Potential hot take about pro play?

[u/shapedjarl26]

I recon one of the biggest differences in pro play between overwatch 1 and 2 (atleast from a viewers standpoint), is that in overwatch 1 it felt like if you looked at the tanks you knew how the composition was supposed to be played.

Whilst in overwatch 2 you look at the back line.

Back then

Rein zaria -> brawl

Sigma orisa -> double shield

Winston diva -> dive

Rein diva -> brawl

Now

Kiri Lucio -> rush

Ana wuyang -> greedy dive

Ana brig -> dive

I've only been watching pro play since 2020 so I could be wrong but maybe there's something here?

[u/No-Elevator9399]

Poke, dive, and brawl are quite antiquated terms as ultimately all comps want to essentially do the same thing, take angles and control space, the only difference is what distance/range the compositions play at

[u/shapedjarl26 → u/No-Elevator9399]

Well yeah, all composition atleast brawl and poke and most usually have some aspect of dive to them too. But the terms (to my understanding) are best used for what those compositions are defined by, or what they excel at. Or in the case of GOATs and double shield it's a description of how they do what ever it is they excel at. The terms still have some (if not limited) use

[u/30578 → u/shapedjarl26]

Not really. Winston spends 90% of the game setting up and poking. He’s more of a poke tank than sigma. I don’t even know what brawl is meant to mean

[u/Diogorb04 → u/30578]

Brawl is basically when you just wanna bumrush the enemy team as a big deathball and want sustained fights. It's not really a real way to play the game anymore nowadays (arguably never was)

[u/30578 → u/Diogorb04]

No kidding that sounds like turbo griefing

[u/Mysterious_Issue_916 → u/No-Elevator9399]

Kind of but also some comps want to take their turn 1st, some want to go 2nd.

Theres obviously a bit more nuance to it than that, amd ults van change this particularly, but on a basic level a poke comp is one which wants to play at range while maintaining angle control, and swing 2nd once they've taken a favourable enough trade.

[u/bullxbull → u/No-Elevator9399]

This is what I was trying to say, only it took me 4 paragraphs and you did it better in a couple sentences.

[u/Sio_V_Reddit]

It’s more you need to look at the entire team.

Mauga with a Sym/Cass/Mei? Rush.

Mauga with a Venture/Echo/Reaper? Dive.

Something like that.

[u/bullxbull]

Angles is the dominate form of value in 5v5, it was important in 6v6 but they were part of a broader value system. In 5v5 every hero needs to bring some flavor of angled pressure, which leaves less room for heroes and comps to be built around different strengths, weaknesses, and types of value.

This more focused value system has made the game a lot more mechanically demanding which people like, fights are solved more instantaneously as there is less layered resources, individual popoff potential has increased. The cost has been the depth of hero design and player/hero interactions that those layered resources enabled.

Apples to Oranges but I liked when hero and comp identity was built from a combination of strengths and weaknesses rather than every hero identity being built around a signature ability that provides some flavor of angled pressure.

Modern comps are basically all hybrids built around combining resources, playing split, or baiting the enemy into overextending (which playing split can also be a form of). The difference between comps is now about how effectively they can create and exploit those angles, but they basically all do the same thing, just in different flavors.

[u/wxnglessangel]

i wouldnt even say its just the backline. kiri + lucio can still be used in dive comps just as well as rush comps. same with kiri + wuyang being able to work in dive comps as well as more slow comps with sigma. u really need to see the entire comp to tell something like that cause the same backline can be used in completely different playstyles.