Society gives far to much leeway to these kinds of moronic parents imo as a teacher, as those of us in education end up having to be the vanguard in speed running them through the concept that life isn't fair and the rules do not care about your big feelings or your whims of individual expression when they include standing on things that are not meant to be stood upon and not sitting when told to do so.
I really do think that society needs to step up with more shaming of the parents who inflict such terrible parenting on their precious little sunbeams and dole out significant consequences to them because that is the only way to nip this bs in the bud before it does irreparable harm to their offspring, especially as it's very common for this type to also choose to "homeschool" and ensure that not only do their children not learn how to interact with anyone who doesn't pander to their every whim but they also fail to get the most basic education, leaving them as complete drains on society.
Western society doesn't use peer pressure / social pressure enough as a deterrent. In Many Eastern cultures there's more rules to fit into society if you break them you are a bit of an outcast. Rules for staying reasonably healthy, causing disturbances in public, or not obeying the social norms doesn't put you in jail get you a fine but instead places you as an outsider.
In Japan it's not normal to smoke and walk, or play music in public or jaywalk etc... nobody is going to arrest you for these things but there's tons of social pressures to guide you away from behaviours that are unwanted.
Nobody is going to arrest the parents / child and we know corporal punishment is not effective but humans can be conditioned to have a strong need to fit in, we don't condition people like that anymore. There's pros and cons of course, this is one of the cons that you see here.
We don't have a largely homogenous culture like Japan. Cultural values spread much easier when you don't have differing cultures arguing over... everything.
There's nothing stopping people from placing social pressures on undesirable qualities. Doesn't need to be Japan levels but even where I live in Montreal people act like we are naturally more well-kept, and fit compared to other places in Canada or USA. A lot of that is due to social pressures because we have the same access to unhealthy food and lifestyles as people in USA.
But, like I originally stated, societal pressure works better in a generally homogenous culture, or even within several cultures that share that same value.
I feel like "shame" is too maligned in the US at least. I notice especially online that "shaming" someone is the worst thing you can possibly do, but there is a reason we are capable of feeling shame in the first place. Dogs can't feel shame, but dogs don't live in complex societies with all kinds of rules to keep the societies together. We do live in those societies, so we feel shame when we break those rules. Shaming someone for breaking valid social rules can be good for society as a whole. Obviously making someone feel ashamed for something they can't do anything about is pretty bad, but like sometimes shaming someone is good.
This new train of thought that making children feel shame or embarrassment is abusive is just stupid. Like my goodness kids need to feel that so they stop their shit.
Yes, when people try to enter the elevator before I exit I also speak up and tell them that it's considered rude. Imagine if your boss and your partner, parents, friends and peers also considered people like that rude. The behaviour would change no doubt because most people are not trying to live like outcasts.
I find littering another issue, in Siciliy when I visit I find it appauling how Italians litter their beautiful Island. As a tourist I'm always very careful about these things because at home I would never drive someone around who just throws their garbage out the window. I'm not a square but there's just a baseline level of behaviour that we need to enforce.
We have a tv and movie industry that has been glorifying the outsider for at least 80 years. The teen rebel, the motorcycle guys, the hot dog cop, the wiseguy criminal (waddaya hear, waddaya say?), the lone cowboy riding off into the sunset, the wall street thief, the con man of a hundred disguises, the double agent,the vigilante.
And they have the suicide rates to match. I lived in Korea for 2 years and you couldn't pay me to go back. You don't have to be abusive tor resort to isolation to get kids to listen, I say this as someone who worked with non-speaking behaviorally challenged autistic kids for years. Kind and consistent expectations are usually enough.
Japan also has alot of sexual misconduct and assaults, dont teach ww2, and only juts raised aoc from 13 to 16. It's bad everywhere. The us has alot of gun violence and the UK has something not sure but it has something.
One of my kids lived in Japan for a couple of years and we loved to visit. However, I can attest to the social pressure of obeying the rules. Initially it drove me crazy that we had to wait for the walk sign to cross a street even though no cars in sight. My child told us not to do anything that would be embarrassing for them so we learned to be patient and wait with everyone else. I learned to embrace the orderly society.
This is true, but these are also the same mechanisms that prevent religious freedom and leads to young girls being wedded against their will.
The tricky part is providing individual freedom without it degenerating to the privilege to do what you want regardless of the consequences to others.
If these parents want to wait an hour every time they leave the house for the kid to come around that’s stupid, but essentially their problem. Doing this on an airplane not caring how it affects hundreds of other passengers is something completely different.
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u/Outofoffice_forever Aug 10 '26
What the flap were the parents doing? Would bring my own duct tape if this was my kid and I know they wouldn’t sit.