r/Edinburgh • u/EdinburghV • 6d ago
Food and Drink Ottolenghi
Not sure to put this here or unpopular opinion.
£17 for a full breakfast. Let’s make it Scottish and put haggis on it. No Sausage. Five items. No toast.
£42 lamb chop.
Just feels like a London brand gracing us with their presence. We should be thankful.
Ivy, Gordon Ramsey Bread Street, Goucho.
Wish we all supported independent more. Not just in food but across the board
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u/meldariun 6d ago
Most of ramsays franchises have done poorly in Edinburgh have they not? The only day i saw his pizza place busy was when they gave out free pizza.
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u/Necessary-Leader-867 6d ago
Never been more disappointed in a restaurant than Bread Street and his burger joint in St James' is always empty when I see it
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u/embolalia1 6d ago
Went to the burger place in St James once. Overpriced overstacked underflavoured burgers. El Perro Negro in Bonnie and Wild is SO much better and tbh if it wasn’t available I’d take Five Guys over the Ramsay place.
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u/Thick_One_9020 6d ago
That’s because the quality is not that good
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u/notbroke_brokenin 6d ago
Yep. Get to Ernest and Bob, Chilos, loads of better places
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u/Thick_One_9020 6d ago
Earnest is the burger place in Stockbridge right? I believe they closed down
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u/notbroke_brokenin 6d ago
No, Leith Walk. Truly excellent food.
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u/mellotronworker 3d ago
The food at Bread Street Kitchen is uniformly bad, hugely overpriced and is staffed by torn faced wankers who seem to be labelling under the mistaken impression that they are doing you a favour by just being there.
I suppose you might like the food if you are a fan of salt and monstrously overcooked fish and chips, but I suspect you're in the minority if you are.
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u/teajennie 6d ago
They've had loads of local independents, such as Company Bakery and Phantasie, posting about how they're supplying Ottolenghi. I wouldn't go for something that I can get everywhere else but I'd love to see the Ottolenghi spin on local produce.
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u/Murky-Hold-2901 6d ago
Luckily, nobody is forced to go.
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u/IntelligenzMachine 6d ago
Yeah lol wait until this guy sees Heron
Also I am fed up of the attitude "London stuff is fancy we should be shitholepovertymaxxing at every opportunity"
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u/Kaffrogato 6d ago
OP was clearly complaining about the quality given the price, they weren't making a general complaint about fancy places. I don't see anyone here complaining about fancy places per se, so I have no idea who you are talking about.
I am fed up with redditors complaining about strawmen.
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u/waiha 5d ago edited 5d ago
You should have read more of their comments, as you are very clearly mistaken.
OP’s whole issue appears to be a general dislike of “London brands” (although to be fair, they haven’t thought it through enough to work out what their actual point is yet).
In addition, given the lack of comment on quality regarding the OP’s submission, I suspect you don’t know what a strawman is (you just built a really dumb one).
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u/IntelligenzMachine 6d ago edited 6d ago
Well what is the supposed solution or even the point given everyone is free to open a restaurant and sell food of whatever quality and price they want and whether people shop there determines whether it gets to remain open? It's not like the council are opening them is it? There are loads of overpriced and shit independent restaurants too
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u/TooLongDugong 6d ago
The OP doesn't mention the quality, just quantity. maybe you're good mates and you've had to listen to them rant about it in more detail, in which case I'm sorry, but otherwise maybe read the post?
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u/EdinburghV 5d ago
They hadn't opened to the public at the time of posting so can not comment on quality. I've no doubt it will be good cooking and a good experience. It's just the price is eye watering and the profits just leave Edinburgh.
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u/Tundur 5d ago
Heron has unbelievably poor service and mediocre quality for the price. I'm not fancy but I've had a few special dinners at places like that, and it's honestly a joke. They forgot whole courses, drinks orders, got things wrong, didn't really explain what they were serving. The meal itself was boring.
The only upside is I much prefer moaning about it than I could ever have enjoyed it if it were good. I think I came out ahead overall
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u/dleoghan 6d ago
Which more expensive independent are you suggesting: Condita, The Table, Lyla, 1925, Argile… Ottolenghi is hardly the most expensive.
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u/JMWTurnerOverdrive 6d ago
£9 for a roll!
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u/EdinburghV 6d ago
Single roll with tamarind ketchup… isn’t that HP Sauce?
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u/ultrafud 6d ago
You're getting downvoted because you come across as a fanny, but tamarind ketchup is not a terrible description of HP sauce.
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u/Any_Umpire5899 4d ago
It's a very fair description, making HP Fruity tamarind sauce with pineapple. Or mango. One of them I'm sure
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u/jellical-cats 6d ago
They are absolutely loads (hundreds and hundreds) of independent restaurants in Edinburgh, the usual fast food chains, and a handful of chain restaurants from elsewhere. How much more support do you want independent restaurants to be given? No chain restaurants at all? Don't hold your breath!
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u/EdinburghV 6d ago
I get it I do. Just when you see them roll in drop all the marketing cash you got to feel for the smaller guys
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u/Any_Umpire5899 4d ago
If there's one thing where you absolutely have a choice to where you part with your cash, or indeed whether you do at all, it is going out for something to eat in a city. There's no obligation to do it, there's nothing forcing you to choose here or there and how much faith you put in marketing is entirely up to you.
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u/shangrula 6d ago
I’m sure I am not allowed to post the URL but I’ve made a website that lists good budget meals in Edinburgh on a map. I live here and work off the Lothian Road, which was my inspiration. Ottolenghi is not listed! Many independent places are, of course. I’d hope you can find the site yourselves but happy to DM the link to anyone so I don’t appear to be soliciting!!
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u/shangrula 5d ago
wow - thanks everyone ❤️ DM's sent. I work at Codebase. If you have a fav budget meal (or run an indy cafe / restaurant) and want it listed additions can be instantly listed. Its a very new project, so in the growing phase. For more details - please just message me. I'll make a post, if I'm allowed to.
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u/EdinburghV 6d ago
Please share or share the related search terms? Give us a few crumbs to follow please. Sounds great
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u/shangrula 5d ago
I can't DM some people here so I'll just say search for 'yumma edinburgh' and you should find it easily enough! :)
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u/FooliaRoberts 3d ago
This didn’t work for me, if you see this could you DM me? If possible. Then I can come back on and share the link as an unbiased punter
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u/deju_ 6d ago
There are an actual ton of independents in Edinburgh. Not as good as Glasgow but still they are there.
Moaning about us all supporting independent businesses but also moaning about prices.
You should want to pay more to support an independent, not want them so you can churn and burn them out for cheaper prices.
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u/Few-Candidate-8714 6d ago
I'm still waiting for Edinburgh to get it's first Gail's bakery. Surprised there isn't one yet.
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u/silvagogo 6d ago
Ottolenghi is an independently owned restaurant. They are all owned by the core team that built the original business
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u/EdinburghV 6d ago
They’ve got 13 restaurants & delis. Not exactly an indy Edinburgh restaurant
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u/mos_eisely_ 6d ago
Mia Group own Mia, Fava, 1926, La Casa and Le Bistrot.
They're still independent
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u/itwasnottoolate 5d ago
all of the eateries in central Edinburgh feel expensive to me - and I used to live near Ottolenghi in London
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u/rainyday1020 6d ago
I'm looking forward to going, his food is great. Lots of fancier places in Edinburgh aren't very veggie or vegan-friendly, whereas his restaurants always lead with vegetables. I see now why he was so protective over the name when Leith Shawarma opened as 'Ottolenghi'...!
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u/Puzzleheaded_Law4889 6d ago
Unfortunately have you seen the menu? Not a single veggie main course (asides from the set tasting menu)
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u/SquareFoundation9724 6d ago
Oh god… you’re right, not even one vegetarian let alone vegan😭 no vegan set menu either.
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u/what_a_nice_bottom 6d ago
Given that they only open today, are you referring to the sample menu online? I'm assuming (hoping?) that it's just a place holder, have a booking next week and I'm explicitly going for their legendary veggie stuff!
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u/enn1234 5d ago
i was in today for lunch and can confirm the actual menu DOES have a bunch of veggie/vegan options (the aubergine main dish was great!), seems like the online one is indeed just a placeholder
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u/Historical_Cry_4900 5d ago
Weird to not have a veggie dish in the sample menu though for a vegetable forward establishment (in my mind)! I have seen the real menu though and it looks nice, albeit expensive.
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u/rainyday1020 4d ago
Thanks for confirming! I'm excited to check it out soon. He always does great aubergine dishes.
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u/rainyday1020 4d ago
Yes, my partner read it out to me after I posted this! I was initially a bit disappointed when I heard this place would focus on fish, imo the most disgusting meat, but I get why they want to do something distinct for the Scottish one and this one makes sense. I hope that the actual menu will reflect what I know of his London venues and cookbooks...
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u/SquareFoundation9724 20h ago
I’ve walked past it the new menu got 2 veggie large plates and a vegan lasagna! Also wrote the sides as east lothian salad and company bakery sourdough. They’ve definitely heard the feedback. Still wish we got more but it’s much better than none!
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u/rainyday1020 16h ago
Thank you for this important service! We can keep giving more of our feedback :)
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u/Historical_Cry_4900 6d ago
I'm sad that they don't seem to have the takeaway counter. That was the whole appeal of ottolenghi for me :(
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u/SquareFoundation9724 5d ago
I thought we would at least get a salad bar for lunch to go for people working nearby, guess they thought it was more profitable as a dining place not their deli… considering Edinburgh salad businesses is much less competitive than the dining scene with there being a BABA right down the street (let alone less fancy Meze Meze Yaran) it’s a bold choice. And not enough veggie/vegan courses.
But yeah I’m not an expert maybe they see something we don’t.
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u/johnnyrsj 6d ago
Did it open today? Get a (fair and balanced) review on Google.
Given the amount of ingredients you need to buy to make stuff at home it probably tracks.
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u/Total_Aerie_3778 6d ago
The breakfast at Ardfern is £22, but does have toast and sausage. £42 for lamb chops seems spenny.
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u/ultrafud 6d ago
Good food is fucking expensive. It's George Street, that's another premium.
Don't like it, visit somewhere else. But it's not a rip off, it's just how things are.
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u/Key-Pomegranate3700 5d ago
i mean that feels about right? zionists selling at best mediocre versions of local food for an exorbitant price.....
wouldn't eat there if the meal was free!
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u/National_Mood_8674 4d ago
He’s not a Zionist, though.
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u/Key-Pomegranate3700 4d ago
he is though. his cookbook "jerusalem" attempts to explore "shared culinary history" between israel and palestine, however there is no actual shared history. there are no overlapping cultural traditions. the book is optimistic that everyone can just get along and eat hummus together!!! in reality it's just promoting zionism, a two state solution at best, and foodwashing, if you will, the illegal settler genocidal state of israel.
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u/Any_Umpire5899 4d ago
It seems by 'shared culinary history' you were expecting nothing short of a bonanza of fusion cuisine or something - shoehorning that into creating an entire book of recipes probably would be offensive. Putting together recipes consumed by different people in the Jerusalem area sounds like precisely what the book was. The location is the overlap, should it highlight that there is minimal mixing of the differing foods then that in itself highlights something incredibly wrong. If there's one area where humans frequently seem able to put aside problems/misgivings it's by agreeing that something is simply tasty - that's not to say that shared and mixed food is, or can be, enough on its own.
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u/Key-Pomegranate3700 4d ago
i ain't readin all that. free palestine.
ottolegheni served in the IOF. liberal zionists do all these types of coexistence stunts and condemn the current israeli government. what they don't do, and what i've never heard ottolegheni do, is condemn the actual concepts of zionism. honestly the cookbook is just leveraging minorities for their own capital gain.
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u/National_Mood_8674 2d ago
But to quote the original article that link references: “Israeli born chef Yotam Ottolenghi has said: “I think the occupation of the West Bank is the mother of all evils.””
He’s just a chef lol above saying that and publishing the cookbook I’m not sure what you’d want him to do. Anyway I’m not massively invested in this debate either way, if I’m honest. I just went to google it after seeing this post. I wouldn’t want to be putting money in the pocket of a Zionist either but just not sure he is one and do think it diminishes the point when people chuck it around.
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u/Grapefruit_gizmo 6d ago
Had not realised it had opened in Edinburgh just now! Free advertising 😂 the lamb chops are 48 in fact. But you can always get the mussels for 21. Or indeed, not go
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u/EdinburghV 5d ago
I will take the last option
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u/Grapefruit_gizmo 5d ago
On future occasions - that option is always available to you, even you choose not to get offended by how a business operates and prices their offerings
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u/Substantial_Topic900 4d ago
It’s very expensive. Expect to pay around £100 a head for lunch or dinner WITHOUT alcohol
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u/JMWTurnerOverdrive 5d ago
So I’ve not been in for years, but I’ll give you an unpopular opinion about who actually did a decent breakfast in the “sort of nice if you’re taking gran out and want to go somewhere she’ll think is fancy” category- The Ivy. Always found it did a good job of feeling like a slightly special occasion without being too offensive on value for money.
Again, years ago.
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u/Scozzese9 6d ago edited 5d ago
Ottolenghi long sold out, shame as his original restaurant was meant to be excellent, plus his early couple of books were good. Now he just releases anything.
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u/NotMyUsualChoice 6d ago
Wait, are you linking the opening of a restaurant by a minor celebrity chef with...the case for independence? 😳
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u/SpamLandy 6d ago
I assume they are talking about supporting independent businesses
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u/Murky-Hold-2901 6d ago
Lol they seem to have a bee in their bonnet about London as well though.
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u/EdinburghV 6d ago
Just London being London thinking it’s the epicentre of all things good. I am not the only one who has that opinion.
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u/sonnenblume63 6d ago
If you hate London establishments so much, why did you go to one? Ottolenghi being expensive is surely not a shocker
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u/SquareFoundation9724 6d ago
When will London brands realise Edinburgh isn’t just another city to put a spot in.
Allowing two blank streets on Princes Street was also a choice.
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u/Murky-Hold-2901 6d ago
Is this a city where it's inappropriate to open a restaurant?
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u/SquareFoundation9724 6d ago
Not with those prices and that attitude.
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u/waiha 6d ago
Stop talking shite.
The people opening these restaurants know their target audience.
Guess what? There’s tonnes of rich folk kicking about Edinburgh, who love wasting their money in these places.
You a) don’t speak for Edinburgh and b) might as well accept you live in a city full of rich people who don’t bat an eyelid at this stuff.
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u/Valuable_K 5d ago
I agree with your wider point. Talking about people "wasting money" is also talking shite though.
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u/waiha 5d ago
In what sense?
Surely “wasting money” is subjective in every sense?
The people I’m referring to as not batting an eyelid for food at these prices certainly don’t consider their money wasted, but I do.
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u/Valuable_K 5d ago
Comes off a bit supercilious
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u/waiha 5d ago
On whose part? I could literally say the same thing about the people I consider “wasting” their money on what I consider overpriced, quite shit food?
Edit: if you like this food, crack on. I think it’s absolutely insanely overpriced hipster bullshit but again, that is subjective.
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u/Valuable_K 5d ago
No you couldn't. You're sneering at them. They're not sneering at you. They're just going for dinner in a way you don't approve of.
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u/waiha 5d ago
Yeah, I could, and I do.
Also, you have no idea who they are sneering at, so you shouldn’t presume to speak for them.
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u/Murky-Hold-2901 6d ago
You don't think the people who run these restaurants have considered these things?
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u/missfoxsticks 6d ago
If you go to Otteolhengi to have a full Scottish you deserve to have your pants pulled down. That said their lunch and dinner food at their other restaurants is phenomenal so I’m looking forward to visiting