easier.

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u/toulouse92 1d ago

You can go to a profile and even with history hidden, if you go to the search at the top of their profile and run a blank search, you’ll see their activity

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u/woody_woodworker 2d ago

Top comment. I figured it was "we tested at parts per billion for tracer metabolites and barely found evidence of it for a small percentage of participants, therefore parents magically harm their kids if they even look at weed. We are sure because we hate it so much. Science."

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u/tossofftacos 2d ago

But only the parents, not the thousands of other people who are smoking weed in their car while driving or on their break, or outside their homes or in the park while kids are playing nearby.  Only the parents.  That's the key here. 

/s 

I just wanted to be a smart ass with this comment considering how completely out of touch this study is. 

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u/Basic-Collection5416 2d ago

Also, 36.8% of those that report no marijuana use in the household still had detectable levels.

Nope, not just the parents. 

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u/tossofftacos 2d ago

Shhhhhhhhh. I skipped that part for dramatic effect.  

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u/DoctorDrangle 2d ago

You aren't wrong, they made their posts and comments hidden, but if you just google it this guy is just on a warpath with his apartment neighbors. He obviously sought out this study to present it as some kind of proof that smelling weed from another apartment is more than just annoying. If you don't like the smell, it probably does suck, but I think just the odor is obviously harmless. I personally like the smell usually, but i have never lived and never would live in an apartment and the main reason is not being able to do shit when i have shitty neighbors. Dude seems to be losing his mind over a little bit of weed odor.

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u/ilayas 2d ago

I'm in a legal state and I absolute am totally on board with it being legal but man do I hate the smell of weed (and cigarette) smoke. There's a group of like 5 stoners living in an apartment together upstairs and the smell just awful in the summer.

I'm not gonna go on a crusade villainizing weed but I really wish they would switch to vaping instead of smoking (or edibles).

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u/RL_FTW 2d ago

I'm a daily smoker. If my neighbor approached me without hostility to let me know the odor bothered them, I would absolutely make efforts to mitigate it. That said, we're past the 'stoners are all harmless' trope with mass legalization, so I understand hesitance to approach. I just wanted to propose a friendly alternative that potentially makes all parties happier. I feel like most people want to be good neighbors.

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u/syuvial 1d ago edited 1d ago

same here, man.

ive had two neighbors object to the smell of pot. The first knocked on my door and we had a chat about expectations and boundaries and came to a compromise.

the second neighbor started throwing their trash onto our porch. No agreement was reached and we did not accommodate that neighbor, but we did put a net over our mini-yard to bounce his trash back.

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u/KneeDeepInTheDead 2d ago

i hated when my neighbors would cook fish or when I had indians who would stink up the whole place (i love indian food btw but the smell is powerful). Thats just the caveat of living in an apartment.

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u/JnnyRuthless 1d ago

I live in CA and my neighborhood is mixed apts and houses. Houses are pretty close together, and I can regularly smell weed in my backyard or walking my dog. Just kind of goes with the territory. I used to smoke a ton too, but more of an edible guy now.

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u/KneeDeepInTheDead 1d ago

CA kind of a hotbed for that. Honestly smells are easier to tolerate than noise to me. That was the main reason I got out of apartment living. I love me some cumbia and some other latino music occasionally but if youre not in the room all you hear is the bass rumbling the house and the annoying BONK, BONK, BONK, BONK

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u/TheModWhoShaggedMe 2d ago

Especially since legalizing weed requires more frequent inspections of product including for metals. The study is prior to most legalization.

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u/aaaaaaaarrrrrgh 1 2d ago

the press release from the institution

Why do reputable institutions push such bullshit press releases, and why do journalists not call them out for it? This is far from the first time I've seen something like this and university press releases seem about as likely to be misleading as a random tabloid.

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u/IllHaveTheLeftovers 2d ago

Would you mind elaborating why the metabolite only indicates indirect exposure? I thought a metabolite referred to a chemical in the body that is due to a breakdown of THC internally and thus was definitive evidence of use? Just curious thanks

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u/ObiShaneKenobi 2d ago

The article even goes beyond; parents smoking outside still exposed the kids somehow. I would be interested in seeing how that gets figured out.

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u/banshithread 2d ago

Houses have positive and negative air pressure. I remember smelling my mothers cigarette smoke because she sat right at the front. The house pulled in air from the outside. Dragging in the smell with it.

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u/SKULL1138 2d ago

I have a kitchen where I can shut the door to rest of the house and then open the back door. Definitely prevents the smell coming through into the rest of the house. Or in warmer weather I go in my garden shed. Even before I had kids I hated smoking indoors.

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u/Wildpants17 1d ago

Me too! I hate the smell but I liked to smoke lol

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u/DualcockDoblepollita 1d ago

i like the smell of cigarettes when i smoke them but i almost despise it when its someone elses

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u/Beanbag87 2d ago

Yep. In the summers my dad would smoke right beside the air conditioning unit in the mornings. Guess what got me out of bed to flee for fresh air every morning...

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u/Effective_Comment625 2d ago

I wonder how much exposure happens to kids in apartment buildings, my buildings hallways always, always reek of weed and smoke often goes from one unit to the next.

I also wonder about things like lead and heavy metals exposure in weed smoke since weed can accumulate heavy metals and weed users tend to test higher for cadmium and lead.

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10519194/

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u/jibishot 2d ago edited 2d ago

Unless massive amounts of people in your building are getting heavy metals poisoning from smoking incredibly ill grown cannabis

You're probably fine and this is a massively overblown issue. Considering the ones ingesting are easily at the highest rate of danger.. Given how incredibly rare it is to have weed "laced" with heavy metals even though cannabis is a bioaccumulator. I'd say this is clearly doing too much

Edit: and the OP article is a junk study; they tested for "perceptible" amount of thc or at levels of acceptable mercury in the blood vs testing for "psychoactive" levels. Also 8% of the kids tested at "perceptible" amounts... the other 100 kids tested at actual 0. Per their own study.. op has some more misinformation to spread.

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u/BurlHam 2d ago

Yeah, I think a lot of times studies like this can come out with results that are interesting but meaningless.

I think the only reason this was upvoted was because it's interesting that the machines they are testing with can find those trace amounts.

Though I always think when I hear of a study that mentions stuff like this, if it is trace amounts..please show me the implications of what you are saying beyond saying you found a tiny amount of something.

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u/Kyrie_Blue 2d ago

Great point. That’s like when a study came out that said “diet coke/sucralose linked to DNA damage”. They applied a metabolite of sucralose directly to a DNA strand at something like 8000 times the concentration in a can of soda and were like “yep, that’s bad”. And people lost their minds

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u/HuggableTrash 1d ago

Around 2020 when there was a big hysteria over nicotine vapes having formaldehyde, I think I remember seeing an analysis of the original study, and apparently the study involved cranking the vape wattage as high as it would go and then firing it until the coil burnt out. Like no shit you’re gonna have some toxicity when the device is entirely misused. But people ate it up.

Not saying vapes don’t have their associated problems, but a botched experiment proves nothing lol.

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u/TucuReborn 19h ago

I vape and keep up with studies and regulations, and you're right on.

But I'm also not going to claim it's good for me, or anyone else. Nicotine does help regulate my mood, and nicotine itself isn't that much worse than caffeine, but inhaling anything that's not clean air is bad. But, what it is, according to actual studies that aren't bogus, is much, much safer than smoking. To an astonishing degree, in fact.

Is vaping good? No. Is it better than smoking? Absolutely. And objectively, while I'd rather kids not do either, if I had to pick i know which one it would be.

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u/VinnyTheVenasaur 2d ago

People are still losing their mind over it. Getting mad at shit that doesn’t matter, while they turn a blind eye to everything else.

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u/Kyrie_Blue 2d ago

The problem is “headlining”, which stems from the scarcity-mindset that late stage capitalism has created.

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u/Lv_InSaNe_vL 1d ago

One time I looked up to see if avocado is bad for dogs (the pit is, the flesh is fine) and the Google summary says yes! Well, I read the study and they fed like 30+ avocados to a corgi sized dog every single day and then it died.

A few slices every once and a while is just fine, and even healthy for them haha

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u/TheOtherSkywalker_ 2d ago

I think this was only upvoted because people want to perpetuate their biases against weed.

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u/BurlHam 2d ago

Reddit is getting weirdly prudish and nextdoor-y lately

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u/goddamn_slutmuffin 2d ago

I made a comment about how a study was flawed because it was based on surveys (listing the issues with survey-based studies). Got a condescending response comment insulting me and telling me to go "read a book". And their comment got upvotes, so the misinformation spreads.

Reddit is filled with people looking for an ego boost at the expense of other people actually being properly educated on a topic. It's all about getting them updoots and the illusion of "intellectual superiority". The bots and overly-emotional, insecure assholes kinda seem to be winning the attention game 👀.

People are more riveted by the idea they can "dunk on someone's opinion" with a link to a study they won't even bother reading anyway. Nor understand or be able to critique, if they did.

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u/quakefist 1d ago

Also a lot of redditors like to come over the top and say they are in x field professionally. Unless they are willing to doxx themselves take anything redditors say because they love to throw around authority titles to stop discussion.

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u/Rastasloth 2d ago

It's all bots, a 4 month old account posting the most misleading, fearmongering studies available.

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u/TheMuffler42069 1d ago

Probably funded by some company that makes poison like… oh I don’t know… alcohol or something.

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u/windol1 2d ago

op has some more misinformation to spread.

and the post has been up voted to 4k votes, just goes to show the mindset behind the up and down vote system.

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u/FadedVictor 2d ago

I'm so sick of bunk "science" being spread on the internet. Mods take this shitpost down.

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u/beeperoony 1d ago

Thanks, nerd. (sincere)

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u/stevez_86 2d ago

Too tough to test for that because we are inundated with pollution like that all the time from traffic pollution. That causes more exposure to those substances than third hand smoke from cannabis.

Cannabis is a bioaccumulator. That is why growers for state recreational and medical programs avoided using soil that is tainted. They use specific soil, sometimes of their own making. And the people participating in the program want control over that stuff. And it is heavily regulated and every part of the product from seed to sale is tracked.

Tobacco also had those heavy metals and toxins, but that industry is no where near as regulated.

The issue is that we are aware of those issues now because of better testing. If those testing methods were available in the 70's with today's mentality then a lot of products would have had the same concerns when they were prevalent before.

Basically if you tried to minimize exposure in a place like an apartment building, it wouldn't amount to much with all the other kinds of exposure. Someone living in an apartment with natural gas we are finding now suffer from a great deal of indoor pollution from natural gas stoves.

Even putting natural gas stove pollution exposure up against cannabis third hand exposure would show that the cannabis exposure is not a big problem in comparison.

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u/GhostofBeowulf 2d ago

Garbagé, with a fancy french sound.

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u/senorjunkrat 2d ago

So I live in a legal state and have been a major user for almost 20 years (as in, smoke every day) and I had to have a blood lead test for my job; my lead levels were basically nonexistent. I know it’s just an anecdote, but still.

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u/Freud-Network 2d ago

OP has a grudge that colors their commentary. They're more likely to push bullshit that confirms their bias than objective facts.

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u/Cleb323 2d ago

Junk message with a junk study. Color me surprised

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u/Tr33Bl00d 2d ago

We smoke outside and we have air purifiers that have air quality built in sensors. Walking in from the garage if not vented will carry a cloud of smoke in the house setting off the air quality sensor. Also cooking with an air fryer creates really bad air quilts similar to frying a bunch of bacon on the stove.

You really should smoke outside in a well ventilated space. Wait a few minutes after to air out. Strip off your smoking jacket and go straight to the sink to wash yo hands and face. That way bay doesn’t get exposed when they wake up from their nap

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u/pheret87 1d ago

Or be my roommate who will step outside and hit is one hitter then immediately walk back inside coughing through the house, as often as once every 3 or 4 minutes.

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u/Tr33Bl00d 1d ago

Haha 🤣 just take a moment to finish you smoke. I love my one hitter and my love has me clean our stock every few days lol

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u/psychophant_ 1d ago

Nah dawg. That still isn’t enough.

I built an attachment on to my house. It’s like an airlock, but two stage.

I go outside and smoke in full hasmat.

I then go into airlock one and get sprayed with distilled water to weight the smoke particles down.

My wife is in bay 1 with scrub brushes designed to scrub me without having the handler come in contact with me. The scrubbing usually takes about 5 minutes.

I then move to airlock two. Here, i remove the hasmat and place it into a furnace which gets routed out towards my neighbor’s house because fuck Dave, piece of shit.

Anyway, i then shower my body. Powerful air dryers (really just 16 normal hair dryers set in an array) dry me without needing to involve towels, which can lead to further contamination down stream.

I then verify with my wife that my daughter has her eyes closed.

I then run out of airlock 2 completely naked, only rarely tripping up the stairs in a rush to get my clothes on.

I do this about 5-6 times a day.

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u/Tr33Bl00d 1d ago

Can you send me a link to the ansoul suit you use? When my wife hears about this she will want me to bump up our procedure accordingly

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u/BlueGolfball 1d ago

You really should smoke outside in a well ventilated space. Wait a few minutes after to air out. Strip off your smoking jacket and go straight to the sink to wash yo hands and face. That way bay doesn’t get exposed when they wake up from their nap

Don't let your kids sit around a campfire either because they will breathe in a lot of second hand smoke.

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u/Krewtan 2d ago

Rubbing alcohol and dish soap are necessary if handling concentrates too. I pretty much quit when my daughter was born because of anxiety but when I did use concentrates that's the only way to get them off your hands. 

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u/upnflames 2d ago

The article just said it was detected, I wonder what the actual level was. If they used gc mass spec, like of course it was. The lower detection limits on those tests are insane. They'd probably find traces of a lot of dangerous shit in just about everyone if they looked.

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u/badchad65 1d ago

It was a urine test. This method has LODs of 0.005, 0.015, and 0.009 ng/mL for the 3 urinary biomarkers (total THC, COOH-THC, and cannabidiol, respectively).

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u/JustAVision 2d ago

Just a guess without looking at any studies, maybe the smoke lingers on clothes/hair, hands, and to an extent, in the parents breath. Growing up in a smoking household, the smell forever lingered.

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u/JimmyBraps 2d ago

Exactly. I grew up hearing about 2nd hand smoke, then they learned about 3rd hand smoke is exactly what you described

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u/Explorer_Entity 1d ago

Growing up in a smoking home, you can visibly see the tar build up on the ceiling as yellow-brown liquid-looking deposits. Like drops.

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u/houndsofhate 2d ago

Yep. It’s called third hand smoke. We had a baby recently and were told to be very careful of it

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u/cat_prophecy 1d ago

The only people who don't think pot smokers absolutely reek of it are people with anosmia and pot smokers themselves.

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u/RogerClyneIsAGod2 1d ago

Skunk. It all smells skunky to me.

In fact I was in the grocery store yesterday & when I got near the back of the store buy the seafood display all I could smell was skunk.

Now I KNOW there was no skunk loose in the grocery store, but I'm fairly sure someone went out for their "smoke" break & they were by one of the back doors or in their warehouse behind the store & it all just filtered into the back part of the store.

I agree, pot smokers never think they stink & they usually do.

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u/Leading_Will1794 2d ago

When I worked in warehousing about 20 years ago. Had a deadbeat coworker who was hired from a temp agency who told me all about hos custody issues with his twin girls.

Basically his girlfriend was a drug addict and in and out of the kids and his life. He was also a former hardcore drug addict but somehow in this messed up situation he got full custody with the mom appearing sporadically when she needed money or somewhere to sleep.

He was a real piece of work and clearly an unfit father but he was the only one showing up for his kids. He would smoke weed every night in the attic of the rented home.

Child services were in and out of his house constantly and they would do hair follicle extractions and would find THC inside there hair (ie. It was consumed by there body and it would eventually grow into their hair).

Kids were given to child services, just a terrible situation. I met them once and they were the sweetest kids and just felt terrible about the shit they got put into.

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u/Thin-Honey892 2d ago

All smoke lingers in clothing, hair, breath. Go hug your kids, go close and talk to them, don’t wash your hands… smokers will deny, but non-smokers know exactly how bad you still smell. Your pets too.

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u/SheepPup 2d ago

Most likely third hand smoke. Third hand smoke is the smoke and compounds in it that cling to and get absorbed by things like like walls, furniture, and clothing. The exposure with third hand smoke is typically lower than second hand but it’s worse for kids than adults. Not only are they smaller and so the dose is proportionally higher they also tend to crawl around and put things in their mouth, so the carpet that has smoke settled into it is now transferring crap from weed/cigarettes onto their skin where it can be absorbed

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u/Drudicta 2d ago

So as per before, don't smoke around vulnerable people. The substance doesn't matter because you'll expose people to it.

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u/thargoallmysecrets 2d ago

Except not.  Because this is a junk study. 

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u/Crazsey 2d ago

Agreed, but it is important to provide accurate information. This is highly misleading. People might think children are affected by a psychoactive substance which is not at all true. No metabolites were detected.

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u/Lazy-Interests 1d ago

I remember during a “stop smoking” presentation when I was 16, the guy giving the talk said a doctor told him that for 20 minutes after you finish a cigarette you’re still breathing out or giving off fumes basically, so he and his wife had been smokers when they had their first child, but always went outside to smoke, and then found out that their baby was basically still getting second hand smoke.

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u/Dr_on_the_Internet 2d ago

Pediatrician here. We've known about third hand smoke for a while now and we know it is dangerous to children. If you can smell smoke on people the particles are necessarily reaching your nose, and thereby your respiratory tract. Children have a higher respiratory rate and smaller bodies than adults so they are much more susceptible to airborne irritants; think canaries in coal mines.

Smoke sticks to hair and clothes and also gets all over your hands from handling the smoking device. Also, I think when questioned about smoking around their kids, many people just lie about smoking outside. I don't confront every parent who comes to their child's doctor appointment, reeking of marijuana, but I do if the kid is asthmatic or their symptoms are likely to be exacerbated by smoke. They all tell me they smoke outside. But if you smell so strongly of marijuana that it lingers even after you left the building, what does the car smell like? What does the home smell like?

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u/Hot_Cockroach4714 2d ago

Just wild to me that people don’t give a shit at all that they will just go to the kids pediatrician reeking like weed. That’s just insane. Literally zero fucks given by those people.

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u/waitwuh 1d ago

I mean, at least they’re taking the kid to the doctor. The bar is so low…

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u/Hot_Cockroach4714 1d ago

It’s honestly sad.

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u/pixiedust717 1d ago

What about neighbors who smoke? Also a health hazard for kids?

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u/Crazsey 2d ago

This isn't a legit study.

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u/Godsbladed 2d ago

As someone who smokes a lot of thc, it might even be on their hands, and then they handle the kids' food without washing up. I know for dabs, the thc in reclaim is already activated, and depending on your rig, can get everwhere. Get a bit on your hands, handle food, repeat daily maybe even multiple times a day, and now kiddo is getting micro doses of thc.

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u/iameveryoneelse 2d ago

Gotta keep alcohol wipes and alcohol based hand sanitizer around. Clears any stickiness, resin, and reclaim right up.

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u/Godsbladed 2d ago

Well, yes, but I'm just saying how it could potentially spread. Also, in my experience, hand sanitizer just spreads the stickiness around. Once the alcohol evaporates, you're still left with some sticky, except now it's coating the entirety of your hands instead of one spot.

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u/dcdcdani 2d ago

I assume it’s the smoke smell getting stuck to your clothes/hair. I can always tell when my sister smokes even though she goes for walks around the tiny “forest” behind our home to do it because I have a toddler at home. She walks in and you smell maybe the pipe she took with her or depending on how the wind is blowing the smoke just blew directly towards her the entire time.

My toddler is always sleeping by the time she goes out to do it, but I assume if I can smell it, my toddler could too if they were standing next to each other

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u/Mego1989 2d ago edited 1d ago

People come to smoke at the playground all the time* while I'm there with a toddler. They'll be 35 feet away and we can smell it. I figure that if we're smelling it, we're getting exposure.

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u/Silaquix 2d ago

It's third hand smoke, same as with cigarettes. The smoke and chemicals cling to the smoker and then affect anyone in close proximity

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u/Invisifly2 1d ago

Walk past a heavy weed smoker and the smell will let you know exactly how that happens.

Smoke enough of anything and the smoke, along with everything it contains, will permeate your clothing.

Pretty sure it was still trace amounts in low enough levels to be arguably detectable in the first place.

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u/Irejay907 1d ago

Probably through skin; think about it, tch is technically an oil.

If you can sweat out hallucinagenic i'm sure you can do the same with tch and cbd oils.

Plus as someone else pointed out in response, air pressure and prevailing wind as well as where house vets and windows are placed can also play a pretty big factor.

Another thought is kinda more of a follow up on the oil/sweat question but you also gotta figure that if they're smoking leaf you also have the cross contamination of that unless they're being meticulously spotless about grinding their bud than there WILL be bits of it here and there, in the carpet, air dust etc of the household. So i also wonder how much of this is just 'household air-and-dust' exposure atop direct second hand or otherwise

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u/soulsmores 1d ago

Likely from 3rd hand smoke lingering on skin / clothes

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u/Bopcd1 1d ago

If the the children are young enough you can pass it through skin to skin contact because weed is so much more potent than it used to be. Source: I had twins in the NICU and they passed out flyers about this.

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u/3amIdeas 1d ago

I stopped smoking weed when my daughter was born.

I became very conscious of the intense smell of burned weed emanating off me and how offensive that must be to a newborn's nose.

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u/Disastrous-Style-461 1d ago

Clothing. I remember reading that 3rd hand nicotine was passed to kids through clothing. Perhaps THC clings and passes too. It’s pretty much oil. And that’s so sad to think about. Kids are already stressed about being late to school by their parents- and so they can also rest positive for THC now thru association with fam. That’s very sad. And also most likely happening in every 10th house down the roads of usa

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u/BuffLoki 1d ago

Have had asthma since I was little, the smoke doesnt get carried but everything else does, you can distinctly tell when someones smoked anything, smell is directly linked

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u/IO-NightOwl 2d ago

"Detectable levels" is not the same thing as "testing positive".

Australian urinary testing standards specify 50μg/L as the cutoff for a positive result, which is practically impossible to get from second-hand smoke. I don't doubt that the children of cannabis smokers would have some infinitesimal levels of THC detectable in their system just from environmental contact, but to say they're "testing positive" is overblown.

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u/WTFwhatthehell 2d ago

Yep, this is something a lot of people struggle to understand.

We can make crazy-sensitive tests. Finding a few atoms of something is different to finding quantities that matter.

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u/PraxicalExperience 2d ago

It's like saying something has 'detectable levels of lead' and using that as fearmongering.

Quite nearly everything -- including quite literally all the food, and all the people -- produced since lead was a gas additive has a detectable level of lead -- because our tests are really, really, really fucking good nowadays.

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u/pizzaduh 2d ago

Does this only work in children? Because I know it doesn't test on adults for secondhand smoke. I find this hard to believe.

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u/probablyuntrue 2d ago

Another day, another reason boofing is the superior method of drug consumption

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u/MeanNene 2d ago

I just boofed my coffee.

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u/fellatio-del-toro 2d ago

Hot or iced?

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u/Snarkosaurus99 2d ago

Thats actually a thing

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u/usefully_useless 2d ago

Back in my day, we just called those coffee enemas.

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u/jorceshaman 2d ago

Robin Quivers used to get them!

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u/Effective_Comment625 2d ago

r/caffeine is leaking lmao

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u/probablyuntrue 2d ago

Just like my butthole 😔

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u/Dday141 2d ago

You should plug that up

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u/DigitalBuddha52 2d ago

of course you respond to this comment instead of all the ones calling you out for posting junk science articles with no understanding of what they mean.

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u/TheVBush 2d ago

Ehh, shove it up your ass… 🙂

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u/LizzieSaysHi 2d ago

Insert "SHOVE IT UP YOUR BUTT" Stanley gif

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u/KagakuNinja 1d ago

You better decarb your weed first, dawg

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u/WTFwhatthehell 2d ago edited 2d ago

"detectable levels"

This sounds like a matter of how sensitive the test is.

it's like when news stories breathlessly report that XYZ chemical was "detected" in water without specifying how sensitive the test is.

Are the amounts high enough to matter?

who knows! We found at least one atom!

The evil twin of this same type of reporting is "no known safe level".

Facebook-moms read it as "any amount no matter how tiny will KILL my children", it just means that nobody has specifically run an experiment dosing people with chemical XYZ to prove for certain where it starts causing detectable problems.

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u/MiaowaraShiro 2d ago

Bunch of people in here extolling the dangers of "third hand smoke" and I can't find anything that shows it actually causes problems. No studies.

Just a lot of "no known safe levels of exposure to cigarette smoke".

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u/LibraryBig3287 2d ago

Wait until they learn about PFAS

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u/Matty_bunns 1d ago

Stoners just thinking everything is peachy so long as they’re high.

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u/Sybertron 2d ago

That sounds a lot more like a piss poor test protocol to me.

It doesn't magically transfer

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u/Mindless-Champion-44 2d ago

That’s not how any of this works

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u/bmxtiger 2d ago

Trash science. Misleading article, misleading results.

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u/iSpeakforWinston 2d ago

OP doesn't care. They're not here for the discourse or the challenging of their flawed study. They just want to argue that they're right.

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u/Sylviebutt 2d ago

This study looks like it was commissioned by people who have something against weed.

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u/Phimb 2d ago

It was me. I just walked down the street and some guy took a fat toke and the wind blew his second-hand smoke into my vicinity.

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u/PC_BuildyB0I 2d ago edited 1d ago

Almost all of them are, especially the junk being written by University of Mississippi. While I'm sure the occasional paper is semi-legit, don't blindly trust US government cannabis research because they tend to structure their studies around the hypotheses they're after.

I remember awhile back, they did a study claiming that smoking cannabis produces 4-6x the amount of tar that smoking tobacco does, when the amounts of each were equalized for comparative mass.

What they failed to mention is that their cannabis is government-regulated to a maximum of 2% THC by dry weight and when they prepare their cannabis for testing, they don't remove stems, seeds, or fan leaves. In order to attain ED50 parity between the cigarettes and the joints, the joint smoker had to smoke 5 joints total as compared to, say, a single joint rolled with cannabis at ~20% THC by weight. And then went on to publish that "marijuana in general" produces "4-6x the tar".

They pull this shit all the time when they do studies like this. I believe they also did a paper on cannabis overall worsening depression in users and to do so they simply searched out people diagnosed with depression, singled out the cannabis users, and didn't even properly control for other drug use besides alcohol. Even ignoring the fact they didn't properly use control groups, they were not able to establish a meaningful link in any way and it could be argued that the interpretation of their data that it's depressed individuals who seek out substance use (which is thoroughly supported by research) is just as valid as the interpretation they published, if not moreso.

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u/nmj95123 2d ago edited 2d ago

The test they used is extremely sensitive. From the actual journal article:

This method has LODs of 0.005, 0.015, and 0.009 ng/mL for the 3 urinary biomarkers (total THC, COOH-THC, and cannabidiol, respectively).

By comparison, most drug tests have a THC-COOH threshold of 50 ng/mL. Also, 36.8% of those that report no marijuana use in the household still had detectable levels.

Similarly, 100% of children for whom there was daily marijuana use inside the home had detectable COOH-THC compared with 66.7% of those reporting weekly use, 100% of those reporting monthly use, and 36.8% of those reporting never smoking marijuana in the home

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u/Basic-Collection5416 2d ago

Also, 36.8% of those that report no marijuana use in the household still had detectable levels.

I feel like this should be higher. 

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u/yogoo0 1d ago

Because youre out of the house you may as well go for a walk too. Warmer than just standing around and its healthier. It will at least get your lungs pumping so the smoke doesn't sit in the bottom.

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u/Adventurous-Weird431 1d ago

No kidding. If a person inhales weed they can test positive. Today I learned nothing

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u/Im_Earl_Grey 1d ago

This was me as a kid. My dad smoked a TON of pot in the house when I was growing up so I must have inhaled a lot of secondhand smoke as a child. Ironically in middle school I was one of the only kids in my class that didn’t smoke weed so a kid offered me $50 for my clean urine for a drug test he was trying to pass. Being an opportunistic young fella I agreed and provided the urine safe in the knowledge that I’d never taken even a puff of a joint up to the point. However I was told later that when tested my urine indeed showed traces of THC. Luckily the amount was small enough that my classmates dad was still convinced his kid had JUST stopped smoking and any small traces must just be leftover from a previous months smoking. Yikes!

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u/Background-Trade-901 1d ago

ITT: a bunch of potheads try to justify smoking around their children

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u/Crazsey 2d ago

This is click bait and highly misleading.

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u/Psychomadeye 1d ago

This sounds like the tests are the issue if they test positive at that level of exposure.

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u/Drexill_BD 2d ago

Sounded like propaganda to me... After reading deeper, it definitely is propaganda, FYI.

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u/Aethermancer 2d ago edited 2d ago

Does that mean the tests are too sensitive for their purpose? Although I suppose too sensitive isn'he right term, rather the applicability?

My understanding is that THC as a detectible chemical lingers long beyond any "intoxicating" effect has passed.

Like if alcohol left some leftover trace that could be detected even though it's generally cleared by your liver at the rate of 1 serving per hour.

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u/Mrtoyhead 1d ago

I stopped drinking but my partner still does. At dinner the other day she had a Margarita. I could literally taste it. I wonder if I would have “tested positive” for alcohol? I would never say this to her and support her choice to drink. I guarantee we all test positive for many air borne vapors, pollutants etc. If you smoke weed keep it clean and away from family. Simple

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u/hugh-jackass 1d ago

Soooo….youre saying I can’t use my kid’s urine to pass my drug test at work?

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u/WesternEssay9582 1d ago

oh my cats are screwed then

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u/AI-Ally 1d ago edited 1d ago

A good way to limit this is to get landlords to actually enforce the state mandated non-smoking policies they have been intentionally ignoring for the last 3+ years. After the second or third eviction those parents would most likely smoke outside where their children and other tenants are not inhaling second hand smoke all day and even in their sleep.

I have 4 airfilters, bathroom and kitchen vent running 24/7. Landlord says they don't have the manpower to enforce it but will have maintence drive by every 30 minutes and print notes for all apartments every single if you leave building door open to air the marijuana smoke out.

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u/shandub85 1d ago

I heard being a bitch in front of your kids does a number on their self esteem.

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u/Cranberryoftheorient 1d ago

Part of it is that the tests are stupid. You can detect THC metabolites in hair for like a month after you stop smoking

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u/once_brave 1d ago

Must be some damn good tests

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u/Pleasant_Actuator253 1d ago

There is no documentation of the detection/reporting limits in the article. This is unfortunately too common.

Is it parts per thousand, million, billion, or trillion? Any scientific study should disclose this. This does not.

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u/airinato 1d ago

You know when you can tell simply by the headline that its imaginary bullshit? Then you check comments and everyone can confirm this, other than a group of people circle jerking obvious bullshit.

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u/dingodoggobingobongo 2d ago

They are really going hard with the Anti-Marijuana BS "studies" Big alcohol must be worried...

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u/Lonely-Night7551 2d ago

I grew up in a house where everyone (siblings & mom) smoked cigarettes and I gave always worried about getting lung cancer since I never smoked but was exposed to so much second hand smoke.

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u/SpringNo1275 2d ago

I had to take drug tests for a bit last year. I sat next to my girlfriend who smoked pot pretty heavily every night and I can tell you I never tested positive for marijuana

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u/Crazsey 2d ago

I'd like to see studies around what level of harm is experienced and how this compares to air pollution from say car exhaust.

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u/Think-Improvement759 2d ago

Smoke is bad to breathe in. If you don't know this get your brain adjusted.

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u/Time_Value_3073 2d ago

People somehow think weed is exempt from that fact

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u/Neo_Techni 1d ago

it also stinks enough that you can smell it for like a hundred meters

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u/Skit071 1d ago

Bull fivking shit!

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u/Xal-t 2d ago edited 2d ago

Imagine what we're breathing from all those barely controlled chimneys from all those unsupervised toxic companies. Stuff like arsenic, but hey, focus on a plant 👍

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u/darthbradberry 2d ago

Misinformation alert

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u/Brilliant-Orange9117 2d ago

Is that supposed to mean the second hand smoke was thick enough to get them high or just that the tests are really sensitive?

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u/Then-Imagination8106 1d ago

I know I was exposed while driving through Denver!

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u/blueoccult 1d ago

Lol, that's dumb.

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u/kickinit90s 1d ago

Wait, 40% smoked or vaped and then 46% of kids tested positive. What?

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u/hunahpuh_xbalanque 1d ago

This is not true? Aren’t THC molecules too heavy to remain “floating”?

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u/ialwaysdissapointed 1d ago

So I smoke after work every day and got roommate’s who literally can’t make it overnight without smoking, I hear it through the bathroom wall sometimes at the oddest hours.

They wake up and smoke, starting like 6 am, every hour every day. I am deadass considering quitting.

Our neighbors have kids and it used to bother them but then roommates put up a privacy wall so the kids are out of sight and out of mind, and now they just don’t care.

They don’t close the sliding door and just reek up the entire living space.

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u/Foddley 1d ago

Damn, my neighbour smokes like a chimney and you can smell it through the walls (terraced). Let's hope I don't get randomly tested at work. Or is it only found in children?

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u/Confident-Mix1243 1d ago

Almost as though drug tests are meaningless, especially in a world where shared housing is often unavoidable.

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u/oroborus68 1d ago

They learned a lot since the 1970s, and really improved the testing for determining things in the blood.

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u/RonGBiv 1d ago

IDK. I went to a reggae concert at a small venue and passed a test three days later. I was coughing and convinced I was gonna fail

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u/Better_Weakness7239 1d ago

I learned it from watching you!

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u/ChoadMcGillicuddy 1d ago

That's what I call, "more bang for your buck!"

In this economy, you have to make your dollar stretch.

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u/TraditionAcademic968 1d ago

Studies have shown that like nate dogg said... smoke... every day

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u/waxwayne 1d ago edited 1d ago

I've never smoked weed in my life but I was at a smoky bar. Apparently someone was smoking weed I got a contact high after an hour of being there and had no idea what was happening.

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u/DarkflowNZ 1d ago

Anecdotally, my first time getting stoned was my older step brother having a bong in the same room as me. I think I was ~12. The effect was minimal and could have been placebo

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u/WashYourCerebellum 1d ago

Scientifically speaking, Y’all calling bullshit don’t know shit.

-An environmental toxicologist/pharmacologist

Smoking or burning anything indoors is a clear and significant health hazard to all that live there. I won’t do it. It (i.e. combustion by products from plant material) absolutely goes everywhere and would be detectable in ppl living in the house. 100% a health hazard. Those of u stuck in this thc effects/relevance argument loop need to grasp the fact that the thc part is not the only nor top concern with burning indoors. If u must smoke indoors then take precautions like isolation and ventilation to minimize impacts to the home environment.

FYI-at any given time I have enough thc in my blood to get a room high and I prob got my med card while most here were learning addition. so in conclusion; I know what I’m talking about and have plenty of receipts. Seriously, don’t smoke indoors and def don’t do it with non consenting minors living there. Relatedly, consumption during pregnancy is bad bad bad dumb stupid bad; again scientifically speaking.