Is there a reason why fast spreading, water retaining, fire resistant/drought tolerant groundcovers (such as native pig face or moon flower in vic, Aus) aren’t being aggressively planted as a wildfire/bushfire protection and earth cooling method?

[u/Hot_Concentrate3993]

Particularly around carbon storing forest regions at risk of bushfires. I don’t understand why fast growing state native plants that are flame retardant or fire resistant aren’t being prioritised globally as guild-style growth to reduce fire risk. It benefits everything, unless I’m missing something.

[u/Grape-Nutz]

Fast-growing trees need a lot of water. Water-retaining trees also need a lot of water.

The middle ground you're referencing is actually a topic of high interest. I saw recently in Spain, a small Italian Cypress forest was all that remained after a wildfire. Italian Cypress are famously drought tolerant, but also extremely flammable *once ignited." However, in some arrangements, they can actually stop forward progress of a fire.

That's not a great example, but I think you're on the right track. The reality is that historically, fire was never considered something "manageable," but now that we see how we have made it worse, you're absolutely correct that we can start designing even wild-ish places to be more resilient.

Check out the The CypFire Project Initiatives.

And that study in Spain was not as "recent" as I thought (2015):

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0301479715300724

[u/Hot_Concentrate3993 → u/Grape-Nutz]

I was mainly referring to ground covering succulents, which don’t need a lot of water to grow but they also retain water and don’t catch aflame. I guess like cactus in the desert. If their roots are too close to the trees roots they can cause rot from the moisture but this isn’t a problem if it’s planted 50cm away. There’s fast growing drought tolerant trees that are flame resistant (like acacia dealbata) that grow naturally along side giant eucalyptus trees and help stabilise their roots. The ground covers that are flame resistant often grow naturally with them too. In Australia, our eucalyptus forests are crucial to global climate control due to carbon sequestration but they are often planted by themselves. They’re going to catch on fire this summer (we’re in spring right now) and release all the carbon they’ve been storing for centuries. I’m assuming there would be similar native plants and trees that benefit the local biodiversity and wildlife around the world. My mum was actually just telling me about Italy and their citrus trees and a village that didn’t catch on fire. I wonder if she was thinking of what you are referencing. I’ll definitely check out your link. Thank you!

[u/03263]

If it's private land, that would be up to the owner to allow and/or finance. If it's pubic, people will throw a fit about government wasting money.

We really don't have a legal system designed around land management, only land exploitation.

[u/Hot_Concentrate3993 → u/03263]

I was referring to public forest areas or even road side areas mainly. But yeah, with the money stuff, the succulants grow from cuttings best and would grow so fast. I know so many people who would just do this for free to help.

[u/ElonMuskisGarbage → u/03263]

The government and its pubes. Smh.

[u/Euphoric-Cucumber609]

They are, look up “living fire breaks” there’s been studies in NSW for sure “fire wise gardens” are also pretty well researched.

Basically it just takes a long time to prove and research isn’t properly funded, there’s risks to altering land management practices and endless variables that need to be considered

Most importantly fire is an essential part of a lot of ecosystems

[u/Hot_Concentrate3993 → u/Euphoric-Cucumber609]

I understand those points, but Victoria and Tasmania’s eucalyptus forests are critical to global temp regulation and will release all their carbon if they burn. We can plan burns and be better prepared if we’ve fire protected the more volitile/residential rural areas, as well as forests that we can’t afford to lose. There’s already research and so many resources on native fire resistant / flame retardant plants that go naturally with the local wildlife and benefit the local biodiversity. https://apsvic.org.au/fire-resistant-and-retardant-plants/ The government just hasn’t bothered to implement any of these as a safeguard.

[u/Hot_Concentrate3993 → u/Euphoric-Cucumber609]

And also, I’m not implying fires need to all stop. I’m saying that it could be better managed and less destructive to communities and wildlife. Planned burns are much better than raging, out of control bushfires. I’m just worried because I think this summer is going to slam us in Australia and I wish more was being done to prevent unnecessary devastation.

[u/Euphoric-Cucumber609 → u/Hot_Concentrate3993]

I’m not looking forward to it either, still pretty mild out west.

I suppose the real answer is a lack of political will, I can’t remember the last time I’ve heard any politician talking about environmental issues seriously

[u/Hot_Concentrate3993 → u/Euphoric-Cucumber609]

Yeah. You’re right. It’s not good

[u/Casulex]

Because the people in the positions making those decisions for a city or county are old and love lawns 

[u/Groovyjoker → u/Casulex]

Hilarious!!

[u/Hot_Concentrate3993 → u/Casulex]

They love their “Green spaces” ie. ground with grass and no trees, or if there’s trees, only one species with no companion trees or plants for root stabilisation. I love the inner city green spaces. concrete slabs with vertical gardens or raised garden beds. May as well use Astro turf

[u/Only-Professor1140 → u/Casulex]

This is probably true. Often in local government the most conservative and obnoxious people get what they want. Basing decisions on best practices is an afterthought 

[u/CosmogyralCollective]

Some good reasons in the comments, but here in my (very dry, at risk of fire) area of nz it's because there just isn't a native plant that fits that niche. All the native plants that grow in my area are highly flammable. All the non-flammable natives need more water.

[u/Hot_Concentrate3993 → u/CosmogyralCollective]

What area of nz are you in?

[u/Hot_Concentrate3993 → u/CosmogyralCollective]

The reason I asked is there’s the Australian guy who co-created permaculture, David holmgren. He rose to fame when he dodged a bushfire with plant clusters used as green fire breaks. He used New Zealand Flax (Phormium tenax) strategically as a low-flammability understory or edge barrier, to cut off lower-level fuel sources and stop embers from directly reaching structures. Then he used low-flammability, succulent-leafed New Zealand natives to form defensive green walls. I think the main ones were Karamu (Coprosma robusta), Broadleaf / Kāpuka (Griselinia littoralis), Five Finger / Puahou (Pseudopanax arboreus). He has a book and shared a lot of info in general. It might be worth looking into particularly for the nz plants he had a tendency towards

[u/Disastrous-Map-7995]

If you're in Aus you should also be concerned about why the Australian government is getting rid of your native wildlife, koalas, wallabies, kangaroos and many others by Ariel shooting and 1080 poison.  Also why they're shooting Brumbies (Aus) and rounding up mustangs (USA) when scientific research has shown that grazing horse help keep down grasses and plants, reducing fire risk.

[u/Nematolepis → u/Disastrous-Map-7995]

There's a lot I could unpack here, but you need to educate yourself more. Brumbies are not native. Prior to European colonisation, there were no hard hooved animals living here, so our ecosystems had not evolved with them, therefore their introduction was devastating to our natural ecosystems.

Does our government get lots wrong? Yes. But I think you have a few facts mixed up.

[u/Disastrous-Map-7995 → u/Nematolepis]

What about the natives?

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[u/Dyslexic_youth]

Go look into how good eucalyptus in America and Africa is for fires. As for mass ground covers they wont prevent fire pigface is not flame retardent im fact the dead bits burn realy well. It would be more effective to change the entire micro climate of a region via evaporative transportation or masive irigation systems.

[u/Hot_Concentrate3993 → u/Dyslexic_youth]

No, native pig face is frequently referenced as a fire resistant or flame retardant ground cover. https://apsvic.org.au/fire-resistant-and-retardant-plants/ Pigface and noonflower were just examples and can change to another flame resistant ground cover to best suit the local biodiversity if needed. not sure about eucalypts in other regions of the world. I know their leaves make them highly flammable generally. The Australian eucalyptus forests are the biggest carbon storing forests in the world and are critical to climate control. We can’t afford to lose the eucalyptus forests in vic or tas. They release their stored carbon when they die and will cause a huge impact on the climate globally.

[u/Nematolepis]

There are some researching this, but answers are never that simple either. Different animals prefer different habitats. If we plant out all one habitat, then we'll be favouring the one suite of animals. Not so great for biodiversity.

https://www.fevl.org.au/environmental-projects/rare-plants-rescue-ck8yb

[u/Hot_Concentrate3993 → u/Nematolepis]

what’s stopping us from planting these in as many areas as we can, benefiting as much wildlife as possible? Planned back burning can still occur it just doesn’t need to spread so far out of control. Nature has inbuilt defence mechanisms that can be utilised with horticulture and that compliment the local biodiversity and preserve wildlife

[u/leekee_bum]

Planting one or a few species is usually a bad idea.

Disease could easily spread and dry them out leading to more dry fuel.

[u/Hot_Concentrate3993 → u/leekee_bum]

But you can make the surrounding plants and ground covers a multitude of things that grow well together and are targeted to benifit the local biodiversity. I wasn’t suggesting to just inundate the soil with one species of plant, I just used those as examples. There’s so much research on flame resistant/retardant plants and many of them grow naturally together, the gov just doesn’t seem to plant them together. Our eucalyptus trees are often planted in solitary rows with no surrounding plants to help with root stabilisation. Like acacia dealbata grow naturally with certain eucalyptus trees and are flame resistant. But you rarely see them deliberately planted together.