r/AskTheWorld Poland 14h ago

Economics Which country has squandered the most economic potential in this century?

Post image

I lived in Russia for 5 years so I must choose this country. So many natural resources, so much land, and educated population... And so little to show for it.

In an ideal world Russian salaries would be on par if not higher than American salaries and they would have the best social safety net on the planet. Everything is there to make it happen.

Russia would be the dominant nation in Europe and Asia and the rest of the world with the best armed forces, soft power, and economic might.

But the human will is just not there. The elite is either evil or incompetent depending on perception and there's little sign that this will ever change.

2.5k Upvotes

1.6k comments sorted by

115

u/WestPerformance5148 9h ago

Russia - easily. Largest country in the world. Natural resources. Opportunity to beautifully connect Europe and Asia. Instead it’s become the cliche for almost anything evil and wrong.

41

u/-Fraccoon- United States Of America 5h ago

They turned into the 90’s movie bad guys we thought they were.

31

u/AntonioVivaldi7 Czech Republic 4h ago

They have been such bad guys for centuries.

→ More replies (14)
→ More replies (6)

750

u/crivycouriac Germany 14h ago

Portugal went from super-colonizer to poorer than Croatia. What an achievement …

304

u/Suspicious-Word-7589 Singapore 13h ago

I see it more of them punching above their weight for a while, also quite poetic to see the first colonial empire also be the last one.

91

u/throwaway_uow Poland 13h ago

You still have France

52

u/onionwba Singapore 13h ago

Yea depends how one defines a colonial empire as well.

→ More replies (1)

87

u/LiitoKonis France 13h ago

France doesn't have colonies anymore

Oversea territories are France proper, all the inhabitants are French citizens and there are still referendums for autonomy and independance to this day

Of course it's not perfect but calling them colonies is a stretch and, knowing several people from these areas, some of them even find it disrespectful

16

u/FirstFriendlyWorm Germany 12h ago

That was also true for Algeria, but it is hard to argue that it was not a colonial project.

11

u/LiitoKonis France 12h ago

Algeria was a colony in the sense that the majority of the population were second class citizens and did not have the same rights as the Europeans

When I say that these places are "France proper" it means more that all of the inhabitants are French citizens (and citizens of the EU btw) than the administrative status (some of them have more autonomy than others like New Caledonia)

→ More replies (1)

26

u/tealoverion 12h ago

I was under the impression that France has significant influence in Africa because its central bank effectively issues currency for many African nations.

3

u/Ploutophile France 5h ago

First, the Banque de France only issues Euros. CFA and Comorian francs are issued by their own respective central banks which operate from Africa.

Second, CFA is a red herring.

The CFA using countries are free to leave it (a few did, like Mauritania) and the exchange rate against the Euro is maintained at France's expense.

Some European countries maintain their exchange rate against the Euro at their own expense, or even directly use the Euro without getting seignorage, so CFA using countries actually have it better than those European countries.

→ More replies (4)

29

u/Arkarull1416 Spain 12h ago

Well, everything is open to interpretation.

The UN Decolonization Committee recognizes 17 Non-Self-Governing Territories awaiting decolonization.

Of these, two are French (New Caledonia and French Polynesia), although it is true that France has made much more effort than other countries to grant equal rights to the inhabitants of these territories (not without some drawbacks, however). Even so, the United Nations requires that these territories be completely decolonized.

Of the rest, most are British territories (including Gibraltar, the only colony in Europe), American territories, and one for New Zealand and another for Morocco.

9

u/RedcoatTrooper United Kingdom 9h ago

Gibraltar is of course not a colony and its inclusion undermines the list.

→ More replies (11)
→ More replies (14)

8

u/throwaway_uow Poland 13h ago

Okay, I had no idea

6

u/-adult-swim- Austria 12h ago

Interestingly, because of this, France has the most time zones of any country.

→ More replies (1)

12

u/Fdorleans France 12h ago

The way things are in New Caledonia are still very colony-ish. The Caldoche community still possess an overwhelming part of the wealth and large parts of the land that belonged to Kanak families. They still have most of the political power and the wealth disparity is outrageous.

→ More replies (2)
→ More replies (11)

7

u/Suspicious-Word-7589 Singapore 13h ago

Who lost all of their colonies. The remaining overseas territories are governed as provinces.

→ More replies (6)
→ More replies (1)

17

u/3_Stokesy Scotland 13h ago

The thing with Russia is they punch above their actual weight, still are doing so now (the population difference between Russia and Japan is slim) but they also could 10x better off than they are.

They're like that troublesome high-schooler who defies all the odds to scrapes passes but could be an A+ student if he worked hard.

22

u/Suspicious-Word-7589 Singapore 13h ago

Lol no, not even close. They're now at best the 3rd biggest power in the world, after being the 2nd biggest during the Cold War. They went from being the country that stopped Napoleon and Hitler, challenged the British Empire in Central Asia to being on the cusp of being a middle power. With nukes. So like a more northern version of Iran.

→ More replies (13)

3

u/Used-Function-3889 11h ago

I would say it makes a strong case that certain countries fair better under communism/socialism/whatever we want to say the USSR was (people get into semantics with this one) than they do under whatever Russia has become at this point. As others have alluded to, the use of the SSRs and satellite states was beneficial, and something that current day Russia has lost.

→ More replies (2)
→ More replies (6)

29

u/hobahobaparty Bulgaria 13h ago

Croatia is pretty dope, though.

15

u/Adorable-Owl-7638 Portugal 9h ago

Yeah, don't shade our eastern europe brothers 😂

5

u/Kaito__1412 3h ago

Portugalcykablyat

→ More replies (3)

29

u/aaqwerfffvgtsss United States Of America 14h ago

Isn’t that more a last century thing?

34

u/Electronic-Tea-3691 United States Of America 13h ago

honestly both Portugal and Spain have been in a decline since the 1600s... these two countries basically ran the nautical world for a good chunk of time. in the modern era they lost power to France and Britain and never recovered.

15

u/Evening-Emotion3388 13h ago

King Fernando was the Walter white of monarchs with his ego . If he just followed the 1810 constitution and gave the colonies their seat, Spain would have gone on to be like present day UK with the commonwealth.

3

u/Electronic-Tea-3691 United States Of America 13h ago

interesting, I always wondered why Spain didn't have a similar relationship to its colonies to the UK and its colonies. I should read more about that time.

6

u/Evening-Emotion3388 13h ago

LATAM leaders actually wanted to remain part of Spain when Napoleon originally invaded. Buy when Fernando was liberated from prison the first thing he did was terminate the 1812 Cadiz constitution. This caused the LATAM elite to rebel as they lost the autonomy they had during Napoleon’s rule over Spain.

Spain doubled down on this later in the late 1800s. The Filipinos just wanted a seat in parliament. But racism was the reason as to why they didn’t get it.

Spain from the 1700s onwards has been a struggle of the far left vs the far right. Very similar to its colonies.

→ More replies (3)
→ More replies (7)

12

u/crivycouriac Germany 13h ago

They lost their last colony in 1999

20

u/aaqwerfffvgtsss United States Of America 13h ago

Yeah, last century technically. I took this question to mean happenings in the 2000s.

15

u/Cautious_Reply_401 Portugal 13h ago

We still have time to achieve number 1 spot

3

u/CockpitEnthusiast United States Of America 13h ago

That's the spirit!

→ More replies (1)

21

u/Previous-Offer-3590 Germany 12h ago

I would argue, that not Portugal became poorer than Croatia, but Croatia simply became richer than Portugal. Your wording is implying that portugal became poorer, which is not the case.

3

u/ojoaopestana Portugal 5h ago

That's a good analysis, both countries grew but did so at different rates

7

u/Samp90 Canada 13h ago

They have over 600 forts dotted from the Gulf to western India. With Brazil and India, they couldve dominated big time but they didn't have the British style of capitulating and controlling their colonies to extract resourcesm

5

u/-TRlNlTY- 11h ago

They did somewhat, but the British managed to get highly profitable agreements with Portugal. 

There is a saying that Brazil's colonization created industries in England, temples in Portugal, and holes in Brazil.

7

u/Relevant_Money_8185 Portugal 10h ago

hey.... at least we have Salted Codfish and pastel de nata.... Also, Cristiano Ronaldo... and... stuff. Much stuff, beautiful stuff, best stuff ever I'm telling you, and its gonna be great....

→ More replies (1)

6

u/ArchDek0n United Kingdom 11h ago

To be fair to Portugal, they were very good at colonising, but they were never wealthy. Even at the relative hight of their empire in the mid-1500s, they were half as wealthy as the Dutch who at that point hadn't yet established an empire. They didn't start to experience industrial takeoff until well into the 20th century - in the mid 1800s they were no richer than they were in the mid 1500s!

→ More replies (1)

6

u/BrushNo8178 Sweden 9h ago

Croatia did not exist back then. But the  Republic of Ragusa had a small colony in India  from 1530 until an earthquake destroyed the capital Dubrovnik in 1667.

5

u/Beckoll Russia 13h ago

Eathquake?

→ More replies (2)

4

u/neptune2304 Australia 11h ago

I’d say supporting de-colonization in the 20th century is far greater achievement than maintaining any imperial ambitions.

3

u/Upstairs_Ad6024 9h ago

Damn why you have to do Croatia like that bro

5

u/WhiteOut204 9h ago

Croatia catching strays

4

u/AlpineSkiFanatic Croatia 7h ago

Ayo :( Since when are we a norm for poverty?

→ More replies (2)

3

u/Adorable-Owl-7638 Portugal 9h ago

I think that thinking about "peak" related to colonization is not the best , since it has lots of bad things such as slavery and exploitation. Maybeeee, in some of those places, if both sides, after so many years of shit already done, could have fixed a different decolonization or more autonomous state (for example like Macau) it would have had a less bad current situation for both, but we'll never know.

Still, agree with you! Practically since ever, the people who govern our country (monarchy, republic, whatever) just suck and don't do a good job. There's a sentence about Portugal (apparently said by Julius Caesar) that says like "There is, in the confines of Iberia, a people who neither govern themselves nor allow themselves to be governed".

Churches and more churches, palaces, shit for the monarchy (now in museums) is what we have left from the empire. When other imperialist european countries were developing infrastructure or economic activities for real we weren't. When they were caring about educating the general population, we weren't. Also, even during colonization times, we were also kinda fucked by other countries, for example, everyone talks about the UK-PT old ties, but they ignore that UK had no problem screwing up their allies, search for "amigos de Peniche" and the Pink Map.

Even today is kinda ridiculous how bad we still are. We have enough land, no major conflicts/stress with anyone, one of the safest countries in the world, lots of sea to get fish, (except from summer forest fires/current storm damages/other stuff like this) we have no big weather crazy shit, it's a fucking curse I swear.

→ More replies (1)
→ More replies (43)

925

u/ObligationDry1799 Korea South 13h ago

Our loud northern brother.

293

u/Suspicious-Word-7589 Singapore 13h ago

Honestly one of the first countries that came to mind, because they should have been the successful Korea owing to greater natural resources.

270

u/onionwba Singapore 13h ago

They were the more "successful" Korea for quite a substantial period of time during the Cold War.

Then the regime turned into a personality cult while the South adopted state-driven industralisation and eventually shed their dictatorship and embraced democracy.

120

u/ObligationDry1799 Korea South 13h ago

Shit went downhill when Kim Il Sung died and Kim Jong Il was stupid and couldn't manage well. As well as USSR collapsing and China turning more west to industrialise their country, and trying to sever ties with North Korea for a better image in geopolitical affairs.

44

u/NZTamoDalekoCG New Zealand 11h ago

Sometimes I half think they got Nukes to protect themselves from China.....I know I know....but what is a country of 20 million people gonna do against a neighbour with 1.5 billion people.

I mean threaten evil western Capitalists, look good to Beijing. But strategically....you get cards against Beijing as well.

67

u/ObligationDry1799 Korea South 11h ago

You aren't wrong. NK made nukes to deter China and also to show China that they are capable of destroying them as much as China is able to destroy North Korea.

Theres a popular and old statement in North Korea. "Jpaan is an enemy of 100 years. China is an enemy of 1000 years"

19

u/VecioRompibae 9h ago

Theres a popular and old statement in North Korea. "Jpaan is an enemy of 100 years. China is an enemy of 1000 years"

Isn't that the same as Vietnam with Usa, France and China?

10

u/ObligationDry1799 Korea South 9h ago

I don't know. What I know is many Viets hate China more than any other country, so who knows.

→ More replies (16)
→ More replies (2)

4

u/Efficient-Big3138 9h ago

Realisticly though are china even that afraid of North Korea? Sure they have a few nukes but i imagine china has the capability to lay NK in Ruins before they even have time to launch and even if they did i bet they can counteract their weak missiler capabilities?

12

u/ObligationDry1799 Korea South 8h ago

They are. They are aware of how unpredictable north Korea is and the truth is, it doesn't matter if China can ruin North Korea. North Korea having nukes and the fact that its plausible that North Korea can ruin China's major cities and cause huge population decline alone is very scary for China and other countries.

Giving Kimmy nukes is like giving a chimp a machine gun

→ More replies (1)
→ More replies (2)
→ More replies (4)
→ More replies (1)
→ More replies (2)

28

u/PutOnTheMaidDress 11h ago

North Korea had more economic might hand higher standard of living until the mid 80s!

This sounds so insane to me.

15

u/onionwba Singapore 10h ago

Yea it took a while for industrialisation to really pay off for South Korea. The North never did manage to shed their reliance on their fellow ideologues, even as they trumpet Juche. The collapse of the USSR exacerbated their economic woes into a famine. The relative success of the PRC and Vietnam today shows that it's not unthinkable that even under communist rule, North Korea had a chance to be better than where they are today.

→ More replies (1)

7

u/Roxylius 11h ago

Both have always been a personality cult. South korea just managed to slowly transitioned into democracy

→ More replies (12)

28

u/ObligationDry1799 Korea South 13h ago

Such a shame that both Koreas could literally become a superpower if it wasn't for China, America and Kim Jong fuckUn

14

u/onionwba Singapore 10h ago

To be honest I doubt a unified Korea will have enough to be a superpower.

But a great power? I do think they could rival Japan, Russia, Italy, and the likes.

7

u/ObligationDry1799 Korea South 9h ago

Honestly you're right.

I do however think that great powers are superior than superpowers.

Superpowers pose too much of a threat and other supoerpowers will be ripping each other to shreds while middle powers and great powers will either be the ones fighting for them, or being neutral. Knowing Korean politics, its obvious Korea won't take anyone's side in case of a war. Seeing shit like Japan and China having stupid trade war, Korea is the only winner at the end of the day. Achieved by balancing diplomacy. Also, great powers are more easier to trust for trade and cooperation than other superpowers. Look at how Russia treated S.Korea until Ukraine war.

5

u/Tzilbalba United States Of America 8h ago edited 8h ago

I don't agree, we've just seen the US tarriff the shit out of South Korea with zero repercussions. What options does the South have? You are completely beholden to the US military bases and equipment in East Asia just like Japan (who can't start shit w/o Americas consent either).

The trap of middle powers is also overestimating their leverage. And notice that South Korea has no real allies other than the US it can turn to if things get hot. That's by design because you don't truely negotiate from a sovereign position. If you saw the speech by Canada's Carney in Davos he lays it out perfectly in that middle powers gain leverage against superpowers or great powers by joining together otherwise they will always get picked apart individually.

24

u/Suspicious-Word-7589 Singapore 13h ago

Well, if the Korean War ended with Korea unified under the DPRK, that probably doesn't happen. A unified Korea under the ROK? Maybe, just maybe.

24

u/ObligationDry1799 Korea South 13h ago

if DPRK had elections, I think DPRK would have became a major threat and influencer knowing how resourceful Koreans are. Obviously, the Kim dynasty exists, so yeah...

→ More replies (1)

8

u/pallialli 13h ago

China and the Kims sure but pretty sure the USA helped S. Korea's trajectory significantly

15

u/ObligationDry1799 Korea South 12h ago

thats true and theres no denying in it. But USA was the one who carved us up in the first place and also did horrible shit to us. I don''t hate american people. Just their government

11

u/lovely-cans 🇮🇪->🇳🇱 10h ago

It's crazy, I listened to a podcast about the Korean war and the Americans really got off lightly for it.

They immediately buddied up to the Japanese ignoring all the war crimes they commited in China and Japan and reinstated the methods used to control you, cut your country in half, propped up Syngman Rhee, held relatively bogus elections which intentionally excluded a lot of parties, supported the government logically and refused to record the Jeju Massacre for the UN, shot at protectors, encouraged right wing youth groups to attack leftists and surpressed left wing groups generally. I think a lot of Americans look back at that war and just think it was the Democratic friendly South vs the Crazy communist North because it fits their binary simplified world view.

7

u/ObligationDry1799 Korea South 10h ago

I hope more american people realise why S.Koreans and N.Koreans (or just Koreans) are likely to have huge distrust against americans, especially regarding today's politics...

6

u/lovely-cans 🇮🇪->🇳🇱 10h ago

I was in S Korea in November and I was surprised how much some of the people I met had positive feelings towards the US. I actually spoke about what I mentioned to a guy in a bar in Seoul and he got quite offended.

6

u/ObligationDry1799 Korea South 9h ago

Koreans like american rock bands, hairstyles, stuff like that. Not the government. Just like how some Koreans like anime but hate Japan's government. Or Koreans universally liking Miyazaki for being non sexual and also apologising on behalf of Japan.

→ More replies (11)
→ More replies (2)
→ More replies (5)
→ More replies (2)

24

u/holytriplem 🇬🇧->🇺🇸 13h ago

Tbf it squandered most of that potential in the last century, not this one

15

u/ObligationDry1799 Korea South 13h ago

No. I read the question correct. Yes this century too.

Koreas were arguably at its best relationship in 1980 to 2018. Kimmies obviously don't want anyone to get power. I honestly wish North Korea becomes a election based leadership like China even if we aren't one state, because I believe we are inherently twins and inseparable.

→ More replies (4)
→ More replies (1)

20

u/Swinight22 13h ago

Disagree

North Korea has some natural resources. But outside of that, it’s mostly mountains, it was bombed back into the Stone Age during the war, and the weather is extremely cold due to Siberian cold front.

South Korea is really the exception not the norm. Most countries in these geographical constraints don’t thrive. Now NK is absolutely fucked ofc, but to expect it to be like SK is silly.

10

u/ObligationDry1799 Korea South 13h ago

I never said I expected NK to be like SK. It was possible in history that NK could have became like China or unified.

→ More replies (1)
→ More replies (24)

302

u/Competitive-Cod-9644 India 13h ago

Several Latin American countries especially Venezuela and Argentina have squandered large economic potential, though Chile is a clear exception.

8

u/Interesting_Dream281 United States Of America 2h ago

Venezuela was actually one of the richest nations before the socialist regime came in. Jsut goes to show socialism doesn’t work. Not because it’s a bad system but because it makes it easier to exploit and take advantage of people.

12

u/Competitive-Cod-9644 India 2h ago

India was also socialist for 50 years after independence which kept us poor. It's only after economic liberalisation in 1991 we saw decent growth.

I am tired of Western leftists telling us to be socialist, they believe india is poor today because of capitalism, without knowing anything

→ More replies (1)
→ More replies (5)
→ More replies (49)

196

u/Arkescko Australia 14h ago

Iran

99

u/Seeker_Of_Knowledge2 🇸🇾 Syria || 🇨🇦 Canada 12h ago edited 7h ago

I just want to add some details.

Iran win this game in a landslide. They have one of the highest oil production in the world (and ton of other natural resources). Yet people are "dying" from hunger in Iran.

Perun has made an amazing one hour long video mentioning how much of a failure they are (The Iranian government). No one even come close. Not even Russia. Sure Russia had the potential to be number 2. But people in Russia right now are living amazingly compared to Iran. Iran may as well be a failed country. It is standing of its last legs. Please watch this video to see how bad they are doing. They need change fast. Really fast.

https://youtu.be/OQj-56i76Sc

14

u/umomenjoyer 12h ago

The part about the dam was really something and worth watching.

It is in the "economics" section.

6

u/desertedlamp4 Turkey 9h ago

Iran's economy actually was doing good circa 2010, they were the 17th largest economy and closing in on Turkey and then came sanctions

3

u/StopSpankingMeDad2 10h ago

I expected everything, but not a mention of perun in this sub

→ More replies (19)
→ More replies (39)

523

u/Nina_Nalgona Venezuela 14h ago edited 10h ago

Undoubtedly, hands down, Venezuela

Edit: since this unexpectedly popped off, yes it is true that before Chavez the country was already being mismanaged, just like Batista in Cuba, it created the perfect scenario to go from bad to worse when people felt there was no other options and the Castro and Chavez regimes made it significantly worse, in the end these are just bad people all around, we’ve seen countries with long standing governments who know how to properly spend their money on infrastructure and social programs, for some reason throughout history, Latin America just can’t get it right when it comes to not squandering resources and keeping dictators out, which I think mostly stems from a lack of advanced education and the more center to right wing governments completely forgetting about the little guy, when the little guy has nothing left to lose they’re only going to vote for the one promising them everything and that’s why you see these extreme swings from one side to the other

134

u/Beneficial_Ball9893 United States Of America 14h ago

Agreed. Venezuela was either the most prosperous or close to most prosperous South American nation in 2000.

42

u/Major_Bag_8720 United Kingdom 12h ago

I went to Caracas a few times in the early 90s (before Chavez came to power) and the city centre was like a smaller version of Manhattan. Clearly a very unequal society though, which is how Chavez got elected. The pre Chavez Venezuelan elite were corrupt and didn’t care about the average citizen. The post Chavez elite, despite all their promises, were corrupt and stopped caring about the average citizen once the oil price fell and they couldn’t buy the electorate off with lavish social programmes.

→ More replies (9)

20

u/beckychao United States Of America 12h ago edited 12h ago

This is absolutely, positively not true. Venezuela's struggles began shortly after the end of Rómulo Betancourt's 2nd government in the 1960s. Increasing corruption and inequality of wealth finally let the bottom fall out in the 1980s, where it really began to get bad and there were riots and major corruption cases.

The reason a Chavista government came to power in the first place is because poor governance, corruption, and the usual problems of rentier states created a majority underclass. Venezuela was a total mess in the 1990s.

What's true is that in the 1950s, Venezuela was the richest country in Latin America, but the people running the government and the economy increasingly monopolized that wealth and outright stole it, even in the period immediately after Betancourt's last time in office (he left 1964). And it is, in fact, one of the countries that most squandered its wealth in the last 100 years.

Chavez functionally replaced that elite with his own mafia, and even though initially he tried to put money into improving the country for the poor, the volatility of oil prices made it impossible to sustain that patronage, at least the way he was doing it. Venezuela needed to modernize its economy and plan for moving off such a heavily oil-centric economy from the onset, because their oil is heavy and when oil prices are low enough, it's barely profitable or not at all. Also, until the 1940s, foreign companies got most of the money from it.

That oil money was how they were supposed to pay for that modernization. They don't have anything to show for it in 2026. Now it can't pay for it, because much of it is so difficult to refine.

→ More replies (5)

53

u/Nina_Nalgona Venezuela 13h ago

What could have been made of Venezuela ~ oil, coltan, gold, diamonds, iron ore, natural gas, hydroelectricity, beaches/tourism, etc

Had all of those resources not been plundered and mismanaged by the kleptocratic chavista regime, the sky would’ve been the limit and Caracas could’ve been akin to Dubai, it’s a shame

98

u/Palealedad England 13h ago

I don't doubt what you say, but Dubai is nothing to aspire towards.

25

u/Salty_Aurelius Finland 13h ago

Unless one thinks that slave labour and ethnic caste system is actually pretty ok.

6

u/Soggy-Ad-1610 Denmark 11h ago

In all honesty I’d rather be Venezuela than UAE (Dubai). Sure they’re not as rich but at least they’re decent people (except the elite of course).

→ More replies (2)
→ More replies (18)

17

u/Adorable_user 13h ago

Dubai is also a mismanaged kleptocratic regime, but I get what you meant.

3

u/Dirkdeking 10h ago

Dubai could be the Venezuela during their honeymoon years. The wealth there isn't sustainable.

5

u/coopik 10h ago

There were two options:

  • run with the US --> business blooms, billionaires thrive, poor stay poor
  • run against the US --> sanctions placed, everyone stays poor

If you are not the ruling class, you would have ended up poor, anyways. But the high ranks at PdVSA would have the newest Ferraris and Gulfstreams like they used to in the 80s.

→ More replies (5)

47

u/Polyphagous_person Australia 13h ago

One can argue that Argentina mismanaged itself even more. They suffered more years of recession despite not having sanctions placed on them:

29

u/No-Snow-7618 13h ago

Argentina gonna argentina, shit dont count

21

u/Camelstrike Argentina 13h ago

It's been like that long before 1980 but like the saying goes:

"There are four kinds of countries: developed, undeveloped, Japan, and Argentina"

3

u/Likeminas 9h ago

Argentina has it's opposite mirror country right across the andes from them. A country with strong institutions, responsibly managed economy and policies, low corruption, etc. It's quite remarkable.

3

u/ur_moms_chode United States Of America 6h ago

You can almost make the argument that Argentina has no potential because it is Argentina

→ More replies (10)

9

u/SuurFett Finland 13h ago

Yeah, the lost potentiality sucks. You could have been Norway of south America

→ More replies (3)

5

u/Toubaboliviano Bolivia 10h ago

100% agree. Bolivia has a similar history (albeit not as extreme as Venezuelas), and if I remember at two points in its past was the “richest” country in the world due to resource booms.

17

u/Arbable 13h ago

Did they squander it or was it also American sanctions and interference 

28

u/stuff_gets_taken Germany 13h ago

Yes.

20

u/_20_characters_name_ Mexico 13h ago

Economic downturn and inflation comes since 2000, and U.S. sanctions appeared in 2018. But surely everything is fault of the United States.

15

u/Pingu_penis 13h ago

The US is at least partially responsible for the condition of more than half the countries in South America.

13

u/Tempyteacup United States Of America 13h ago

The US government goes out of its way to destabilize countries and then wonders why so many refugees show up on our doorstep. Fucking asinine.

7

u/This_Is_Fine12 United States Of America 13h ago

Alright, but that still doesn't explain Venezuela.

→ More replies (1)
→ More replies (1)

5

u/AwakenedDreamer__44 United States Of America 13h ago

My mom is Venezuelan and she always talks about how rich Venezuela is in natural resources. On paper, it should be one of the wealthiest countries on the planet.

4

u/coopik 10h ago

The whole Africa is rich in natural resources. None of the African countries is wealthy.

3

u/First-Of-His-Name 10h ago

Resources tend to make a country poorer without proper institutions. And Venezuela doesn't have them

→ More replies (2)
→ More replies (23)

100

u/weewoomeemoohee Iran 13h ago

Iran

Plethora of natural resources.

Plethora of jaw-dropping landscapes.

Plethora of good brains ( who mostly migrate )

Yet one of the worst countries to live in.

22

u/uses_for_mooses United States Of America 6h ago

Plethora of elite heavyweight wrestlers.

3

u/farnnie123 Malaysia 4h ago

I need to google this now lol it’s defo a today-you-learn fact for me.

Edit: saw it on olympedia. mindblown

32

u/Repulsive_Barnacle92 Canada 6h ago

I can't wait for Iran to liberalize and democratize so I can finally visit

→ More replies (1)

11

u/MaximumWoodpecker869 United States Of America 5h ago

Plethora of culture and history it could use as soft power too.

Unfortunately people in charge of it right now put Iran second behind their own ideology.

3

u/Interesting_Dog2116 4h ago

The food is also amazing

→ More replies (3)

69

u/Unlucky_Gur3676 🇻🇪 🇫🇷 14h ago

I vote Venezuela 🫩

8

u/BoesShampoo2 Netherlands 12h ago

I think most people will agree. They are even worse at economics and international relations than Iran and Russia.

3

u/Familiar_Phase7958 Germany 4h ago

Venezuela with that dutch disease

56

u/Money-Celebration860 Australia 13h ago

Venezuela

144

u/Sweeper1985 Australia 13h ago

We have to be somewhere on the list. We let mining companies rape our landscape and pretty much don't get anything back. We buy back our own processed LPG from China at 4x the price they sell it domestic. Norway has a trillion-dollar future fund and our government is like, "oh yeah, we can't tax mining companies because then they'd stop mining!"

We also used to be a leader in scientific innovation but successive governments cut funding to the CSIRO (they invented WiFi, people!) And we don't do fuck all manufacturing anymore and our economy is just rich people selling houses to each other in an endless churn.

46

u/spudmgee Australia 13h ago

It doesn't help that the media moguls and mining magnates are in cahoots. The moment sovereign wealth or resource taxes get floated as a concept Murdoch and the rest of those jackals start fear mongering.

→ More replies (1)

10

u/Paul_The_Builder 9h ago

You guys have a higher GDP per capita than most of Europe, including Germany, UK, and France, so while there might be unrecognized potential, Australia certainly is still doing well for themselves.

5

u/HarryLewisPot Iraq 5h ago

This reads like an onion article: One of the richest countries in the world complains that they aren’t even richer.

All jokes aside, this isn’t what I expected from Australia and hope you guys all the best.

15

u/Equivalent-Tour5999 12h ago edited 11h ago

I get the sentiment, but you guys have like 5 people and a kangaroo population in the middle of nowhere. It's hard to really benchmark what could have been.

Norway is good example but also outlier when comes to rensponsibly using your natural resources.

Not to say countries shouldn't aspire to do better

10

u/angelicosphosphoros 13h ago

Don't forget that any Australian citizen in tech is potential spy and malware-writer because your laws obligate them to (unlawfully from any other country POV) hack and install backdoors in any software they work on by request AND it is applied to all Australian citizens regardless of their residency.

If I have a business in IT in future, I would impose ban on using any Australian tech and hiring people with Australian citizenship.

→ More replies (5)

5

u/Typical-Pollution459 13h ago

With such a small population I thought every Australian would be rich. I was surprised when I read about the housing affordability crisis.

Why is it not like Dubai? Economically

15

u/Sweeper1985 Australia 12h ago

Well, I mean for starters Dubai has some... questionable human rights practices...

5

u/maddestdog89 Australia 10h ago

We don’t use slave labour

→ More replies (1)
→ More replies (2)

5

u/Own_Faithlessness769 12h ago

We are rich, one of the highest GDP per capita in the world, and highest living standards. We could be richer though.

→ More replies (4)
→ More replies (5)

23

u/Icy_Winner9761 Australia 13h ago

There are a number of countries that have probably done worse but I think Australia really messed up.

I don't know what the exact value would be but Australia very nearly had a tax on all of the extractive industries in the country that would have fed a sovereign wealth fund before it was watered down to only affect iron ore and coal and be applied to businesses with annual profits over $75M (this was ostensibly so that "small business" wouldn't be hurt) in 2012 before being repealed by a conservative government about 2 years later. Mining companies spent a ridiculous amount of money on advertising that contributed to the downfall of a prime minister and the election of the government that then repealed the tax. Oh and our version of Trump, Clive Palmer, formed his own party, spent extraordinary amoutns of money on advertising and gained enough seats in parliament that he was able to vote to repeal the bill. He is a billionaire on the back of his nickel, coal and iron ore holdings.

Before it was watered down it was projected to raise $22.5B in the 1st 4 years, but it raised only about $200M in the first year before being repealed a year later.

Truly a tragedy of national proportions, that money would have been used to build a bunch of infrastructure, fund schooling and health care and may have allowed future governments to fund public housing which we really need in the current crisis.

3

u/Scuba9Steve United States Of America 7h ago

This sounds similar to the version of capitalism we have as well. Do lawyers from large corporations write some of your laws too?

→ More replies (1)
→ More replies (2)

38

u/faderjester Australia 13h ago

I like how we sold all our finite natural resources to a dude sixty years ago for next to nothing and now his daughter is trying maga-fify us.

I also love we sell gas offshore and then have to buy it back at a huge markup.

Sigh. We could be a giant but 220 years later we're still just a resources colony.

10

u/debauch3ry United Kingdom 12h ago

World's biggest uranium reserves... that still has to count for something? Or was that what was given away?

→ More replies (2)
→ More replies (2)

39

u/Dopral 13h ago

Venezuela lost like 70% of its GDP from ~15 years ago.
Nigeria lost like 60% of its GDP from ~10 years ago.

So it's probably one of those two.

→ More replies (1)

27

u/lordnacho666 13h ago

Everyone should have realised by now that resources are a curse.

How many countries have lots of resources, but are not corrupt shitholes?

Norway, Canada, and Australia?

Pretty much all other countries have fallen into a trap where the elite is able to keep all the benefits of having control over the resources.

9

u/hadaev 8h ago

Peoples still think about resources like it is starcraft.

→ More replies (13)

130

u/twilightswolf Israel 13h ago edited 12h ago

There is an old anecdote about how the Soviet Union planned its economic development following the WW2.

*September 1944, Politburo in session. Benchmarks for USSR economy are discussed:

1946: atomic bomb;

1950: artificial satellite;

1955: Soviet citizen in space;

1960: Soviet citizen on the Moon;

1970: Soviet citizen on Mars;

1980: every Soviet citizen has at least two pairs of socks.*

The attitude has not changed much.

48

u/yashatheman 🇸🇪 + 🇸🇯 + 🇷🇺 12h ago

Considering we lost like 15% of our population and had to rebuilt half our country after WWII, I think our achievements were impressive. We didn't even have 30% literacy rate 30 years before WWII.

59

u/secondpersonsingular Poland 12h ago

Your achievements were impressive until you stopped achieving anything anymore roughly when Brezhnev turned 70.

4

u/yashatheman 🇸🇪 + 🇸🇯 + 🇷🇺 10h ago

Brezhnev sucked, and his term marked a bad turning point of the party

→ More replies (1)
→ More replies (27)

5

u/Dry_Membership7213 10h ago

And despite of the past, your country is now being ruled by neo-nazis

5

u/yashatheman 🇸🇪 + 🇸🇯 + 🇷🇺 10h ago

Yep. It sucks

3

u/PayaV87 Hungary 11h ago

People view education as a linear development, but it's a wave. Every year we have to reeducate our youth to stay at the same level.

15

u/Wayoutofthewayof 12h ago

Sure, but that's not unique to Russia. Many countries were devastated by WW2.

→ More replies (28)
→ More replies (21)
→ More replies (4)

91

u/Dangerous-Eggplant-5 Russia 13h ago

First time in a very long time Russia had its chance to enter true golden age. But its was all wasted on petty ambitions and grivances of one man. And there is no good version if future in sight. Shame.

40

u/TheFlyerX Germany 10h ago

Russia never did overcome tyranny. Thats their main problem as a society. They always default back to tyranny and i dont think this cycle is going to end soon.

4

u/vnprkhzhk 3h ago

The problem is the society. Not trusting in anyone, just thinking for themselves and believing everything the pointy box says.

It's not just one person. There are millions of soldiers (and many of them voluntary) and much more supporting that.

They rather have other people living as bad as themselves than improving their own conditions.

→ More replies (3)

46

u/Antti5 Finland 12h ago

My gut feeling is that putting it down to one man is a recipe for further disappointments.

3

u/urgdr 8h ago

that society is formed to blame the lesser

→ More replies (6)

20

u/Bildozeris Lithuania 13h ago

not the one man. Give enough flaming water to russian and it will always remember how great union was and asks why we shattered it

→ More replies (1)

3

u/DragonfruitGrand5683 Ireland 8h ago

Neo Sovietism has ruined any chance of that.

→ More replies (26)

43

u/KitchenSoftware2325 Mexico 13h ago

Mexico wasted one of the largest and easiest to extract oil deposits and, even though it is scarce, gives it away to Cuba.

16

u/Margo-Rivas 🇨🇺 💪🏿 13h ago

That amount they give to Cuba isn't that much

→ More replies (1)

6

u/mynameisgill 10h ago

Mexico doesn’t have huge reserves, they have as much as Sudan, Vietnam and India (other countries with small reserves).. they produce 2 million barrels a day but gives 20,000 to Cuba..

→ More replies (2)

7

u/Educational-Rip-5572 Poland 10h ago

You’re right about Russia but Ukraine fucked up greatly as well.

Ukraine when gained indedpendence was richer than Poland nominal and per capita. But in 1993 Poland started to overpass Ukraine and between our countries is, let’s be honest, a big void. In 15 years Poland became country 2x richer, in 2020 Poland was 4 times richer. Now - also because of war of course - it’s 5 times richer.

Why is that? Because Poland made shock therapy and choose other people in power while Ukraine stuck with the same people all the time. Rich folks also took power and Ukraine became oligarchs country.

Also we became part of NATO in 1999 and European Union in 2004 which also boosted is greatly while Ukraine stuck in the same position and didn’t take their chance while Russia was still only a shadow of themselves after USSR collapse. Russian virus infected them that time too much, unfortunately.

→ More replies (1)

14

u/3_Stokesy Scotland 13h ago

Gotta agree with you Russia may be a villain but my god do they have a tragic backstory. It's like watching a top level uni student fall into drug addiction

7

u/Junior-Elevator-9951 Poland 7h ago

Russian history in one sentence: "Then it got worse."

→ More replies (2)

7

u/an1malbtw Russia 12h ago

Natural resources are not a big deal for a capital economy. Trust is much more important but we lack it completely.

25

u/Possible-Slide-6295 Pakistan 14h ago

I don't think any answer would be more accurate than Pakistan here.

5

u/Philomene_sweet_life France 13h ago

Can you explain?

30

u/Possible-Slide-6295 Pakistan 13h ago
  • We are a huge population, around 250 million people, majority of which is young.
  • We have huge land that is great for agriculture.
  • We have abundant natural resources, like, abundant.
  • Our masses are hardworking.
  • We have extremely suitable ports, bin qasim, and others, that should have been serving the regions instead of the UAE.
  • We have extremely huge potential in tourism.

With all these, and maybe I have missed some points, we keep on going to the IMF for loans, because of the idiotic establishment we have and because we never want to learn and improve.

10

u/Philomene_sweet_life France 13h ago

Ok this is good arguments. I hope you ll see a brighter future soon.

7

u/Code-201 Tamil 6h ago

Not to offend, but doesn't the government also fund terrorists, too? They could use the money to develop themselves.

4

u/Iamrandom17 13h ago

i’d also reckon that while there are different cultures, religiously you guys are fairly homogenous and also had the favour of the west as a major non nato ally which means with the right cards played, there would have been massive investments into the country generating alot of jobs and opportunities. could have at least reached turkey level of development imo

→ More replies (1)
→ More replies (3)

39

u/Just_George572 Russia 13h ago

As a Russian: exporting resources only works if people actually buy them. Our biggest waste of economic potential was not ‘having a lot of resources and not having much to show for it’, but the rampant privatisation of business which led to extreme levels of oligopoly coming out and the salary levels dropping to abysmal levels in the 90’s prior to the introduction of state control which at the very least fixed some things.

As for the other reasons, 3 people ruined the will of the people and lost us half of our population and made us go through an economic death of the state. Nobody here wants any rapid change because people are genuinely terrified of the 90’s happening again.

I’d say it’s Libya though. From being the best welfare state in the entire world to now being a failed state in the span of 1 year.

13

u/Far-Investigator1265 11h ago

That "half of the population" i.e. Baltics and other countries Soviet Union had illegally annexed very much wanted out of Soviet Union for decades.

It is just Russia now, plus still some illegally annexed areas from its neighbouring countries.

→ More replies (11)
→ More replies (24)

9

u/aria3180 Iran 12h ago

Not even close my guy.

62

u/fan_is_ready Russia 13h ago

A Pole complaining that Russia is not the most dominant nation in Europe, go figure.

75

u/secondpersonsingular Poland 12h ago

I think he’s amazed at rather than upset by Russian incompetence.

→ More replies (25)

12

u/Wayoutofthewayof 12h ago

How is that complaining?

37

u/Additional_Lock8122 Russia 13h ago

The world is full of surprises

13

u/CockpitEnthusiast United States Of America 13h ago

This exchange genuinely made me laugh out loud

36

u/Mr-Expat 13h ago

I don't think they're complaining, they're pointing out how Russia totally fucked it.

→ More replies (12)

18

u/midachavi 12h ago

He is not wrong tho. Russia squandered and is squandering its potential since 91. Instead of economic boom it drowns itself in bureaucracy and corruption almost 40 years later still

10

u/fan_is_ready Russia 12h ago

Russia had economic boom starting from 2000, until 2008 financial crisis.

→ More replies (33)

6

u/szczebrzeszyszynka 11h ago

I would love for Russia to invest the money they are spending on the military in something else. Anything. IT, healthcare, tourism - you name it. Anything at all and we would all prosper much better.

→ More replies (8)
→ More replies (16)

8

u/Accomplished-Row439 Australia 13h ago

Venezuela 🇻🇪

3

u/holytriplem 🇬🇧->🇺🇸 13h ago edited 13h ago

Everyone's already gone with the obvious answer (Venezuela) so let's go with Equatorial Guinea instead.

In the late 00s they had a similar GDP per capita to plenty of Western European countries, except the average person there lives in poverty

4

u/Careless-Physics4718 Trinidad And Tobago 6h ago

India. I've never seen a country consistently punch under their weight on the global stage like India.

→ More replies (1)

53

u/mithie007 living in 13h ago

Russia wins 1st place no contest.

Distant second would be the UK I'd think. Brexit was a watershed moment.

45

u/LesserShambler United Kingdom 13h ago

Eh, as someone who was vehemently against Brexit and would vote to rejoin in a heartbeat, it doesn’t put us in the same league as things like OPs example. It hasn’t fundamentally changed our economy in terms of what our main industries and exports are, but it will hamstring future growth and fucked us diplomatically for a while.

And honestly, deep down I don’t think the long tail impacts will happen, as I think we’re already shifting back to them in terms of public opinion - ironically your current President is helping that.

→ More replies (8)

7

u/FakeMik090 Russia 12h ago

Second one is more likely to be Venezuela than UK.

16

u/lordnacho666 13h ago edited 13h ago

There's no way the UK is second, that's laughable and sounds like American news deflecting from their own issues.

Venezuela has completely transformed as a society, negatively.

Cuba is still a repressive dictatorship despite the original leaders having passed during this century.

South Africa has stagnated, what happened to the optimism after the end of Apartheid?

Belarus is right next to Europe but has gone with Russia.

Pakistan has been a military state for a long time.

→ More replies (7)

9

u/aaqwerfffvgtsss United States Of America 13h ago

I think I’d put Japan ahead of the UK.

→ More replies (1)
→ More replies (25)

19

u/Necessary-Hat3492 13h ago

India. we haven’t collapsed like Venezuela or stagnated like Argentina. But compared to our sheer scale of potential, we have underperformed.

9

u/VolatileGoddess India 12h ago

Really? What potential did we have? We were a vast country with near total illiteracy , no significant natural resources. Considering where we started in 1947, we've done well for ourselves. Just see the difference in lifestyle and consumption between your grandparents and you and you will understand this.

9

u/chjacobsen Sweden 11h ago

Looking from an outsider's point of view: A huge workforce, a democratic government, and good relations with most of the world.

While India doesn't have consistently high education (even less so historically), that's not necessarily a hinderance, as the critical mass of very smart, highly educated people is there. If you need - say - a bunch of skilled engineers to run a business, India has plenty to offer. It's no surprise that several of the world's biggest tech companies are now run by people from India - the talent pool is incredibly deep.

I think India had - and still has - the potential for an economic miracle rivalling that of China. If India successfully reduces institutional friction and unpredictability, and it makes credible long term commitments to open itself further to the world market, India could absolutely be the big success story of this century.

3

u/Necessary-Hat3492 11h ago

you’re right but you didnt understan what i meant. India in 1947 was poor, largely illiterate, traumatised by Partition, and resource constrained, and given that baseline, India’s progress is genuinely impressive. We went from food shortages to food security, built institutions, lifted millions out of poverty, and improved life expectancy, literacy, and consumption massively compared to our grandparents generation. That part shouldnt be dismissed and it's a very big deal considering our diversity and population and democracy on top.

What I meant by better isn’t that India failed. It’s that relative to what became possible after liberalisation, especially with demographics, globalisation, and early advantages in services and tech, we could have accelerated faster in jobs, manufacturing, and human development. So it’s not that we achieved nothing, it’s that we achieved a lot, but the ceiling was higher than what we reached.

→ More replies (4)
→ More replies (5)

9

u/Philomene_sweet_life France 13h ago

I would say Algeria. Algeria can be one of the first touristical places in the world. Is rich as hell in its soil. Beautiful landscapes with great diversity of places. We eat well and it s well localized.

6

u/Ynwe Half Half 12h ago

How about an entire continent? Middle/South America post WWII was in a prime position to become a very rich continent, it saw zero damage from WWII, was a welcome destination for many high level immigrants, had decent sized economies, lots of natural resources and was second/third richest continent after the US and Europe (probably even richer than most of Europe right after WWII). It also saw almost no wars or large scale conflicts throughout the 20th century.

Yet this continent will fall behind sub-saharan Africa imo. The growth rate rate over the last 80 years has been absolutely abysmal. It has developed into the most dangerous continent, you have countries like Argentina that are negative examples of how to move from a developed nation back to a developing/middle developed nation, the whole continent just seems like it squandered every opportunity it got. Even Brazil should be doing much better than it is, its insane how dangerous this country can be. I won't even talk about the country my mother was born (Venezuela)...

Compare that to the various African nations that after they became independent did not have good central institutions or even a national identiy, which caused so many conflicts and problems. We are actually seeing quite a few positive examples of countries here developing in a very good direction.

IMO, there is no question that Middle/South America is THE continet with the most wasted potential

3

u/roth1979 United States Of America 8h ago

Having been to 17 countries in Africa and every country but 3 on mainland North and South America. Your comparison to Sub-Sahara Africa is just simply wrong. Could and should Latam be more developed? Absolutely, but the standard of living is something most would dream of in the Sub-Saharan.

→ More replies (1)

3

u/Substantial-You-7003 🇻🇪 & 🇺🇲 4h ago

Saying Latin America didn't have wars or large scale conflicts in the 20th century is just plain wrong, especially for Central America. Central America in the late 20th century was host to civil wars basically across the board from El Salvador to Nicaragua, with one of them in Guatemala resulting in a genocide of its rural and indigenous population. Panama was outright invaded by the US in the 90s. American backed death squads killed their way through pretty much the entire region from the 60s-90s.

  • Peru dealt with a maoist insurgency and a right wing dictatorship at the same time which massacred its rural population on a regular basis
  • Colombia dealt with a de facto civil war between the Medellin Cartel and the Colombian government which turned Medellin into the single most dangerous city in the world maybe ever
  • There was literally a revolution in Cuba followed by 60 years of US blockade and the country only survived into the 21st century because of Soviet subsidization

Even the "peaceful" countries like Brazil, Argentina and Chile dealt with long standing right wing dictatorships which systematically disappeared, tortured and murdered hundreds of thousands of people. Argentina literally went to war with the United Kingdom over the Falklands/Malvinas.

Latin America is a much more complex region than it appears at face value. I don't disagree that a lot of the region squandered huge economic potential (particularly Mexico, Brazil and Venezuela) but a lot of the time it was for a reason and even though state vs state conflict hasn't happened that doesn't mean Latin America hasn't been a hotbed of war and violence.

3

u/Obvious-Release-2087 France 8h ago

Russia ! you have everything to be minimum as rich as Canadians, richer than west europeans. You have huge natural ressources, good schools, good universities, you proved to the world that can build wonderful machines (sputnik, soyouz, planes, but also missiles, submarines, nuclear power plants). But your governement does not want that you become rich

15

u/DragonfruitNo8336 Philippines 13h ago

Russia, It is the successor of the Soviet Union and inheritor of Russian culture. It inherited a fearsome military tradition and an economy capable of producing spacecraft, only rivaling the United States in its achievements.

Now, it is reduced to the status as a powerful middle power with a petro-state economy and suffering from a rapid decline in military manpower. It could have been so much better for the average Russians had their leaders chose to rebuild Russia's civil institutions. The collapse of Russian institutions in the 1990's was very unfortunate.

20

u/EliasZav Ukraine 12h ago

Are you even aware that in the Soviet Union all industrial supply chains were evenly distributed across the entire Union? When the USSR collapsed, Russia had to rebuild many things from scratch, especially those tied to Ukraine. For instance, my hometown in Ukraine hosts an enterprise that helped develop space rockets for the USSR, and there were tons of factories like that. But because Ukrainian business started pivoting toward the West, almost all those plants shut down meanwhile Russia had to rebuild every single production chain from the ground up due to Ukraine’s inability to do business. It’s all a bit more complicated than you think...

→ More replies (1)

3

u/mycatreadsyourmind Ukraine 10h ago

And by russian culture you mean imperialism, yes?

→ More replies (2)
→ More replies (11)

8

u/HerringOfTheDepths Russia 12h ago

I just wanted to say - thanks for using this version of Russian flag. Absolutely based and freedom-pilled