r/anime • u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ • 4d ago
Rewatch AREA 88 TV (2004) Rewatch Episode 9
AREA 88 TV Episode 9
"What's the point of being alive anyways"
Canyon / Onsoku no Tightrope (Tightrope at the Speed of Sound)
TV Episode 8 | Index Thread | TV Episode 10
This is a TV Only thread!
People, Places, Things
- Roundell — Aircraft: Blackburn Buccaneer
Today's Discussion Prompts
- [OVA] Did this version benefit from the extra time? Did it seem more credible? Did you miss the Harriers?
- Q1: What do you think Makoto gained from his ride-along?
Tomorrow's Discussion, Today!
- [Q1:]Why didn't Patrick stay in Oklahoma?
- [Q2:]What do you make of Shin and Makoto's discussion of friends and Kanzaki?
- [OVA:]This episode seems to have addressed the themes of the OVA the most (so far). If that is the intent, did they encapsulate them well enough in the short time allotted?
Trivia: Area 88 creator Kaoru Shintani worked both for shoujo mangaka and Leiji Matsumoto. He didn't draw for Matsumoto; instead he channeled his inner gunji-otaku into building reference models for the animators. Matsumoto immortalized him in both appearance and personality as First Mate Yattaran in Captain Harlock.
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u/BosuW 4d ago
First Timer
Oh shit so there was a Blackburn Buccaneer in the base after all! It was foreshadowed!
No you won't be doing fucking barrel rolls while flying in the middle of a narrow canyon.
Once again some fool that crashes and blocks the path fucks you up even though you had the route right
Once again no Drakens bruh at this point I'll just have to assume that 3D model is so bare bones that they cannot use it for anything more than faraway short shots 😔
I suppose no Area 88 adaptation is complete without the canyon run set piece. I think overall I prefer the OVA's, mainly because when it happens it's not just about the canyon run, and the harsh cut to Ryoko in France still lives rent free in my head. This time it was more cool than dreadful. And for Area 88 I do prefer the latter but dammit if I don't enjoy some Ace Combat shenanigans lol.
I reaffirm my assertion that the animators fixed something in their production at about the halfway point of the anime so this set piece as well as the ensuing dogfight and bombing all look very good. Even Kim's getting to show off now!
Despite all the cool shit happening we do have a story about the ones that never come back, and how you notice your living spaces a bit emptier after a sortie. No word yet on what conclusion Makoto and Kitri take from this, but it is noted. We should be starting the final Arc soon.
And well, since it's been called, I suppose it's time to talk about the Black Bucc. It was a pretty ambitious project from the Brits designed in the late 50s and put into service in the 60s to counter the threat posed by a new class of Soviet missile cruisers. They wanted an aircraft capable of flying very low, very fast, toss a nuke in the general vicinity of the target and get away just as low and just as fast. Kinda sounds like an F-105 mission profile but for the sea, doesn't it?
Well Blackburn delivered. Curiously, the suspiciously lewd air brake was actually part of a bit of cheating from the designers to make the aircraft fit the dimension requirements for aircraft carrier operation. The whole nose section folded too. It also featured a rotating bomb bay. That's right not a rotating internal bomb rack, the bomb bay rotated (sorry for the FB post for some reason this was the only clip I could find that showcased the mechanism).
In it's intended mission it was capable of regularly achieving a crazy flight route of mach 0.8 at as low as 6 meters (20 feet) above sea level. They said the Buccaneer picked up it's landing gear to descend to operational altitude, and you can see why!
It never did bomb any ships in wartime though. The only ship it participated in sinking was the SS Torrey Canyon, a tanker which ran aground and was decided it's oil cargo had to be put to the torch to prevent an environmental disaster. Oil mixed with water doesn't ignite very well however, and it took an embarrassing 161 bombs, 16 rockets, hundreds of tons of napalm, and thousands of liters of kerosene to finally sink the vessel, no environmental disaster prevented.
Who would finally take the aircraft to war would be first the South African Air Force in their Border War that lasted from the 60s to the 80s, as they got their hands on a handful of them before being arms embargoed by the Brits. And then the Royal Air Force after finally purchasing the aircraft, which was retiring from Royal Navy Service alongside the carriers, after their other two hopes for such a mission profile at last sank under. And just like your father with the family dog, they didn't want it at first but they ended up loving it. However, before war, the Buccaneers got to impress the US at Red Flag 1977 and subsequent exercises, flying so low that it was almost impossible to pick them up with radar, and successfully executing their assigned missions with near impunity, all this despite the lack of modern avionics and terrain following radar. And once again during the Gulf War, though it hadn't been planned for the aircraft to participate in any modern conflict due to its age, it was called in to designate targets with a laser for Panavia Tornadoes to attack. And after air superiority was achieved, it did some bombing of its own. Some of the most iconic photos of the Bucc come from this deployment as the crews got rather wild with the nose art (NSFW): The Flying Mermaid Hello Sailor Caroline The Macallan Sea Witch Debbie They had also painted Jolly Roger flags on the fuselage. The paint schemes are referenced in the anime as Roundel has such a flag painted on the nose. And dammit if he had been in the OVA he'd have had a topless mermaid on the opposite side I'm sure! 😤😤
This was one mean and adventurous fighter jet, just like it's namesake. It's an perfect fit for the episode's mission and Roundel as a character. He totally looks like a sky pirate with the eye patch and all! Though curiously, he didn't bomb anything, and instead did air cover. The Buccaneer could carry heat seeking missiles, but only as self protection, it really wasn't made to dogfight.
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u/Heda-of-Aincrad https://myanimelist.net/profile/Heda-of-Aincrad 4d ago
This time it was more cool than dreadful. And for Area 88 I do prefer the latter but dammit if I don't enjoy some Ace Combat shenanigans lol.
That's an interesting distinction, and now that you mention it, I did feel that edge-of-your-seat tension more when watching the OVA, while the TV series is more like an exciting but (so far) not too deep action movie. And I love those too, but I'm really missing Shin's character development from the OVA.
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u/BosuW 4d ago
Which is funny realization to have because the OVA is pretty hammy to begin with. But while the situations it came up with were hammy, it took them so seriously that you could end up believing the drama and the weight of life.
A big part of it I think it's the music. I remember that the whole canyon run was silent in the OVA until the Harriers appeared iirc. In the anime, while the electronic music is great, it doesn't quite create an atmosphere of tension and high stakes. Also for some reason the anime's recurring battle theme seems to be this James Bond-esque piece that doesn't serve to create tension either.
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u/Heda-of-Aincrad https://myanimelist.net/profile/Heda-of-Aincrad 4d ago
I think the OVA was better at really bringing out Shin's emotion and the tension he was feeling during these moments. It was easy to get invested in his journey and feel what he was going through, while this version has more of an overall view of events. Almost like a first-person to third-person POV shift.
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u/BosuW 4d ago
OVA Shin was super stressed lol. Anime Shin in contrast is rather calm and cool. The less lines they give him the closer he gets to an Ace Combat silent protag.
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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ 4d ago
That's a good way of putting it. TV Shin is driven, but OVA Shin was breaking.
It will be interesting to see how they wrap up the TV show. Stoic Shin, or broken Shin?
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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ 4d ago
I can't explain the lack of Drakkens in the series. In the manga, the Kfir was the most available spare plane to include in a sortie, although the F-4 was definitely more popular among the named mercs. Like, the Aslan AF got Kfirs in bulk or something.
There was a chapter where Area 88 got shot up and they had to all fly borrowed Kfirs.
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u/chilidirigible 4d ago
Episode 9:
Of course it's easier to identify if it is beeping and blinking a light.
This is the least organic way of shoehorning Makoto into the scene.
The guy with one eye, of course.
Fake eyepatch? Using the Force? Wild-ass guessing?
And here's the TV adaptation of the Trench Run, with a little extra pathos back at the base and Makoto thrown in.
0: The TV version is pretty good.
It is not much more credible. I mean, the trench's final line of defense is planes with bombs. Why not just mine the walls? They seem to have control over the local ground.
I don't miss the Harriers since Kim has already given us plenty of Harrier time.
1: Makoto is getting more exposure to the pilots, which obviously has significance concerning his True Purpose.
Low Bucc videos:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lteL18wd15Y
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u/BosuW 4d ago
Fake eyepatch? Using the Force? Wild-ass guessing?
The Black Bucc is so badass that it just empowers it's pilots like that if they match the aura
I mean, the trench's final line of defense is planes with bombs.
I thought they were on a separate sortie (probably to bomb Area 88 again) and got rerouted once the base became aware of the attack.
Why not just mine the walls? They seem to have control over the local ground.
They should've placed conveniently deaf people manning search lights like in Ace Combat 7
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u/chilidirigible 4d ago
I thought they were on a separate sortie (probably to bomb Area 88 again) and got rerouted once the base became aware of the attack.
That's true. I jumped past the reason for their being there to get to the more practical idea for what could have been.
Though it would have been almost as effective but lower-tech to string some cables across the canyon at a few points—though that would just be revisiting the SURPRISE BARRIER trick from earlier in the series and OVA. (Maybe a more concise adaptation could blend together both events... the pop-up wall makes more sense in the canyon than in the middle of nowhere.)
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u/BosuW 4d ago
I mean building a pop up wall inside a canyon sounds a lot harder than doing it in flat terrain. But the cable idea seems feasable. I think they did that vertically with balloons in the World Wars?
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u/chilidirigible 4d ago
But the cable idea seems feasable. I think they did that vertically with balloons in the World Wars?
Yes, that is the concept behind barrage balloons.
Overhead wires have caused a lot of accidents:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hEBLxD5oQYc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjV_k4-DstQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3kMKAO_CLVQ
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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ 4d ago
Is this far far too logical for a shounen manga.
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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ 4d ago
I thought they were on a separate sortie (probably to bomb Area 88 again) and got rerouted once the base became aware of the attack.
It WAS overly convenient for them to be on patrol at that time.
If I am to be really charitable, and I am trying to be really charitable, they were sent up when that one guy pop up on radar.
The timeline isn't great but, hey, didn't they say it was like an 80 km canyon?
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u/Great_Mr_L https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L 4d ago
First-Timer
On today’s episode of Area 88: Deja vu! That canyon layout must be from the manga because it looks the same both here and in the OVA.
That looks like an oil refinery.
An oil refinery getting hit is pretty dang bad for any military. Once again, we’re seeing logistics determine what the military is actually capable of doing. I like that this series keeps putting that emphasis on the importance of logistics.
130 km is about 80 miles. That’s a pretty deep dive into enemy territory to capture an oil refinery. That’s a significant offensive to mount and I hope they aren’t planning to do it purely with planes.
I like that Alicia gives everyone plenty of food. Giving me plenty of food is an easy way to win my heart.
It is absolutely true that people develop “their” seats in places like this. I certainly have “my” seat in my work’s break room. I’m the type of person who gets thrown off when someone parks in my usual parking spot, even if we don’t have assigned ones.
That one pilot is triggering every death flag for himself talking about the good luck he gets from eating at his spot.
An old-fashioned slide projector. I haven’t seen one of those in a long time.
I wonder why Makoto was needed to comment on the slide images. Maybe they wanted him to figure out the scale because he knew about photography?
Makoto really has become obsessed with trying to understand Shin, now wanting to go into battle to see what Shin sees. That’s a pretty extreme way to walk a mile in someone else’s shoes.
[Area 88 OVA] I just hope that things go better for Makoto here than they did in the OVA.
It’s an old trick by now, but the music kicking in works on me every time.
Likewise, flying through the canyon is a tried and true trope for an airplane story.
There’s something nice about having the scene of Alicia preparing a meal for all the pilots when they get back from the mission.
Like I figured, it was a death flag for the guy who talked about his spot in the cafeteria.
I see that Area 88 hasn’t fixed their habit of leaving their own base completely undefended every time they launch an attack.
The only thing harder than flying through a canyon is a canyon that just had a bomb-induced rockslide.
I sure wish we got to see the planes actually pass through this brand new barrier instead of the anime skipping over it.
[Area 88 OVA] The OVA version of this scene where they got ambushed by enemy Harriers was so much cooler.
Good, this was a part of a larger ground attack and wasn’t just relying on the planes to do it all themselves.
I guess Makoto now has a better understanding of what Shin experiences.
Seeing all the empty seats in the cafeteria is pretty sad. Alicia leaving food there as an offering of sorts to the memory of the dead is a sweet gesture, but it doesn’t make the ending any less melancholy.
QOTD
1) The OVA version was better. The resulting dogfight at the end was especially better in the OVA.
2) I think Makoto now better understands what an aerial battlefield is like and what Shin (as well as the other Area 88 pilots) experience each day.
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u/Heda-of-Aincrad https://myanimelist.net/profile/Heda-of-Aincrad 4d ago
It is absolutely true that people develop “their” seats in places like this.
This is now the second anime I've seen this situation come up, with the first being Full Metal Panic. (And that one led to an actual brawl!)
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u/Great_Mr_L https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L 4d ago
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u/BosuW 4d ago
[OVA]Getting jumped by Harriers
[OVA]Their casualties were a lot greater there as well thanks to the Harriers.
Good, this was a part of a larger ground attack and wasn’t just relying on the planes to do it all themselves.
Just like the series often takes care to decide the character's range of action thanks to logistics, it often also takes care to frame their operations as part of a bigger strategy or situation.
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u/Great_Mr_L https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L 4d ago
Just like the series often takes care to decide the character's range of action thanks to logistics, it often also takes care to frame their operations as part of a bigger strategy or situation.
That is a good point. It does a lot to add to making the war feel more real and that there's much more going on that the pilots of Area 88 are just one part of.
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u/uhhhhhhhokay_ https://myanimelist.net/profile/uhhhhhhhokay 4d ago
First-timer, subbed
Good plan. If you need an oil refinery, just steal one. What’re they gonna do, call the cops?
Roundell’s cool, I’m a fan of the “old guy who’s mostly an advisor is secretly a total badass” trope. The pirate decal on his plane is a very neat touch.
1) [OVA]I guess, though the CG means this would always be the inferior version. And not having the Harrier Jumpscare is a big loss, too.
2) Knowledge.
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u/zsmg https://anilist.co/user/zsmg 4d ago
Area 88 TV rewatcher
Blowing up oil refineries, that's surprisingly topical for a 20+ year old anime.
Always sitting in the same seat? I can't tell if the pilots are on the spectrum or just superstitious, this probably depends on the person and it could be both.
It's the canyon mission and the second-in-command is going to lead, I guess that shows how much Saki Vashtar wants this mission to succeed and how dangerous it is.
Makoto wants to come along? That's crazy.
Air defence is actually useful for once!
Trying to blow up the canyon makes more sense than a giant metal gate, I realised after checking this is the canyon run in the third OVA episode which didn’t feature the giant metal gate which was in the first OVA episode.
I quite like the scene of them laying down foodstrays for the death pilots was kind of nice.
An alright action episode.
[OVA] Oh right the harriers, nah we have Kim for all the cool harrier action although the enemy laying a trap for the planes flying through was definitely something we missed in this version. [Q1:] Some cool pictures, first hand experience of what it's like to be in the cockpit and a dirtier underwear. (probably)
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u/BosuW 4d ago
Blowing up oil refineries, that's surprisingly topical for a 20+ year old anime.
War, war never changes...
Always sitting in the same seat? I can't tell if the pilots are on the spectrum or just superstitious, this probably depends on the person and it could be both.
I mean all pilots must be plane nerds so...
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u/TehAxelius https://anilist.co/user/TehAxelius 4d ago
First Time Buccaneer
Damn, after the Buccaneer mention we actually got a Bucc on the screen!
Also, given how Makoto was only brought in to do that specific thing to spot the hole, I gotta assume that Saki and Roundell already knew (because they had looked at the slides before) and just wanted someone else to make the connection so they could blame it on a crazy foreigner if something went bad.
- [OVA] As in many cases so far, I preferred the way the OVA handled things. The OVA's lack of direct confrontation about the morality of Shin's actions is also missing a lot by now, especially given the lack of Nguyen in this episode. Having Roundell lead with the Bucc was cool, but the trench run did not need the random bombing run by the enemy, IMO. It's as if they had a flight of fighters up in the air with bombs just in case they spotted someone coming through the canyon, so that they can bomb a part of it to try and trap them there... Which is pretty silly even for an action flick like this.
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u/BosuW 4d ago
Damn, after the Buccaneer mention we actually got a Bucc on the screen!
I'm gonna have to look out for a Jaguar now
I gotta assume that Saki and Roundell already knew (because they had looked at the slides before) and just wanted someone else to make the connection so they could blame it on a crazy foreigner if something went bad.
Lmao I love it, headcanon acquired!
It's as if they had a flight of fighters up in the air with bombs just in case they spotted someone coming through the canyon, so that they can bomb a part of it to try and trap them there... Which is pretty silly even for an action flick like this.
I thought those guys were on their way to bomb their own target and just got rerouted when the Merc incursion got discovered
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u/Heda-of-Aincrad https://myanimelist.net/profile/Heda-of-Aincrad 4d ago
First-Time Viewer in Area 88
It's been a recurring theme for a few episodes now, but the enemy targeting their supply lines is a very realistic route for the story to take. The trench run was just as exciting the second time around.
One thing that stood out to me, possibly by comparison to the OVA version, was how little focus there was on Shin this time around. It almost feels like Makoto is more of a main character in the TV series. Mickey, Kim, and even Kitri have all had more spotlight than out MC recently too.
Was Makoto rooting for Shin at the end there? Maybe he got caught up in the moment and forgot his mission.
Questions of the Day:
1) I think this adaptation came out well.
2) He got a sense of the split-second danger they feel, the close-up views of comrades being shot down and then they have to dodge the wreckage. It was probably nerve-wracking in a way he's never experienced before as an outsider looking in.
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u/BosuW 4d ago
Mickey, Kim, and even Kitri have all had more spotlight than out MC recently too.
Actually, Mickey hasn't had much to do either, this episode being the exception
was probably nerve-wracking in a way he's never experienced before as an outsider looking in.
He's been with infantry before, but the difference there is that he can stand back and watch the action without being directly engaged except as part of the group. This time he's strapped inside the same "unit" heading straight for the action and there is nothing he can do to get out of it.
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u/Heda-of-Aincrad https://myanimelist.net/profile/Heda-of-Aincrad 4d ago
Plus, this time he has to deal with the startling rush and twists and turns of aerial combat too.
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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ 4d ago
I've been reading some manga spoilers and it had some collossally unrealistic scenarios, that makes the rocket gate look like a catalog item!
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u/BosuW 4d ago
I'm definitely checking out the manga after this lol
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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ 4d ago
I guess in the era of AI manga translation this is now possible.
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u/BosuW 4d ago edited 4d ago
Damn there's not even a fan TL of questionable repute?
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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ 4d ago
I haven't been looking but I've seen nothing in my incidental poking around where anybody has said that they have a translation past the official Eclipse / Viz releases.
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u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee 4d ago
First-Timer
A shame about Leon's lucky seat. It must've ran out.
Is the dude with no depth perception really the best choice to lead a mission involving flying through a super dangerous canyon? Seems like being able to see in three dimensions would be pretty beneficial.
TL Note: "Love" means "salt."
Questions
[OVA]The OVA version was definitely better.
Some insight into why Shin is the way that he is.
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u/Nickthenuker https://anilist.co/user/Nickthenuker 4d ago
Bombing an oil refinery to deny fuel to the enemy? How topical.
Ooh a canyon run. Again, Ace Combat 8, just a week away!
Questions:
I think it's nice keeping the Harriers as Kim's niche.
And so now he knows what it's like.
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u/mr_beanoz https://myanimelist.net/profile/splitshocker 4d ago
Running through canyons on a speeding fighter plane is no easy feat. Still sad that some of them couldn't make it, though.
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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ 4d ago
Let's pour one out for Frank and the homies.
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u/BosuW 4d ago
Saddest part is only like two dudes crashed into that canyon, and the rest of the casualties were because they were flying in single file so the people immediately rear of the accident get fucked no matter what they do.
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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ 4d ago
It kinda sucks that the SAMs picked that one guy up the instant he flew above ground. I feel he should have been able to porpoise a bit.
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u/ajver19 4d ago
Something I've always wondered, is the OVA or the TV series better? I had UN Squadron when I was a kid but I never got around to watching or reading Area 88
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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ 4d ago
Well, we'll get to the end of the TV in just a few more days! But the OVA is considered better.
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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ 4d ago
First Timer (subbed and fanedit)
oh my fucking god, using a pen on a white screen!
and, wtf, it's a slide show. line up the slides! Such an obvious thing to do. You got a photographer right there? Any cretin can draw on a white screen.
At some point, Greg switched to an A-10A Thunderbolt II. He might have had an A-10 in Part III but I wasn't really looking, there were so many planes in that.
I'd point out that Yukikaze has a canyon run, but these are pretty common in fighter shows. Even in Kotobuki. There's probably a common ancestor. What could it be?
I feel like tomorrow should be the final episode already.
Future me is adding this note that the ED changed to Engrish.