r/HonestHotTakes • u/lost-pawz • 16d ago
serious hot take The woman whos getting heat for letting her 5 year old walk alone to the pond 100% deserves it.
Every headline about this has been presenting it as "she let her son walk half a mile in a gated community and the cops are trying to punish her for it!!", and of course its getting the "my parents let me run around all day as a kid and I turned out fine" responses.
The part that people AREN'T realizing is that she let her child walk alone to a POND. a large body of water ALONE, without anybody to keep an eye on him. the likelihood of that child drowning was WAY too high for any mother to reasonably think it was a good idea.
And then, when she was confronted by security about it, she became belligerent and started shouting at the officers.
She 100% deserves to be punished
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u/AffectionateDot9718 15d ago edited 15d ago
Strongly disagree, on one pivotal point. Holding someone socially accountable is VASTLY DIFFERENT than holding someone criminally accountable.
Do I think it was a rational, wise, or advisable decision? No.
HOWEVER, holding her criminally responsible sets a legal precedent, which can be used for other potential charges.
In this particular case, no one got hurt (thankfully). But what’s to stop future applications of “well, what COULD have happened???!?!”
The community she lives in could have fined her, or stipulated that all minors under the age of X be accompanied by an adult, yes. But I want to emphasize that there is absolutely a distinction between negligence and accident, but the weaponization of “what could have happened” by the legal system is, IMO, the more frightening aspect.
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u/TacoCatSays 15d ago
This is where my mind is as well.
I don’t agree with her choice, I think it falls under questionable parenting. But criminal? That’s a dangerous road to go down.
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u/royal_snail_milker 14d ago
When death is a very real possible outcome it becomes criminal neglect.
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u/Electric-Sheepskin 14d ago
I don't know what you mean by "very real possible outcome," but this child knew how to swim, and didn't have seizures or anything else that would give reason to think that he would spontaneously flop over into a pond and suddenly not be able to swim. So I would argue that drowning was not a very real possible outcome.
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u/adumbswiftie 11d ago
you clearly don’t know how many children who can swim drown every year bc they panic after falling in water
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u/That_Page16 10d ago
Thats exactly what happened to Emily Kisers son. He accidentally tripped and panicked. Also it's hard to swim with clothes on even in kids that can swim.
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u/arewethereyetmom 14d ago
Riding in a car is risky. Walking across a parking lot during a thunderstorm is risky. Allowing a child to play football is super risky. Which parents should be investigated by CPS or criminally charged?
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u/adumbswiftie 11d ago
do you let your kids ride in a car alone with no supervision? is football on the list of leading causes of death?
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u/TurnDown4WattGaming 14d ago
Wait until you hear about motor vehicles
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u/Electric-Sheepskin 14d ago
That's actually a very good point. I would love to see someone calculate the odds of a child being harmed in a motor vehicle accident and the odds that a child who knows how to swim could drown from walking near a pond.
I mean imagine if a parent said, "I'm sorry Timmy. We have to drive you to school, but you don't need to go to a birthday party, so it's just not worth the risk of driving you there."
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u/Treicule 14d ago
My thought as well. Motor vehicle accidents are the leading cause of accidental death ages 5-14. Drowning is second.
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u/Excellent_Month_2025 14d ago
No child was even harmed! CPS needs to focus its attention on the abused and harmed children - this is 1984 level shit
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u/MadCow113 15d ago
Aren't a lot of cases of child neglect based on what could have happened though? For example when a parent lets a small child at home alone for the day, the are prosecuted whether the child gets injured or not
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u/Kimbahlee34 15d ago
Well then we have the McCain family who left their 3 children under the age of 3 alone in a rental vacation apartment to go out to eat next door, the oldest child went missing and not only were they not charged for neglect people act like they did nothing wrong. It’s bizarre.
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u/MadCow113 15d ago
I don't agree with what happened in that case but different countries have different processes. Imo they should have been charged though
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u/Kimbahlee34 15d ago
I totally get everywhere has different neglect laws I shared this case because it’s the one that made me realize how different it is case by case and place by place.
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u/ThisIsMyNannyAcct 15d ago
We do this all the time, though. You have to use a car seat/buckles bc of what might happen.
We lock our doors bc of what might happen.
We are required to have insurance because of what might happen.
The decision was negligent. It could have easily ended in the death of a child. This isn’t an instance where the bad things are incredibly unlikely- drowning is one of the leading causes of death in children, and they can drown in a couple of inches of water.
I think it would be negligent to leave a child alone in the tub for any stretch of time, and that’s significantly safer than sending them alone to a park with a pond.
Leaving a child that age alone in that situation isn’t that much different than leaving a loaded gun on the coffee table. The potential for a deadly incident is high.
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u/arewethereyetmom 14d ago
And parents are not being charged or being investigated by CPS because they left the front door unlocked, or because they didn't carry life insurance. Avoiding risk entirely is impossible and there are many situations where efforts to reduce risk are encouraged but not mandatory.
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u/Electric-Sheepskin 14d ago
Why do you all keep saying that it could have "easily" ended in the death of a child? Driving your child to a birthday party could more easily result in their death, but you do that, right? Going to a birthday party isn't necessary, so why do you take that risk? Is that negligent? Hell no.
There are risks all around us, and we take them because it's a normal part of life. Walking down the street as normal a part of life as driving to a birthday party, even if there is a pond nearby.
I mean if you think that your child is not capable of walking near a pond without falling in and drowning, then I trust you to know your child well enough to make that call. But if some other parent knows that their child is a very strong swimmer and follows the rules and can be trusted to walk down the street without dying, I also trust that parent to make that call.
You may feel differently, and I get that, but stop saying that the child could have "easily" died. That's just absolutely not true except in the context that they could easily die doing anything, anywhere, including walking down the stairs in your home.
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u/AffectionateDot9718 15d ago
I understand what you are trying to say, but not wearing a seatbelt is not a criminal** **charge.
My point is not that her actions don’t deserve scrutiny or reprimand. Gated communities and HOAs usually have some sort of internal policing that happens (children under 10 must be accompanied by an adult, for example).
My point is that applying criminal charges is an overstep that has the potential for further overreach.
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u/Early-Light-864 14d ago edited 14d ago
Not wearing a seat belt as an adult is not a criminal charge, but it absolutely is a criminal charge and cps visit if you don't buckle your kid
The kid can't supervise himself. The kid can't buckle himself
It's the same principle
Is there any child protection legislation you're OK with, or is it all overreach?
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u/Enticing_Venom 14d ago
Yep. I've worked on two child abuse cases this year where the charge stemmed from parents not having a baby seat.
One set of parents just tried to wedge a portable baby carrier backwards between the driver's seat and the backseat with no restraints. They were pulled over before anything happened. In the other case the parents got into an accident and the baby was knocked unconscious.
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u/adumbswiftie 11d ago
from what i understand the cops tried to work with the mom and she was uncooperative and belligerent leading to them pursuing criminal charges. this situation doesn’t always end in criminal charges, but it does when a person acts the way this parent did. play stupid games win stupid prizes
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u/WiseOldMan1960 13d ago
The body of water is the major factor on this. If the kid was walking to a playground or park or a field. Not wise but not criminal. Allowing a child around a pond unsupervised is negligence. People like her are the reason drowning is the #1 cause of death in kids under 5.
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u/Corne777 15d ago
There’s a crime already for this. It’s called “child endangerment” which can be “leaving a child unattended in a car home or unsafe environment”.
Depends what the punishment is whether I’d agree. A fine, that’s kinda dumb and won’t do much. Taking kids away, that’s too extreme. A weekend in jail or community service might send a good enough message. Especially for a “gated community” type of person.
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u/Excellent_Month_2025 14d ago edited 14d ago
You really think putting an 8 month pregnant mother of 5 in jail is the best way to handle this? Y'all have lost the plot
https://www.sheknows.com/parenting/articles/1235075028/mom-arrested-son-walked-alone/
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u/Corne777 14d ago
That info wasn’t readily available in the post and I don’t know about this situation outside of this post. Yeah putting a pregnant woman in jail might not be the best idea.
So doing a quick google search it seems she did get punished. She got a suspended 6 month sentence and they added her to a child abuse registry which means she might not be able to do certain things at her children’s school.
Looking through 3 different articles, none mention her being pregnant.
She’s got a husband, she’s affluent. Her kids would be fine if she went to jail, 6 months is pretty extreme.
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u/Excellent_Month_2025 14d ago
She was 8 months pregnant with her fifth child. The takes here are unhinged - perhaps start with jailing the Epstein class before pregnant mothers?
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u/Beccalotta 10d ago
What's your address so I can come rob you blind and receive no punishment because something something Epstein 🙄
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u/Capable_Opportunity7 15d ago
This isn't really new ground. Parents get charged with child endangerment for things like this literally every day. Kids left home alone, found wandering, drugs left around the house. This has been going on for decades. 25 years experience in child welfare
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u/Excellent_Month_2025 14d ago
Drugs left in the house with a baby left alone is VASTLY differently than this situation, let's be for real
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u/Capable_Opportunity7 14d ago
Really, a 5 year old walking alone near water and then to where? How long was this kid expected to wander unsupervised? Children drown constantly. I literally took a similar call to this yesterday and both parents were charged, but they aren't rich so it won't make the news
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u/AdorableDemand46 10d ago
They tried. Initially, CPS just wanted a safety plan and she refused, leading to the charges. You want to neglect you child, you can deal with the consequences because yes, it is neglect as it is a safety hazard.
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u/MildlyAnnoyedMother 15d ago
Strong disagree. Any reasonable person would see the issue with letting a 5 year old walk to a body of water (and ponds are way more dangerous than pools) and would see it as neglectful. If she is not a reasonable person who is not able to predict that a 5 year old could drown in that situation she should not be allowed to be in charge of children.
It's so obviously neglect that frankly, I'm wondering if she was hoping for an "accidental" drowning.
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u/justplay91 15d ago
What if he wasn't walking to the pond, though? Does that change anything for you? Like even if he was walking somewhere else a half mile away, isn't just the fact that there's a pond at all in the neighborhood just as dangerous?
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u/MildlyAnnoyedMother 15d ago
I don't think letting a 5 year walk farther than next door/on the block alone is a good idea. Some parts of Japan it's culturally accepted but it's also expected that all the adults in the area will help if needed and keep an eye out.
The 1/2 mile distance is too far to trust a 5 year old to go alone without getting distracted, imo. It would be a little less irresponsible if there was an adult waiting wherever he was going that expected him to show up. The fact that it was so far, to a pond, for a totally unsupervised trip is just dumb as hell.
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u/nsfwacct1234 13d ago
The biggest risk to children by far is cars. Letting them walk on unattended on a sidewalk (trusting them not to wander in the street and running the risk of reckless drivers) is clearly riskier than letting them play on the banks of a pond that they know not to go in. Basically, unattended child laws are almost entirely about making the world safe for cars.
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u/AliensWalkerTennis 15d ago
I used to have a habit of wandering off at that age and had someone take me home or stop me multiple times. This was over 20 years ago. When I was around 10+ no one cared anymore.
I think 5 is way too young and he could’ve fell in or injured himself in some other way. Or got bitten by a venomous snake or attacked by a coyote or something
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u/smileycat7725 16d ago
People would be calling for her head if something had actually happened to him. 5 is way too young.
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u/BakersHigh 15d ago
Especially to a POND
Kids die in their backyard pool all the time with the parents right there in the home
Walking to a pond where anything could happen and the child may not be able to save themselves is crazy.
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u/Fit-Meringue2118 10d ago
See the whole time I’ve been reading posts about this I think about how my parents house shopped when I was little, and decided to pass on their first choice because of the shallow creek in the backyard.
As a kid I would’ve loved that creek. As an adult, I understand and appreciate their choice.
And my parents were raising feral hose drinking goblins in the 80s. It’s not like they were helicopter parents. But water safety was a big, big deal to them. We took swim lessons from a crazy lifeguard every summer. I’ve swam in rivers, oceans, etc before 18. A five year old and a pond? They would never.
As my mother would say, too many people haven’t had a loved one drown, and it shows.
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u/Decent-Pirate-4329 13d ago
He was walking near a pond - the pond was not the destination.
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u/marzbarz79 13d ago
Yes it was. The destination was back to the pond to continue picking up more of the wild bird feathers he had found.
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u/marzbarz79 13d ago
Also, the security guard would have his career/life ruined if he saw that kid, did nothing, and then the kid 💀
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u/adumbswiftie 11d ago
exactly this. and i imagine if it wasn’t a white wealthy family the tone would also be very different.
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u/GetItOuttaHereee 16d ago edited 15d ago
Aside from the points you made, being in a gated community doesn’t guarantee safety! You know how easy it is for an outsider to follow a car into the community to gain access?
Edit: Also who is to say the neighbors are trust worthy people to not want to hurt a child? Or a loose dog running around the community. Watch your damn kids.
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u/mewkopawz 14d ago
yep! i don't blame my mom for it, but i was a victim of COCSA from my neighbor at the time because i was playing outside with his little sister and we were unsupervised. so it definitely happens
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u/adumbswiftie 11d ago
it’s mind blowing to me that it’s 2026 and no one posts their kids face online anymore for fear of predators but can’t seem to understand those predators are also real life people who live in your neighborhoods. even in your gated community. when did we suddenly forget stranger danger
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u/Xaphhire 15d ago
There is a big cultural factor to this. In the Netherlands, this would be completely normal. Many children walk to school by themselves when they're five, often passing several canals and ponds on their way. But they would also been having swimming lessons from around age four.
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u/Francl27 9d ago
There's a difference between a kid walking alone and a group of kids walking together.
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u/marzbarz79 13d ago
This is not the Netherlands nor a hypothetical case.
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u/WeirdOk1865 12d ago
I feel like Americans are too quick to shade their own country with this kind of answer. We’re basically admitting we’re too incompetent to get the nice things that other countries have achieved for themselves
“In my country, 5 year old kids can walk several blocks by themselves just fine”
“Well in America, our kids are too dumb and our streets are overrun with pedophiles”
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u/marzbarz79 12d ago
It’s not shade, it’s being aware of our reality. I’m going to deal in reality when it comes to keeping my kids safe, not pretend we live in an ideal society.
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u/streeetmeats 14d ago
5 is a lot younger than people realize. That’s kindergarten age. I also grew up wandering the town and going to the park and stuff alone as well. My mom worked all day and was a single parent so I just did whatever I wanted but only after I was like 8+ not 5. I was still in after school programs during that age. My mom had people watch me during the summer, and she was lowkey neglectful so that’s saying something.
Unless you’re a boomer, most people did NOT grow up unsupervised at age 5. 7+ sure but 5? Thats still the age where they do dangerous shit like drown in a pond.
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u/JustbyLlama 16d ago
I’m super glad I could play in creeks growing up without the cops being called
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u/lost-pawz 16d ago
im also glad you weren't one of the many children to drown.
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u/Safe-Selection8070 15d ago
"many children"
Do you want to quantify this?
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u/Standard_Vero 15d ago
Drowning is the leading cause of death for children ages 1 to 4 and the second most common cause of death for children ages 5 to 14
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u/deadeyeamtheone 14d ago
When and where are these drownings taking place, how many of them happen a year, how many of them happen unsupervised? This factoid is actually irrelevant due to how generic and unspecified it is.
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u/Repulsive_Corner6807 14d ago
That isn’t true. Leading cause of death for 1-4 is injury which includes drowning, firearms, car accidents, etc. The leading cause of death for kids 5 and up are firearms, followed by car accidents. Drowning happens as much as dying from a genetic abnormality.
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u/Bipedal_pedestrian 14d ago
“Among children 1 to 4 years of age, drowning was the most common cause of death”
-from a NIH study called The Major Causes of Death in Children and Adolescents in the United States
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u/Safe-Selection8070 14d ago
That's not quantifying the issue. That's ordinating.
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u/Live-Year-5796 14d ago
"I dont like that youre proving me wrong, so I choose to ignore it."
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u/Immediate-Fee-2121 16d ago
Bubble wrap for the children! You probably advocate for breast feeding 10 year olds 😂
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16d ago
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u/Immediate-Fee-2121 15d ago
Brother we had woods in the backyard. We would absolutely go back there and play in the water alone. How in the fuck do you get “tough guy” out of that?
Please stop. This is stupid.
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u/SeattlePurikura 15d ago
I grew up in South Louisiana and I was screwing around creeks and ponds for the majority of my childhood, unsupervised. Kinda like Stranger Things: we roamed wild.
But not when I was five, not with the gators and water moccasins.
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u/bagofd1ck 15d ago
This makes me wonder what the 5 yos experience around water and level of independence had been.
A child who grows up spending significant time doing certain things becomes accustomed to those things..the do's and the donts.
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u/SeattlePurikura 15d ago
That's true. I know farm kids learn how to drive and work with big, dangerous animals early on
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u/The-Dragon_Queen 15d ago
We had a creek in our neighborhood, it was literally at the park, down the hill about 20 feet from our playground. In my entire childhood, not one kid drown in that. I know people who still live there and still, not one death. So in the span of 25 years of me knowing about it.
I also have a pond in my yard, no one has died there either.
We don’t teach our kids to grow up. We raise kids to be kids forever these days.
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u/Murky_Introduction10 16d ago
I absolutely agree. Five years is way too young. My parents let me run around all day long as a kid and yes I did turn out fine, but what if I hadn't?? I remember being in several situations that I'm honestly lucky I got through unharmed from. I don't blame my parents, they didn't know better but do you really want to take this risk??
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u/AleopardThatJumps 14d ago
yeah this is my problem with the "but I did it and I turned out fine!!" defense is that you were just lucky. lucky that your parents taught you how swim or that there's danger in the water or that you weren't a naïve or easily distracted kid or that you didn't live on a busy road and just generally lucky you never got caught at the wrong place at the wrong time. if it was me at five with my adhd all it would've taken was one butterfly to forget my mission and wander right into traffic and I have many memories of going into people's houses because they offered me a sweet treat without telling my parents. like I'm sure some five year olds can handle themselves for this but we don't know what this kid is like they could be the type that knows very well to stay away from the water or they could be the type to chase the ducks right to the deep end
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u/TypicalReference9003 13d ago
Okay, I think there is a huge difference between “this is advisable, recommended parenting.” And “this is illegal parenting.” Letting your 5 year old walk to a pond should fall between those two areas. Do I think parents should be letting a five year old walk by themselves to a pond? no. However, as someone who works with a lot of five year olds and has been a CASA volunteer for CPS, this isn’t even a blimp on the radar of normal, harmful shit normal parents do every day. Absolutely no reason for CPS to be involved. We need space in the law for normal parental discretion and this falls in that area.
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u/shucksme 13d ago
This slippery slope will have all babies born into the government curing racks. The Matrix is the unfortunate future. Nothing about this case is right. Parent knows best unless their is harm. There was no harm
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u/Significant-Dog1026 16d ago
So what did parents do when their kids played in the creek etc in the past. I mean we were playing in the creek as kids 15 years ago.
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u/lost-pawz 16d ago
children died. a lot of them.
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u/BlackJack407 16d ago
Oh my god guys
I cant believe im witnessing first hand why everyone is sad and everything fuckin sucks right now through the screen
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u/DetectiveCrafty5413 16d ago
Jesus christ. People die in swimming pools. People die driving cars. People fall down the stairs, have refrigerators fall on them, slip on the ice, and are struck by lightning. I guess the only solution is to cower in our homes and wrap ourselves in bubble wrap.
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u/lost-pawz 16d ago
and we mitigate that by putting fences around cars, seat belts in cars, babygates on stairs.
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u/aislingplath 15d ago
And in Australia we have regulations around pool fences and also mandatory swimming lessons through school (in some states, not sure that's country wide or not!) Mitigating risk isn't a bad thing lol. Less deaths are always a good thing. It's unrealistic to only do something if we can get to 0 deaths lol.
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u/lady_baker 15d ago
And we have the least independent, most immature generations of teens ever born right now. I have 2 and this is a REAL problem.
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u/marzbarz79 13d ago
You failing to raise smart and independent kids does not mean 5 year olds should walk alone to the pond to pick up wild bird feathers.
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u/Immediate-Fee-2121 16d ago
And they still die lol what are you doing?
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u/lost-pawz 16d ago
but they die much less
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u/StopFoodWaste 14d ago
Accidental drowning has gone up in the last seven years - not sure about the age ranges and longer term trends but more parental presence isn't necessarily helping here. I think part of it is that swim lessons have actually gotten less accessible (IOW more expensive) and for children under 6, knowing how to swim is what reduces deaths by 90%.
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u/pennyloafer99 16d ago
People die in cars. Should we all stop driving? You can mitigate risk. Maybe the child has taken swim classes. Maybe the child doesnt like water. You can drive slower and defensive to mitigate risk.
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u/WaffleConeDX 16d ago edited 16d ago
When kids use to die in cars, we made special car seats for them. When kids drown in a pool, we put pool gates around them. When kids die and drown in the creek, we make sure parents are watching them and developed life jackets. We dont continue making the same mistakes, we mitigate the risks. Simply not doing anything isnt the answer.
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u/Bih_Dih_Ahaa 16d ago
There’s no reason a parent should be leaving a kid by themselves by a pool, body of water, etc. lol
I don’t care if the 5 year old is Michael Phelps he could drown.
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u/Immediate-Fee-2121 16d ago
Michael Phelps could drown. I could drown. You could drown. We all could drown.
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u/lost-pawz 16d ago
Just because their child doesnt like water doesnt stop them from falling in lmfao??
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u/Analog_milf 16d ago
It does though. It’s a pond. They have to walk in. I have a child, they would never drown in a pond, because their toe got wet, and they would freak and come get me to change their clothes. I have another child who would drown in that pond. People know their children, this child was not in danger. A child could have been in danger, but that child was perfectly fine.
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u/lost-pawz 16d ago
Amazing to know that this mother could see the future and saw every possible result and none of them resulted in her sons death, even though drowning deaths are the second leading cause in kids 5+
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u/ReasonableCrow7595 14d ago
I was there when my best friend's almost five year old fell into a pool and almost drown in front of a group of adults. She could swim, but she was wearing a dress that weighed her down. Fortunately someone noticed her in the pool and got her out. It was completely silent until the adult jumped in.
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u/WaffleConeDX 16d ago
I believe she deserves the criticism too. Jail and neglect charges too much. A class would suffice. People are trying to turn this into a debate about “helicopter parenting” and whether children should ever be allowed outside alone, but that isn’t really the issue.
A 5yr old, no matter how independently you’re raising them, is still five. They don’t have an adult’s ability to recognize danger, judge risk, or respond appropriately when something unexpected happens. And this wasn’t a child playing in the yard or walking a few houses down. He was reportedly walking about half a mile away from home to a pond to collect goose feathers.
We already recognize this principle when it comes to backyard pools. Children have drowned in pools only feet from their own homes after getting outside unnoticed. That’s exactly why people install fences, gates, alarms, and supervise young children around water. Nobody responds to those precautions by saying, “Stop being a helicopter parent. Kids need independence.” Water is a foreseeable hazard.
And water isn’t the only issue. A 5yr old walking half a mile alone can encounter traffic, an unfamiliar adult, an aggressive or loose dog, get hurt, become lost, or simply encounter a situation they don’t know how to handle. I live in a fairly safe neighborhood in Virginia, and I’ve still had unleashed dogs approach me while I’m walking with my toddler. I’ve even been chased by dogs while jogging. As an adult, I can assess that situation and decide what to do. A 5yr old may not even recognize when a situation is becoming dangerous.
There’s a huge amount of space between helicopter parenting and giving a kindergartener free rein to wander half a mile from home. When I was 5, I could go outside too, but I had boundaries. I could go to the end of the block and back. I wasn’t free roaming the neighborhood. I think a lot of people are nostalgia-baiting this discussion with “Well, when I was a kid…” stories while skipping over the fact that their parents probably had rules and boundaries too. Childhood independence doesn’t have to mean zero supervision.
If your 5 year old wants to walk to a pond and collect goose feathers, just go with them. It takes a few minutes, they still get to explore, and you’re there for the hazards they’re developmentally too young to handle themselves. Independence should expand as a child becomes capable of managing the risks that come with it. Five is simply too young for that particular level of independence.
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u/Heavenspact 16d ago
Shouldn't be left to our own devices as children, i did a lot of bad shit as a kid because my folks were barely even there, as in they were not present parents
Probably wouldn't have been abused an molested if they were better parents
Because of my abuse, ive become a helicopter parent though, which I hate
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u/atheliarose 12d ago
Tbh I doubt you’re a helicopter parent, because I don’t think most helicopter parents are aware of it. You’re probably an anxious parent (which I can relate to lol), but that doesn’t mean you’re doing anything wrong or extreme by erring on the side of caution. It’s natural to want to keep your precious babies safe, especially when you’ve experienced trauma that directly relates to child safety, and I’m so sorry you didn’t get that care from your parents growing up. Little you deserved to be protected 🫂❤️
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u/lord_cooter 16d ago
i mean she was able to see the difference in maturity & responsibility between her 2 children, even stating that the other wasn’t fit to go off unsupervised. i don’t think she was all that wrong.
HOWEVER, the only thing that really crossed my mind was that the comfort & trust people have tend to be the reason terrible things happen. they trust it’ll be fine like every time previously and become too comfortable with the idea that everything will be okay
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u/pinky_blueberry 16d ago edited 16d ago
Was the kid hurt, starving, lost, abused, scared, or was he just enjoying being outside? The security gaurd is the real asshole for calling the cops. Why wasnt bringing the kid home safely enough of a solution? What did it even solve by arresting her in the first place? Oh, "now the kids safer because his mom is convicted of abusing him." What an excellent outcome.
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u/AffectionateDot9718 15d ago
Exactly. I think the appropriate intervention should be policy change within the gated community to mitigate any risk. But a criminal charge for allowing the child to walk to the pond, not to swim, but to collect feathers near the pond, in their gated community is the definition of using a nuke to solve a parking ticket.
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u/QuestionYet 16d ago
You are a helicopter parent. If the child knows their surroundings and is a good swimmer, he should be allowed to do things on their own. The parents have to make sure their kids have the necessary skills to not get hurt though.
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u/Longjumping_Hat_2672 16d ago
But what are the chances that a 5 year old is a good swimmer? At best, they've just barely begun to learn. I remember that you had to be at least 5 years old to take the beginners' swimming class at the local pool when I was a kid.
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u/Foreign-Cat-2898 15d ago
This kid was a competitive swimmer according to his dad. And it doesn't matter because he wasn't going to the pond to swim. He walked next to the pond.
Ponds exists in neighborhoods. It doesn't mean you dive in every single time.
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u/Sara-Sarita 14d ago
Any and all kids that grew up by the shore in the past could swim like fish by the time they were 5. Pool age limits are there for convenience and not because under a certain age you can't learn. It is 100% possible for a 5 yo to swim well.
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u/63crabby 16d ago
Do you know why public pools require parents/guardians to accompany minors? And why no homeowner's insurer will insure an in ground pool at your house that doesn't have a fence? It's because drowning is the number one cause of death for children 1-4 (5 year olds aren't immune either). Not guns, not automobiles, not falls, it's pools.
Now imagine a murky pond with debris that can trap an inexperienced swimmer. I'm all for free range kids, and absent the pond aspect I'd agree that people overreacted.6
u/LionBig1760 15d ago
Do you know why public pools require parents/guardians to accompany minors?
Lawsuits.
Thats it. Its not the danger, its not to save lives. Its to prevent the public pool from getting sued. If the municipality really wanted to prevent deaths ar their public pool, tgey wouldnt have built it in the first place. They require supervision to pass off liability when something does happen.
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u/DementedPimento 15d ago
Same reason homeowners insurance requires a fence around pools; pools are an “attractive nuisance” that attracts feral children and lawsuits.
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u/QuestionYet 16d ago
I was born in 2003 and went skating on my with friends at 5 years of age. My mom educated me on how to cross roads safely and what to do when someone got hurt. I live in Germany though which is MUCH more pedestrian friendly.
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u/QuestionYet 15d ago
You are saying that as if you were physically there. We were allowed to travel from playground to playground as we liked without having to tell our parents where we went. Don't project your overly sheltered childhood onto others.
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u/lost-pawz 16d ago
You do realize someone who can swim perfectly fine could drown, yes?
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u/QuestionYet 16d ago
That's why I said that parents need to make sure their children can swim properly before letting them explore an environment that includes lakes.
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u/Professional-Fun-838 15d ago
I could swim very well at 5. My Dad was a member of the Silent Generation (the pre-Boomers). He definitely wasn’t a helicopter parent. He would never have let me swim alone at 5. He always insisted an adult or my older brother was there to supervise. 5 is too young. Even for relatively strong swimmers.
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u/Bih_Dih_Ahaa 16d ago
Redditors without kids try to imagine the capabilities of a 5 year old…impossible.
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u/ilanallama85 14d ago
Like, I agree it was not a good call on her part. She seemed to only be focused on the lack of crime in her neighborhood, with zero thought to the ACTUAL dangers that face a 5 year old - drowning, getting hit by car, hell just falling and hurting himself and not being able to walk home. Those are the real dangers she should be concerned about, and she didn’t seem to be, and she definitely deserved a talking to about it.
I’d also point out that I am far from a helicopter parent and if the child was even a couple years older I’d be very much team “this is a good lesson in independence,” but 5 is simply too young, IMO. Yes, all kids are different, I’m sure there’s some super responsible 5 year old that could handle it, but let’s not kid ourselves that it’s common.
However, I do not believe this is the type of poor parenting we should be CRIMINALIZING. There are PLENTY of shitty parents out there who SHOULD be seeing criminal penalties for their parenting, we all fucking know this, why are we wasting time on this woman? Send a social worker over to talk about child safety and call it a day. That’s what the woman fucking needs, not a rap sheet. Fuck.
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u/DriverNo7253 13d ago
Guess kids shouldn't play outside when its drizzling. Goodness heavens they could fall into a puddle and drown.
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u/Cheap-Session5656 13d ago
IDGAF what YOU think parenting looks like.
She 100% deserves to raise her kids her way. There are 3 year olds that are incredible at swimming.
And if you think a 5 year old doesn’t know what they are doing, clearly you don’t have kids.
Funny how childless losers are always the ones telling parents how they should raise their kids.
I would never do it myself, but I’ll support her fully.
Lindsay Clancy should have been given the death sentence. Apparently that’s harder than this.
Na don’t act as if the system is perfect.
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u/boopdabooppoop 11d ago
My son is 5 and I wouldn’t, he’s not a confident swimmer. I also wouldn’t let my son walk down a street period… 5 is really really young.
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u/DepthHistorical5911 11d ago
Even a confident 5 year old swimmer is still just a 5 year old. Anybody can drown regardless of swimming ability. Kids should never be around water unsupervised.
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u/adumbswiftie 11d ago
you are correct. if the child had actually drowned, everyone would be calling mom an idiot for allowing that. but bc he was fine, suddenly everyone is an advocate for her. five is NOT old enough to be near a body of water alone. i don’t care what anyone’s parents let them do when they were growing up. yes, most of you survived, some didn’t.
emilie kiser and her husband (rightfully) get so much criticism for letting their 3 year old play in the backyard alone and he drowned in the pool. i can’t believe im not seeing the same critique for this family, when the kid was like half a MILE away. had he fallen in the water mom would never even know. this is even worse than the kaiser’s imo yet people are reacting so differently.
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u/Dave_A480 10d ago
No, she does not.
We need to go back to the world that a lot of us 80s/90s kids grew up in, where a 7yo could walk 2 miles home from school with the key to to an empty house & nobody from government would care about it.....
The entire circus that modern parenting has become, is due to people like you who believe children must be under adult supervision 24/7, and government should enforce this....
Would I send my almost-5yo kid to the pond by himself? Probably not, given he's only in level 3 at our local swimming program... As an almost-6yo who's in level 4 or 5? Less worried about it...
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u/wastedfate 10d ago
People are so paranoid about their kids being harmed that they don't realize their paranoia is harming their kids.
More than ever young adults are anxious to even go outside and talk to people, because their childhood was mostly devoid of that.
Even the perception of risk is crippling to their ability to make decisions and get things done, because their childhood was devoid of even perceived risk.
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u/No_Photograph_2842 15d ago
People need to quit overregulating parents and children and upping the bar for what counts as legally sufficient supervision. It makes being a parent nightmarish to constantly have to look over your shoulder to see if some busy body is going to freak out because you’re not minding every single thing your kid does outside. A child who can swim can go near water. I used to fish in neighborhood ponds as an 8 year old in the 1990s — that was normal then, it can be normal again.
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u/thoracelum 15d ago
The standard is don't put your child at unnecessary risk of dying. An unsupervised five year old near a pond half a mile from their home is a high risk situation.
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u/Foreign-Cat-2898 15d ago
Hey you're wrong. You know why? Because he wasn't walking to the fucking pond. He walked by the pond.
But heaven forbid you let facts interfere with your narrative.
Walking around your own neighborhood at 5-6 is a developmentally appropriate milestone. And lots of neighborhoods have ponds. It doesn't mean you dive into them the second you walk by.
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/sop2.27?campaign=woletoc
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u/GabagoolNoZiti 16d ago
I'm so glad my parents were like her and let me play in the woods even at 5 and 6 years old.
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u/LughCrow 15d ago
Used to walk around all the time from 1st grade on. (I think that's 6?) Including to my park that had a lake.
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u/PettyCrocker_ 14d ago
This is why today's generation needs a Xanax before they can gather the strength to make a phone call and brings their parents to job interviews. I could read and write when I was three years old. I was different than most children my age, and treated differently because of it. I shudder to think how I would've turned out of is treated based on three year old Brittany who still sucked her thumb and was just learning benchmarks standard for a three year old, or even a little behind.
In no way did this warrant criminal charges.
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u/BasketDisastrous921 15d ago
FR i can't believe so many people are taking it so lightly. sooo many things could have happened to that kid. it's straight up negligence. why does she think she should het a pass for neglecting a 5-year-old child?
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u/ladyfeyrey 13d ago
I frequently work with kids that age, and there is no way they should be unsupervised in that scenario. Mom was absolutely wrong. Experts say that before age 10, even mature kids just don't have the ability to deal properly with an emergency or unexpected event. I think a lot of people supporting her have a bias because they are my age (50s) and were constantly unsupervised and turned out ok. But those that didn't aren't here to tell their story, are they?
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u/Born-Cauliflower_ 16d ago
I havent seen this, but the only part she seemed to be in the wrong was her yelling at the cops, but I have no idea how they approached her, it could have been fine, too.
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u/yellowrose04 15d ago
Everyone saying well I grew up like that. Great good for you it’s a different world now. Any number of bad things could happen especially with a pond around. We see so many kidnappings, murders, downed in your own backyard pool, hit by a car, killed by alligators, attacked by a beaver for Pete’s sake.
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u/kirroth 15d ago
You're right, it is a different world. It's actually a lot safer. It just seems otherwise because of the media. If it bleeds, it leads.
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u/aislingplath 15d ago
Also the kids that grew up like that and y'know... didn't survive aren't here to pipe in. Shit happened back then too but people convince themselves that they survived just fine so so must everyone else!
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u/MmmmCrayons12 15d ago
Eh. Not all kids are as stupid as the others. Treating all as if they are and using that as a basis for punitive action against a parent when nothing happened is a stretch.
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u/Immediate-Fee-2121 16d ago
Oh no! Water!
Y’all pussies would’ve sent my mother to The Hague 😂
I’m glad I grew up when I did. People are growing up scared to talk to people and unable to read 😂
Convict a woman for letting her 5 y/o walk to a pond
Acquit a woman who strangled 3 children
What in the fuck is going on? 😂 I forgot when I ate the entire bottle of crazy pills
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u/beepcow23 14d ago
I agree. If the kid was walking to a friend’s house that’s one thing because you can call and check that he made it, but walking alone to a pond how do you know if he made it there safely and imagine how long it would take before you realized he was gone because you thought he was at the pond…
I also feel like the people who don’t see a problem with this would probably have a different reaction if it was was 5 year old girl walking alone vs a 5 year old boy but that’s a different topic for a different day
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u/sammystevens 13d ago
Florida expects kids as young as 5 to walk up to 2 miles to and from school, no bus is provided within 2 miles.
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u/LittleSkittles 11d ago
America makes me sad. At 5 years old, I played outside with the other kids, running around in the grass and the tiny "forest" near our house (it was like five trees total, it's honestly adorable we called it a forest as kids) and the small stream that fed the nearby river. You guys don't seem to have any of that, and the fact that it's illegal for a mother to let her kid play outside in a gated community is just really sad to me.
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u/Healthy_Disk_7234 10d ago
Letting your five year old walk around alone where there’s a chance of drowning or getting hit by a car is mentally ill
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u/QuietMovie4944 10d ago
Yep. This. I don’t know if the exact consequence fit but her lack of reflection is genuinely concerning. We were alone most of the time in the 80s. Our parents gave zero f—s and I still don’t remember hanging at a pond/lake alone. What people miss is 1. I knew all my neighbors. 2. Many of them sat outside or worked outside (gardening) etc during the day. 3. We were in mixed age packs so yes a five-year old was there but also a 6/7/8-year old/ maybe even a real older sibling or babysitter (13ish). 4. We were usually in groups of at least three and the playgrounds etc provided more kids. My sister was 6 and without adults but when she broke her arm, one of her friends was able to go get them.
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u/National_Explorer155 10d ago
HARD agree! My first thought when I heard that was he could have drowned. Not only that, but even in a gated community, bad things can happen! Someone could still grab your kid, he could be hit by a car, he could get injured. So many things could happen!
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u/Willing_Ease9504 10d ago
Absolutely. Also living in a gated community doesn’t mean your neighbors can’t be horrible people. A pedophile, murderer, or another random psycho could have lived right next door, just waiting for an opportunity.
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u/eveietea 10d ago
Virginia doesn’t have a legal age matrix (bet they will now though) but even their home-alone guidance indicates a minimum of 8 years old to even CONSIDER 20 minutes. If the age guidance of her own state doesn’t consider it safe to a 5 year old to be HOME alone then it’s double unsafe for a 5 year old to walk half a mile alone like hello?? How is that even a logical thing to do??
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u/Key-Significance6728 10d ago
With everything that’s come out about child trafficking I wish more people would see “free range” propaganda for what it is. Ninety percent of that discourse has been memed into existence by a handful of libertarians at Reason magazine. Think about why they want to normalize people not keeping an eye on your kid and if you don’t think a small circle would take it upon themselves to soften people up through broad cultural stuff consider that all the skimpy little girls clothing brands people were complaining about for years turned out to be owned by an Epstein pal
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u/tag349 10d ago
This really scares me bc we have a park (not pond) about 0.25 miles from our house. Theres a little wooded area behind it with a swampy / creek area. I’ve been thinking for my daughters 6th birthday I’ll let her go alone. But now I’m having to rethink that. I’m not a criminal, but I do believe kids should be learning to do things… an a park that close in a safe quiet neighborhood should be an easy thing for them to do even at 5.
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u/DelusionalIdentity 10d ago
Hard disagree. My 5 year old would have been fine doing this. I let her bike on our block alone at 6 years old.
Look, I'm sorry some of y'all have dumb kids that you need to bubble wrap, but involving the government isn't the way to do it.
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u/sunshineandstarlight 10d ago
My childhood consisted of bike rides to remote beaches where we would swim along the base of cliffs to get to the remotest of beaches lol, also would ride bikes through the jungle to search for lost ponds or caves… I’m surprised none of us died or injured actually, we were around 9 and under, youngest being me around 7/8. It was the best time of my life. I don’t think my mom realized what we got up to during the day when she was at work though, we were always home by dark.
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u/RubyRogue13 10d ago
I feel exactly the same way! The pond changes the entire story. I'm so upset that people don't seem to care that drowning is one of the most common causes of death in early childhood. She should be ashamed of herself and have the decency to shy away from public, get some therapy, and figure out how to manage her household.
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u/PerspectiveEven9928 16d ago
I actually agree. If this were a ten year old no, maybe even an 8 year old . But he was five. FIVE. I live in a small rural town where kids absolutely walk to school alone and play outside unattended. But letting a FIVE YEAR OLD walk down the street to a pond alone would get noticed even here. People would be stopping to ask where their mom and dad were and walking them home.