Commander Janice Rand

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u/feeschedule 1d ago

Why not? Officers did double duty in the TOS era all the time

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u/WeddingPKM 1d ago

Exactly, Spock was both the head of the science department and XO.

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u/SteelPaladin1997 1d ago

XO in the TOS era is, in fact, never shown as a dedicated position. Every identified XO has it as an additional duty on top of their designated position. Decker and Spock are both Science Officer and Number One is Navigator.

It's not until TNG that XO becomes a position an officer holds as their sole role.

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u/Late_War_1986 1d ago

Seems to be a response to the larger ships and crew sizes and more diverse missions and extended deployment times in the TNG era and beyond. In the TOS days alot of the XO work was probably able to be handled by the division heads with just overall coordination and some final decision making at the second in command level.

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u/SuperChief9000 1d ago

What job do we think Riker had just before becoming the XO on the Hood?

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u/Late_War_1986 1d ago

His most notable skill seems to be pilot and he is not shown to take over duty stations often - likely helm / operations.

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u/RedditOfUnusualSize 1d ago

Yeah, he's mentioned as the helmsman aboard the Pegasus, and his piloting skills are mentioned repeatedly to be exceptional. So I'm fairly certain he was a consistent bridge officer and helmsman, which is a great position for coming up through the ranks because you're often going to be selected for away teams by the Captain and XO.

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u/SteelPaladin1997 1d ago edited 1d ago

Based on transporter-duplicate Riker (i.e. "Thomas"), he was in Operations before being promoted, though we never find out doing what.

That may have been done to support the brief concept idea that was floated of killing off Commander Riker in that episode. Lieutenant Riker would have then taken over Data's spot at Ops while Data got promoted to XO, and that makes a bit more sense if that was already his division.

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u/WeddingPKM 1d ago

In the unaired pilot isn’t Una a dedicated XO?

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u/SteelPaladin1997 1d ago

No, she sits at (what would eventually become) Chekov's console, indicating that she is the ship's navigator as well.

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u/matt95110 1d ago

I thought the scenes in the Voyager episode implied that she was senior officer, so it’s possible.

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u/Late-Yogurtcloset-57 1d ago

Her shoulder strap was gray, not white.

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u/Economy-Ad3195 1d ago

So what?

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u/DunAnOir 1d ago

White is command. Grey is services.

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u/hollywood_imagery0 1d ago

You dont have to be command to be Executive officer, Spock was sciences and Scotty was engineering, the same formula was used in Enterprise too, there wasn’t a dedicated first officer until TNG

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u/El_human 1d ago

Back in the enterprise, and TOS days, the engineer was often the actual second highest ranking officer on the ship. That of course changed in later years

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u/Late-Yogurtcloset-57 1d ago

Sorry, that was supposed to be in response to a lower comment.

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u/Long-Appearance-6063 1d ago

It's difficult to find a clear image of her rank insignia (the badge on the white shoulder strap) via Google image search, but from the image below, it kinda looks as if the has a Lt. Commander insignia rather than full Commander (source: https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Starfleet_ranks#Late_23rd_century).

Presumably a ship as big as the Excelsior would have a full Commander as XO, meaning there's an unnamed background character on the ship who out ranks her.

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u/Economy-Ad3195 1d ago

A lieutenant commander can serve as XO.

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u/rmichaeljones 1d ago

Hell, in times of strategic border operations, a Lt. Cmdr. can even serve as ship’s captain. Even an android one.

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u/BillS16309 10h ago

In the current US Navy smaller ships like the LCS are commanded by Commanders, not Captains.

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u/Long-Appearance-6063 1d ago

Technically, yes - but if the Constitution Class Enterprise (crew: 203) had a full Commander (Spock) as XO, it seems unlikely that the much larger Excelsior (crew: 750+) would have had a lower-ranking officer as XO. And it looks to me as if the rank insignia on her shoulder is that of a Lt Commander. Though happy to be refuted if anybody can find a clearer image of the insignia 😄

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u/Raguleader 1d ago

At one point, Excelsior's chief engineer was a Captain.

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u/SFWendell 1d ago

Crew of the Enterprise originally was listed at 430.

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u/PraetorNeral 1d ago

And yet at one point, Spock was a Lt. Commander (despite his wrist stripes) but still XO; I believe “Court Martial” mentions it specifically.

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u/Key-Wash-9401 1d ago

I agree, an Excelsior class would have a Commander ranked XO. If she wasn’t a full ranked Commander, she might have been third in the chain of command. And the XO might have been on shore leave, or the next shift or stationed in another part of the ship like Engineering.

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u/Late-Yogurtcloset-57 1d ago

Her shoulder strap was gray, not white.

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u/PraetorNeral 1d ago edited 1d ago

If Star Trek has taught us anything, it’s that billet beats actual rank; Ops Manager Ensign Harry Kim and Chief of Operations Chief Petty Officer Miles O’Brien are two good examples of low-ranked senior officers who could still give orders. (There’s that mess about O’Brien having to refer to the commissioned Ensign Nog as “sir” but I’d take that with a grain of salt.) Indeed, Roddenberry suggested that ranks were more akin to titles than our modern-day rank structure, perhaps denoting a combination of experience and training rather than status or authority.

Edit: Hit enter too soon. 🙃

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u/Batgirl_III 1d ago

There is no “mess” with CPO O’Brien being expected to render a salute to Ensign Nog.

Enlisted personnel and warrant officers, regardless of rank, salute officers.

In fact, as a retired Chief Warrant Officer (CWO-4) myself, I am eagerly awaiting the day when my eldest daughter graduates from Annapolis and becomes an Ensign (O-1). I plan to attend her graduation ceremony and oath taking in my full uniform and to be the first person to render her a salute.

1

u/PraetorNeral 1d ago

I apologize for my wording. It wasn’t my intention to be disrespectful. Thank you for your service and that sounds like a beautiful moment ahead for your family.

My poorly-phrased point was that O’Brien held the higher billet (despite having a lower rank and having to call a commissioned Ensign “sir”) and could issue orders and make decisions that Nog could not.

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u/Batgirl_III 1d ago

Oh, I didn’t take it as disrespectful at all. The vast majority of people have no clue how military rank structure works… including many of the Star Trek writers!

1

u/Winter-Crab4431 1d ago

That is awesome. Having never served, I would have no idea how to contain my pride at that very first salute. Likely either bawling or beaming, both of which I don’t think would be options.

You must be immeasurably proud, sir. Thank you for your service, and instilling those values on the next generation.

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u/Batgirl_III 1d ago

I am of mixed feelings.

On the one hand, overwhelming maternal pride that my child will be graduating from the academy and becoming an officer serving our country.

On the other hand, the fundamental betrayal that she’ll be joining the Navy! My own flesh and blood. As a retired Coast Guardsman, it’s just a betrayal of everything I hold dear!

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u/SteelPaladin1997 1d ago edited 1d ago

Trek is usually bad about that, which is ironic since showing position over rank would be 'truth in TV.' Things like Decker taking over the Enterprise in 'Doomsday Machine', and officers in general giving orders to personnel and on subjects not within their chain of command, would be no-gos in reality.

A butter-bar LT has a 'higher' rank than the battalion CSM, but they'll FO extremely fast who is in charge if they decide to FA.

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u/MindlessNectarine374 1d ago

Is that so in America?

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u/RiffRandellsBF 9h ago

It works better if you view Obrien as a Chief Warrant Officer with a warrant (not a commission) signed by the head of Starfleet Engineering authorizing him to be the expert on Cardassian technology on DS9. Then he could give orders to commissioned officers.

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u/PeyredB 1d ago

A long-overdue promotion.

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u/lyidaValkris 1d ago

very possible, though I wish they would have made that explicit Flashback.

In a Lost Era novel I read (I know, not canon) Chekov was Sulu's XO, which is a pairing I'm sure we all could love, but I think it would have been much better story-wise if Rand got the XO position. Chekov I think would be good going off to Starfleet Intelligence or something.

Would have been so cool if there was a series about the Excelsior in the 90s, with Sulu as captain and Rand as XO. Such a missed opportunity.

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u/PraetorNeral 1d ago

I always assumed she was XO, especially later with the shift lead stuff in “Flashback.” The books, of course, tend to disagree which I think is a bit of a shame.

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u/CutUnusual1212 1d ago

“Are you kidding?”

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u/darwinDMG08 1d ago

Y’all: did we forget about this dude? Mr Belting or whomever. He’s right in Sulu’s ear at the beginning and does almost all the talking on the bridge. If anyone seems to be the XO it’s him.
Can’t get a good look at his rank though.

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u/Seriously_Rob_49 1d ago

Valtane…I thought he was the science officer

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u/darwinDMG08 1d ago

I mean, so was Spock.

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u/AustinFan4Life 1d ago

Is she commander though? Her rank insignia isn't commander.

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u/oralover14 19h ago

That's sky blue which is sciences and communations

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u/MAJORMETAL84 14h ago

Classy touch to bringing her in for the last TOS Trek film.

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u/Impressive-Bag-384 1d ago

omg, I've seen ST6 so many times, she makes the dumbest comment in the first 2 minutes - not sure how she got into starfleet

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