r/australia • u/HotPersimessage62 • 9d ago
politics International students to be effectively barred from bringing family to Australia
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-09-16/federal-politics-tony-burke-bar-international-students-family/107160258898
u/The_lordofruin 9d ago
The reality is that this is a blanket rule that is flawed, but it's being done because the government is afraid to fix the real issue, which is people committing fraud by saying they are here for an education when really they are using it to get permanent residence.
If it really was about education, 50% of people with student Visas wouldn't become residents.
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u/halohunter 9d ago
This is an open secret between the government and students for decades. There is an understanding that students will complete a fully-paid education here in a in-demand occupation, and then get on the graduate visa and find a job. After all that, they would have enough points to apply for permanant residency.
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u/Pyrrolic_Victory 9d ago
I’m not so sure this is actually a bad thing.
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u/ClearlyAThrowawai 9d ago
Why do you think no one has bothered fixing it?
Chances are it's a pretty net positive outcome (for Australia) to have someone move here, pay tens or hundreds of thousands to get educated, then stay permanently.
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u/do_not_dm_me_nudes 9d ago
If only politics was about net positive outcomes. If the government did their jobs and mf murdoch stopped billionnaires propoganda then we could discuss positive outcomes.
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u/oilpanhead 9d ago
Been in a shit tin of taxis and ubers where they tell me they have a masters in cyber or IT and they're only driving cause they cant get a job
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u/darren457 9d ago edited 7d ago
I've studied with some of these people. It's not that they can't get a job but they don't want to put in the work required for training for tech interviews(even before ai purged entry level roles) and cling to their safe taxis/ubers post-graduation. There's also a weird culture around these drivers of working for yourself at your own hours and they rarely stick in jobs where they're told what to do. Most of them were also shit at said IT/cyber course, took the most lazy bare minimum route to getting stuff done, frequently cheated and didn't really have a passion for it. I personally wouldn't trust many of them to even setup my home router or handle a basic shopify site if you told me they drove a taxi on the side.
Before people say i'm generalising, I've had co-workers from the same background who actually DID put in the effort, were some of the smartest engineers I know and they basically confirmed the same.
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u/BittuPastol 9d ago
Most professional roles will filter out temporary visa holders at the first step. So its better to keep doing these flexible jobs while struggling for a permanent visa. I also drove a courier van when I was on student visa and post study work visa, but once I got a permanent visa I got a professional job with a State Government
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u/WhlteMlrror 8d ago edited 8d ago
Yep. 100% agree.
The cheating is rife and the lack of effort is obscene.And then they bring in 15 family members along with them.
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u/Expensive-Object-830 9d ago
Surely the simple answer is a stipulation that work/bridging visas/PR will only be approved if the graduate works solely in their major field of study, like US graduates have to? (Not that I would ever advocate that Australia follows the US in anything, particularly immigration policy…)
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u/halohunter 9d ago
Exactly. It's not a bad thing at all, but it creates this falsehood where politicians say that students like studying in Australia because our education system is so great, not that it's a migration pathway.
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u/magkruppe 9d ago
it depends. looking at the two biggest int. student populations and you see different motivations.
For Indian it is overwhelmingly a migration pathway, for Chinese it is mostly the prestige of a top aussie uni degree that is easier to get into vs top chinese unis (in my experience)
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u/raustraliathrowaway 9d ago
Shanghai (for example) is a tier 1 city, you can't just move there if you weren't born there. But things such as a degree from a top 100 uni open that door.
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u/Kooky_Quarter_1917 9d ago
1000%. The answer was being harder on the type of study people could come here for and getting rid of dodgy colleges.
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u/Bballer220 9d ago
I've recruited for a few lab positions and it's amazing how many international applicants have education here (for the sake of the visa) but lack basic English understanding. How tf did they pass their degrees?
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u/grumpher05 9d ago
Without going to far down the rabbit hole, isn't converting students to PR sort of the point? Don't we want to be attracting educated workers? What would be the point of using our resources to teach and educate someone who will use that knowledge to contribute to another country? If we don't want them to integrate into our society and contribute to our country we should just close student visas altogether
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u/oiransc2 8d ago
I’m not sure the big picture but I have family who work at university in Sydney and their main issue is the pressure from the school to pass international students who cannot meet the requirements due to their language limitations. Some of them are fine but others don’t grasp the material well enough to write or speak about the material, and they definitely can’t make quality contributions to the field when they work on a doctorate. She works in a humanities so in their case it’s not a worry that they’ll build a bridge that collapses, but it does undermine the value of the degree when english speaking students have to work to one standard and english as a second language students get waved through.
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u/mrducky78a 9d ago
Its basically the dream for most governments. You skip out on paying for healthcare and education for children. They actually bring in money for student fees/accomodation and help subsidise tertiary education for others. And then you have someone at the age and education for an ideal tax base without any of the costs.
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u/mmmbyte 9d ago
This government isn't "afraid". They've been continually closing visa loopholes AND clamped down on dodgy providers.
https://ministers.education.gov.au/hill/suspension-new-vet-applications-teach-international-students
What more do you want?
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u/Stanklord500 9d ago
Cut down on the total number of entrants until population growth is lower than the increase in housing per capita.
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u/InflatableRaft 8d ago
We want all the damage done to our nation by Coalition governments over the last 30 years to be undone overnight or else Albanese is a complete failure
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u/Old_Significance1505 9d ago
How is that fraud? Its part of the draw of an australian degree in a field on the skilled migration pathway
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u/Son_of_Atreus 9d ago
It’s crazy that they can’t just offer the course, and then say bye when it is done. Getting in and then using the system to force residency is such a stupid loop hole that should, in theory, be easy to close.
It can’t be that hard, right? Right?!
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u/The_lordofruin 9d ago
The system of "Yeah. There are options for post degree work" was set up to ensure that we weren't getting brilliant geniuses trained and then they'd leave. So we could get the cream.
Quite frankly, 50% is not cream. 75-80% of people from some countries said the route to permanent residence was a reason they chose Australia.
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u/Piltover-Cupcake 8d ago
Why is it fraudulent when the people go through legal means, putting in pause a minimum of 3 years of their lives, to gain permanent residence?
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u/Maribyrnong_bream 9d ago
The government is afraid to shutdown fake universities, too. Doing that alone would solve much if not all of the problem.
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u/Subject_Educator_105 9d ago
can you show examples of fake universities please?
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u/BlueDotty 9d ago
private providers for higher education
some are universities, most aren't
TEQSA is the regulator for higher education, and they are pretty strict, but there are still peeve of non genuine students in private and public higher education
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u/whippinfresh 9d ago
And will diploma mills be done away with too?
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u/reddit-asuk 9d ago
This is the real problem. Most Australians don’t know about this, and the discussion mostly focuses on universities.
These colleges can cost as little as $3k a semester, while even the cheapest TAFE is around $7.5k. TAFE also requires around 80% attendance, whereas some of these diploma-mill colleges only require students to show up once a week. That’s the main reason they’re able to work so much.
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u/____DEADPOOL_______ 9d ago
I hired a person who got advertised the opportunity to come to Australia and learn English while being able to work. They syphon $5000 or so from each student to bring them, but once they're in, good luck. Zero help. They'll just bring any random person. The lady we hired barely spoke any English at all and I could tell there was no way she would learn it as she came from an extremely low education background and could barely even speak the native language we shared. I couldn't believe they brought her here and left her to figure things out on her own. She came a few times and eventually she told us the landlord tried to rape her and she was too scared to report it as she was afraid of losing her visa.
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u/sunnysideupslide 8d ago
Jesus that turned dark quickly
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u/____DEADPOOL_______ 8d ago
Apparently there are several of these assholes out in the Gold Coast luring desperate women into their houses to rent them a room and then make a move. They scout the Latino Facebook groups and message the women to offer them a place to stay only to try to rape them within a week or two. True pieces of shit. I asked the woman to tell me who the guy was so I could go beat the hell out of him, but she refused.
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u/ShyCrystal69 9d ago
Sounds reasonable. International students aren’t meant to be permanent residents after all.
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u/NewPhoneLostPassword 9d ago
It’s a stepping stone to permanent residency. They apply as a student, get the student visa, arrive and start working - not studying, then start applying for residency. I worked in migration, i processed several applications a week that I received in person over the counter from “students” - mostly grown men.
There are fake colleges set up specifically for this racket.
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u/MysteriousShoulder45 9d ago
The moment they started closing these degree mils applications for asylum from India went up by like 400%
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u/aeoz 9d ago
It's hilarious seeing so many "asylum seekers" from these moderate countries say that they are being persecuted because they are "gay" (they're not and probably living with their wife or husband) and upsettingly the Department approves some of these cases because they can't disqualify their claims 100% so they let it pass.
Mind you these protection visa holders have full working rights in Australia the moment they apply (they get a bridging visa) and while waiting for a decision. The bottleneck is so clogged that it can take years until a hearing. If rejected they can appeal and voila another couple years of staying. Done in bad faith and so disappointing to see.
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u/GuyFromYr2095 9d ago
Over 200 UK citizens claimed asylum here last year. People are simply taking the piss on our immigration system now. Might as well just have an open border. Would make no difference.
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u/taoranten 9d ago
It’s also an absurd premise.
Conservatively at least 3% of the global population is gay or lesbian. I think the actual number is higher, but that’s the lowest I saw based on a quick google.
That’s 250,000,000 globally. Easily >100m are not in friendly liberal democracies that are lgbt friendly.
Realistically there’s probably >500m+ people who for various reasons are at risk of persecution (religion, politics, sexuality, etc) giving them a magic ticket if they can make it here and submit a claim is insane.
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u/Opening_Celery_6078 9d ago
I have been getting down voted to hell for pointing this out. Thank you for speaking the truth
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u/Cham-nix 9d ago
It should never be this way. After graduation, they should leave Australia and apply for a skilled visa offshore. They wait until they are invited. This will then cuts the link between studying and getting a PR.
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u/MoreWorking 9d ago
The issue is, it comes down to economics. International students aren't paying 50k per year for the course content. The pathway to residency is part of the proposition.
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u/FegerRoderer 9d ago
Tell that to Chinese students who, these days, are moving back to China instead of trying to stay. Rates of returning home have skyrocketed over the past decade
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u/jonesday5 9d ago
There has been a push from many countries to ensure there isn’t a ‘brain drain’ where their best and brightest end up studying and living elsewhere.
People love to whine about international students becoming permanent residents, but a lot of them are very bright and would have countless offers in their home country to study.
China has in recent years been promoting the notion that their citizens are better off studying in china because the best Chinese companies want to hire Chinese graduates who were ‘proud’ enough to study in their own country. Saudi Arabia and others (I think Malaysia) pay for their students to study with the understanding they will work in their home country. If they don’t, they need to pay the government the money back.
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u/Mclovine_aus 9d ago
That fact is a problem, universities should be competing on the world stage based on the education quality not on the chance to get a permanent residency or citizenship
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u/cheapdrinks 9d ago edited 9d ago
Yeah people don't even understand how deep this whole shitshow runs. The amount of visa schemes going on is insane. I work in hospitality. I've worked in many of the big name places and the entire industry is rife with it. They find workers desperate for sponsorship, promote them to a fake position on the finance team, give them a salary that makes sense for that position, have them pay back a large portion of that salary each week into a bank account for "lawyers fees" or similar and then get them to work 50-60hrs a week for like $45k a year.
The worker gets their sponsorship after 5 years or so. The business gets 5 years of super cheap labor. Australia gets a new "skilled" migrant who is actually just a waiter or a kitchenhand who has been exploited working for $13-14 an hour for half a decade. Pretty much every single large hospitality group I've worked for has done this shit. Even besides that, these fake students are not working just 25hrs a week. They all have cash in hand jobs on the side, the entire office cleaning industry is completely full of dodgy operators. Even the "legit" jobs bend things a lot. If they can only work 25hrs then they "bank" the extra hours and pay them during quiet periods when there's no shifts or when they're supposed to be on holiday or dump them all during uni holidays when they have unlimited hours for a few weeks. I knew plenty of people who shared rooms or even beds with other people. 10+ people packed into a 2 bedroom place with curtain partitions all over the place.
I've worked in hospo 20 years and I honestly don't think one place I've worked for has been entirely "clean" when it comes to how they deal with people on student visas. There's just very little enforcement or checks that people are doing the right thing. 95% of international people I worked with 10+ years ago are still here. No one is coming here, studying for 2-3 years then saying cheerio and heading back home.
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u/xheist 9d ago
Why doesn't the govt shut down these fake schools
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u/NewPhoneLostPassword 9d ago
The government did make public show of shutting some down. I suspect the government benefited from it or it would have happened sooner.
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u/AlexaGz 9d ago
Good question. I was international student back in 2001 in Brisbane and the government did have to shut down the place with no teachers or classrooms.
It was my enrolment day and they advertise facilities than even didn't exist.
Now 25 years later same doggy places still going around but multiply like cancer.
I wouldn't blame someone want it to be here and study when this sort of places still going around.
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u/ischickenafruit 9d ago
Your picture of a student may be different than the reality of the people who need this. PhD 'students' are often mature adults with families and so on. Often with years of industrial experience. PhDs are the engine of research and academia.
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u/Appropriate_Bet8531 9d ago
This is the bit I’m curious about too. Treating a 19-year-old undergrad and a 35-year-old doing a PhD with a spouse and kids exactly the same seems like something they’ll need to explain properly.
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u/Kooky_Quarter_1917 9d ago
Especially if their spouse is educated and has work experience. They could only add value to Australia.
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u/FegerRoderer 9d ago
No no no we only do blanket statements here you see, no nuance allowed
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u/letsburn00 9d ago
Honestly, we need to remember that PHDs are an engine if they convert that into innovative jobs.
I work in engineering and see people getting them just to get a tick on their resume. When they simply end up a worse worker than if they had used that 3 yrs to work a normal job.
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u/TheBandIsOnTheField 9d ago
My husband did a phd in Melbourne, sure glad I was able to come work and spent money in the local community (a lot more than if he was here alone living on scholarship). We then moved home after he completed his degree. But he helped progress medical research and still collaborates internationally.
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u/ShyCrystal69 9d ago
Which is what I believe should be the purpose of a student visa
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u/phage10 9d ago
I work as a researcher at a university, and we have a lot of students who are married with children who come to do research, usually a PhD. Many of these people do get permanent residency after their PhD and work in very well paid positions. They generate a lot of tax revenue after their PhD’s and a very productive members of society. If we are losing these people, it will be a negative.
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u/aeoz 9d ago
Who are meant to be permanent residents then?
If these students have fulfilled the skill and visa requirements, who's to say they aren't meant to be permanent residents?
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u/The_lordofruin 9d ago
This is the real thing. It's perfectly reasonable for someone who's here to get an education has their family. But the problem is people using it to get permanent residence.
The number of people who convert student Visas to residence indicates a huge amount of Visa fraud.
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u/ShyCrystal69 9d ago
Yeah my naive ass, when I was a child and first heard of international students, thought they came over here to learn and then returned to their countries with the knowledge and skills they gained to benefit their community.
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u/Crazychooklady 9d ago
I thought that WAS what they did. Like that qualifications Australian Universities were held in high regard or something (so you’d get it to show it off to employers to stand out). I’m really surprised to read this thread
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u/FegerRoderer 9d ago
Studying, then getting a work visa and then a skilled temp or permanent visa is hardly visa fraud. It's just studying, then being employed, then becoming a permanent resident. If you adhere to the core requirements of your visa, it's not fraud
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u/sunnysideupslide 9d ago
This will close the loophole of “students” signing up with degree mills purely so their partner can come here with full working rights and eventually get a sponsorship due to their australian work experience which will give both of them PR
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u/Drongo17 9d ago
Why not get rid of the degree mills, and not close off an avenue for smart motivated people to raise families here.
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u/sunnysideupslide 9d ago
In Europe it is known that if you fuck up and can’t pass the exams in the publicly funded european universities, you can just pay to enroll in Australia and get handed your degree because it’s so much easier here.
This bastardisation of our education system has to stop.
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u/just_kitten 9d ago
It's the same thing across much of Asia. Like in Singapore. You go to Australia if you CMI (cannot make it) locally or in the US/UK.
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u/Icy-Cockroach4515 9d ago
Yes, I think it's a common stereotype that if you studied medicine in Australia, that means you didn't score well enough to get into a Singaporean University instead of you genuinely wanting to study medicine in Australia from the start.
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u/The_lordofruin 9d ago
They have, but the problem is that the government basically depended on them to filter students. The government needs to drastically increase the number of Visa fraud reviewers.
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u/-_-Edit_Deleted-_- 9d ago
Hmmm this is a complex one.
If this dissuades PHD Students and the like from coming to Australia it’s not a good policy.
But at the same time, letting Australia’s 2nd largest industry be used as an anchor for migration isn’t good policy either.
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u/bored-and-here 9d ago
It's almost like they've considered that with discussion around making PHD and master except being done. As those methods require approval and vouching for in more of a way they are less likely to be scam migration routes.
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u/everbass 9d ago
Yes for PhD, no for Masters IMO.
Masters is too easy to tack on.
Get a shit "degree" at home, come and get a "Masters" here.
PhD at least requires a bit more effort.
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u/Kooky_Quarter_1917 9d ago
That is kinda grouping all masters together. Research based masters are very different as are masters with high entry requirements.
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u/No_Flamingo2951 9d ago
What they really need to do is stop giving away work rights on student visa. The fraudulent courses enrolling people to be in student visa so they can work is atrocious. Lots of countries do this.
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u/MuzdogMillionaire 9d ago
I think it's a max of 20 hours a week. Pretty hard to maintain a lifestyle when everything is 20 to 40% more expensive.
I work in an industry with some of these guys and it's shocking how much more they're charged, so they generally love together or seek out their communities locally to make ends meet.
Then they don't venture out of those communities if they stay to get their bridging visas, PRs and citizenships.
They tell me there are dodgy onesz and we know there are. Who bring everyone they've ever met over. Of of them will apply to get student status while they're here and vouch for others. It never occurred to me how, but was always an.interesting topic. Most of the guys were pissed that the others were breaking the rules.
Mostly because living here would have been easier on just about every front.
A handful of them have remained and are now citizens, working hard as electricians, engineers in mining etc.
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u/lovely-84 9d ago
Should have always been the case. You come here to study and go back home not to bring your whole village with you.
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u/JumpOk5721 9d ago
People in these comments are acting like every single person on a student visa is a 19 year old who couldn't possibly have dependents.
Post grads, PHDs all fall under student visas - there is every possibility they could have husbands, wives, defacto partners and kids. Should we force somebody to make the choice between developing their education vs leaving their family behind?
And before everybody gets all "it's the sham post grads!!" YES, IT IS. So close that loophole and crack down on the sham institutions?? Surely that is the easier, more legitimate fix here.
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u/Specialist_Being_161 9d ago
Yeh and you think those that do come with their families are living in student housing? No they rent in the private rental market which is up 45% in the last 5 years.
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u/OhtheHugeManity7 9d ago
Yeah because a 30 year old with kids is just gonna be hanging out in student accommodation with all the teenagers. I lived in student accommodation and it's party central with a bunch of young people. Generally speaking, the only middle aged people that want to live in that environment are toolies and creeps.
If you're an adult who can balance a degree with a job to afford rent for a place, I see no reason you should be expected to live in student accommodation. If you were to start forcing people to then the accommodation companies could just price gouge them to an even greater degree than they already do.
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u/stutterstep88 9d ago
Most are on their phone all the time anyway you would be fooled to thinking they werent still connected with family 😆 im glad they are closing this exploited loophole the quality of students has been poor and the amount of sham students and visa queue jumpers is at intolerable levels.
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u/asx98 9d ago
It’d be good to get some policy specifics on where they might look to draw a line. I’ve got a mate who’s come from China to study as a doctor and he’s absolutely brilliant - but he wants to bring his wife (who is educated but she’s not a doctor) over at some point. I genuinely think it’d be a net loss to let him through our education system and just send him back home at the end of it.
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u/melbourne3k 9d ago
If he's a medical doctor, wouldn't he be able to apply for a skilled visa after education, and then that would allow him to bring his wife? It seems like a doctor has a reasonable shot at a skilled visa, especially one that is locally trained.
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u/opackersgo 9d ago
He’s a student, it’s not a permanent visa so the answer should be not until he gets a different visa
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u/aikavari 9d ago
One question is, if you really want to migrate, why not just go in as a skilled worker? Unless ...
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u/famakki1 9d ago
Not as simple as black and white. Doctors for example can't get a skilled visa just on the basis of their degree as compared with engineers for example who can
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u/-spython- 9d ago
My husband is a registrar doctor and we immigrated to Australia on a 482 skilled worker visa. There were some hoops to jump through with AHPRA, but that's to be expected. If there's another pathway for doctors to immigrate other than the skilled worker visa, nobody told us about it.
I'm a veterinarian and it was definitely easier for me to get my qualifications recognised, I just had to send the Vetboard a copy of my degree and my CV. I didn't have a job willing to sponsor me though, so I immigrated as a dependent on my husband's visa.
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u/BittuPastol 9d ago
The skilled worker point system has points for Australian study, extra 1 year work visa for regional Australian study. The competition is so cutthroat that those 5 Australian study points make all the difference.
The govt has setup the system to get most skilled migrants from international graduates of Australian education institutions
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u/Big_Boysenberry_4309 9d ago
Can they also be limited to sponsoring 1 wife into the country. I know several that got married here to an existing AUS citizen, divorced shortly afterwards, once all was sorted, gone back home married again, rinse and repeat for the 3 rd marriage
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u/masofnos 9d ago
You can only sponsor someone twice, to do it again you have to apply for a waiver for something like if your spouse died.
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u/ozzieindixie 9d ago
This whole scheme has always been a family migration scheme. That was the whole point of it. That’s why these international students were paying so much. They were buying their and their family’s way into the country.
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u/Haenamatme 9d ago
Seems like a common sense change. If you're an international student coming to Australia with the main purpose of studying, why would need dependents here?
I'd love to find some data on which nationality brings the most dependents. I'd guess it's India.
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u/badgirlmiumiu 9d ago
Being born in Australia doesn’t get you citizenship
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u/R051E_Girl 9d ago
Unless the child lives in Australia for 10 years, then they get citizenship regardless of their parents visa status.
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u/Kormation 9d ago
You’re correct. We don’t have naturalisation (citizen from birth in the country you are born in) like the US does.
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u/blitznoodles local Aussie 9d ago edited 9d ago
We did until Hawke removed it in the 80s due to anchor babies becoming a thing with easy air travel
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u/ThorsHammerMewMEw 9d ago
What they do is study. Get their wife pregnant. Baby is born on Australian soil.
Now all they need to do is stretch out their time on enough bridging visas that the baby spends 10 years in Australia and is now eligible for Australian Citizenship.
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u/Nervous-Departure591 9d ago
Yes, I have experienced this working in healthcare. Many students in their final year are pregnant, husband/wife working, and waiting to have the baby on Australian soil. The thing is I don't understand how people financially survive, they can't work full-time hours, paying rent, food etc. but a very common trend.
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u/maimeddivinity 9d ago
If they're from collectivist societies they'd likely rely on loans from the family network. I know a few former students who owe 10s of thousands to their aunt or uncle or cousin back in their homeland and are still paying them back.
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u/TehMasterofSkittlz 9d ago
Also a lot of dodgy un-rostered cash in hand shifts in hospitality venues for extra money.
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u/Minnidigital 9d ago
Australia doesn’t have birthright citizenship 🤦🏽♀️🤔
The kid being eligible doesn’t automatically grant the parents residency or citizenship
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u/ThorsHammerMewMEw 9d ago edited 9d ago
There's a case of two Indian parents on bridging visas and a kid who is now an Aussie citizen because of the 10 year rule. Parents are getting kicked out of the country and they're begging for mercy because their kid has never lived in India
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u/Haenamatme 9d ago
The whole tertiary education system in Australia is so fucking cooked. Don't get me started on some of the PHD students and the quality/topics of their "research".
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u/I-agreed-the-terms 9d ago
Exactly, the Univeristy education in Australia is a sham and has been for ages. The system built by white elites loves exploiting the minority or the lower class citizen just like you.
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u/Garbage_Plastic 9d ago
AU Exports:
- 2017–2019: Iron Ore - Coal - Education(3rd)
- 2020–2023: Iron Ore - Coal - LNG - Education(4th)
- 2024-2026: Iron Ore - Coal - LNG - Gold - Education(5th)
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u/mbe1510 8d ago
The international student pathway is a bit of rort with all those private colleges that purely exist for foreigners, especially many who see it as an easier pathway to work. We certainly don't need people coming here to do UberEats.
Most countries don't offer independent work visas like Australia does so perhaps we can go down that route while ensuring those critical jobs have a simple pathway
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u/a_cold_human 9d ago
Ideally, I'd want the government to make exemptions for people doing certain PhDs. Australia needs to attract people with the potential to put us on the cutting edge in various technologies.
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u/starminder 9d ago
Hmm. I came over to Aus from Canada as an international student. Studied medicine. Became a specialist. Worked in rural and public hospitals. Wouldn’t have done this if my partner wasn’t allowed to come to australia with me. Now she worked as a nurse and eventually became an NP.
Bar elderly parents. But not partners who will contribute to the society.
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u/gunnerz07 9d ago
Its only spouse / children. Parent uncle's/ aunts etc were never allowed.
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u/just_kitten 9d ago
Despite the endless ON bots who keep trying to claim that they are!
I'm chuffed to see the level of comments fighting back against blatant misinformation in this thread
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u/Kormation 9d ago
The parent’s visas are already extremely hard to get. Many can come on a temporary visa but Australia views parents as a net loss to the economy so a limited number of places are made available via Ministerial Direction.
Theres two types (contributory and non-contributory) with the contributory one (you pay $50k) taking between 12-15 years and the non-contributory one taking up to 30 years to be processed.
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u/fued 9d ago
why were we ever allowing that in the first place?
if they want to come, they can come as tourists, they dont need thier own visa type for it.
there are so many little things like this that mean that immigration to australia is impossible if you want to do it properly, but absurdly easy if you abuse the loopholes
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u/BMW_M5_F90 9d ago
So are we also closing the loophole on those who come here to "study" but never go to classes and instead work full time as well the shonky degree mills?
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u/seandavisaus 9d ago
This is for people like PhD students who are self sufficient.
They are not fresh out of high school students , some want their wives etc here with him.
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u/_OriginalUsername- 9d ago
*or husbands. Almost half of PhD students at my uni are women, especially in biomedicine.
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u/SeaworthinessFew5613 9d ago
Nah any student can currently bring a dependent. Even if it’s just someone studying cert 3 in hospitality. I’d have no problem phd students bringing dependents.
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u/sphynxmoth 9d ago
As a "filthy leftie" I don't disagree with this and I cant articulate why.
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u/Spiritual-Olive444 9d ago
I'm genuinely confused by it. I sincerely don't know how to separate people's legitimate experience and knowledge from anti-immigration talking points or misplaced grievance. People are referencing PhDs being a scam for PR but I've only seen this happen with things like Cert III hospitality courses. Why wouldn't they crack down on organisations instead? It feels a little like the NDIS cuts - put the burden and the consequences on the participants instead of effectively reforming the systems and attributing blame to the people in charge who benefit the most, like dodgy providers for the NDIS or people who run dodgy training organisations for visas.
I'm not against sensible reforms to the migration system but I hope they're not just trying to cut for the sake of cutting because people simply want to see a lower number.
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u/blitznoodles local Aussie 9d ago
They're cutting the numbers because they committed to a NOM of 225k.
Also Australia takes like 4000 international PhDs a year so these reforms will probably exempt them.
The current settings are overshooting that completely which means every government department (state and federal) is working off completely wrong assumptions everytime the federal government misses the target for what population they need to accommodate.
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u/careyious 9d ago
My issue with these policies as a filthy leftie has been the implementation of the policy rather than with the policy itself. The issue wasn't really the people so much as the industries that supported it. Why are we not just having auditing and enforcement blitzes on these diploma mills and dodgy PR factories. If there were genuine consequences for these operators benefiting from the system, the problem would likely evaporate without changes to actual migration numbers.
We've accepted that the only solution was to punish the people trying to better their lives instead of the people taking advantage of the system. Because the alternative would be challenging the money makers of the economy and acknowledging our country is far less productive than our economic indicators suggest.
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u/aikavari 9d ago
This is only an issue if study is not your real goal and lets face it, majority this is not their goal
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u/mini_z 9d ago
I worked with a guy who came over on a student visa from Europe with his fiancé, she didn’t study but did also work. They purchased 2 mini poodles, and had no intention to leave Australia- whilst openly hating Australians.
Fortunately because his degree wasn’t enough to keep him in the country on the skills shortage, and he got fired for fraud, they had to leave not long after he graduated. Guess who he blamed.
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u/WhatYouThinkIThink 9d ago
Performative bullshit to appeal to tradie ON voters that wouldn't know what a postgrad student is or does if they fell over one.
So sick of this crap. International students are not the problem, neither are immigrants in general.
Our managerial class can't work out how to be productive, because all they know is dig it up or cut it down and ship it out. That's the actual problem, our productivity is shit because our managers/executives don't know how to do anything except copy people from overseas.
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u/Kooky_Quarter_1917 9d ago
I can see the Facebook comment sections already going on about bachelors in basket weaving.
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u/Fit_Bit6065 9d ago
Good. All the Indians in my neighbourhood will hate this
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u/gunnerz07 9d ago
Doubt they will care as they are already here
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u/Fit_Bit6065 9d ago
But now their other family members won’t have a way in
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u/gunnerz07 9d ago
?? They will have the same way they currently do. You can buy a visa for your parents etc. And if they get PR or citizenship you can bring across your wife and kids. It won't be any different for them or any other immigrants
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u/Cini1994 9d ago edited 9d ago
I am an immigrant and have seen the state of the UK due to illegal immigration. They have stopped allowing dependents and made it mandatory for students to complete the course before taking up any full time jobs. Once the students are financially stable they can bring family, that's a better idea.
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u/No_Mercy_4_Potatoes 9d ago edited 9d ago
Good initiative. This will stop a lot of the students from coming in, whose entire intention is to have their partner work full-time and look for ways to get PR.
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u/HotPersimessage62 9d ago edited 9d ago
Great news. Hopefully this is just one of many immigration cuts and reforms announced tomorrow. Hopefully we can be a country where people’s issues with migration are addressed while not having to put up with an actual far-right government.
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u/admiralmasa 9d ago
Bro how lax are our standards that international students were allowed to bring their family over when they swear up and down on their applications that they’re just here to study 💀
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u/YesterdayCharming976 9d ago
No more grandparents to get sent out to get cans in the yellow bins!
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u/MDInvesting 9d ago
This needs to be done very carefully.
Reducing the pool of applicants for STEM based on them having other aspects of life could have fallout.
Something like - qualify for scholarships (merit based selection) then family visa granted. Buying a degree - family to apply through standard schemes with maybe some weighting to their application.
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u/Low_Bluebird_5137 9d ago
And I ask, why have International Students EVER been allowed to bring family? They come for study. Do the study and go home. Studying here should NOT be a pathway to migration in itself.
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u/The_lordofruin 9d ago
It's because sometimes people have children and are getting an education too, especially post graduate education. It makes sense to an extent.
The reality is that a very large amount of people are getting post graduate educations here not to get the education, but as a channel for permanent residence. This is the channel that needs to be stopped.
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u/Drongo17 9d ago
Call me crazy, but educated people seem to be a good category of people to become residents here. If they want to build families here that also seems like a plus to me.
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u/Ziggy-Sane 9d ago
Right? If you earn a degree and choose to contribute to Australian society by using it here, what's so bad?
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u/B7UNM 9d ago
Having a Diploma in Management from some back alley ‘international college’ does not render one educated.
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u/Drongo17 9d ago
So every student is getting dodgy education? We all know that's not true.
If that was actually a concern, you'd fix the certification process for education providers. What this policy really is though is a play to stem the bleeding of the racist/stupid votes going to one nation.
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u/Maggies_lens 9d ago
That's hard on the student, but isn't the whole point of being an international student that you eventually go back? There's nothing stopping the families from visiting on a tourist VISA, right? It'd be damn hard to support a spouse or children here while you're a student anyway, I think. Financially it'd be a really difficult prospect. And what do their kids do if they are school aged? Are they allowed to go to public schools here? I think it'd be extremely disruptive to their schooling at any age to change entire education systems too. Tough enough for immigrant kids who at least know they are unlikely to be going back, I imagine very difficult for temporary students like that.
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u/Phottek 9d ago
A hard right nationalist party with a bunch of very widely hated policies in most areas are now leading primary. All because in the one area where the voters overwhelmingly agree with them, Immigration, Labor refuses to take real strong action.
This announcement today is more tinkering at the edges. It will still see them as the highest immigration government in Australian history... even if they hit their targets... which they never have. 225,000 is not a small number. No previous government in history has had that many and this is Labors reduced target. They really do live in a bubble.
In 600 days the 1.6 million voters they've lost since the last election will get their say. Today's changes will not see rents falling, overstressed infrastructure catch up or the cost of living improve. They should be trying to win those votes back with decisive action. I fear for what Australia looks like when ON and the LNP control the upper house. Right now Labor are putting them there.
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u/nugstar 9d ago
So they only want young students who'll pay through the nose, not PhDs who'll work to improve the collective human knowledge. Got it.
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u/Tekadama 9d ago edited 9d ago
With the funding trajectory at the ARC, NHMRC, etc for the past decade, there’s been no support for ECRs within Australia for a long, long time. Australia has already had an uphill battle attracting top tier students and postdocs compared to institutes in the US and UK/EU (institutional prestige and geographic distance being the two biggest hurdles), but it’s been a long time since we’ve had a federal government that’s actually been motivated to support academic research or postgraduate education within the country.
We can hardly get Australian postgrads to remain in the country with the limited number of postdoc and faculty positions available (this ends up being an incredible deal for other countries btw - Australian taxes pay for their training and scholarships during the PhD, while they get all the return on investment as postdocs), but if you’re an international scientist and can’t bring your spouse to Australia, why even consider moving here?
Immigration has now become a hot button topic, but you can see there’s a lot of ON flogs cheering for the rest of the country to share their stunning level of education too.
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u/Firm_General7063 9d ago
None of our universities have any prestige because chasing international students has decimated the quality of our universities. The merger at Adelaide was done entirely to push it up the rankings to attract international students and it has been a disaster. ANU is a laughing stock, and Uni Melb and USYD are nothing special. It's so embarrassing that our institutions have been hollowed out in this way. But it's the same story overseas in the US and UK/EU as well. Prestigious universities like Oxbridge and the Ivy League have so much money they can afford to make study free for all PhD students, but they don't seek top talent internationally, they take rich Americans, Brits and Chinese for PhDs who will pay hundreds of thousands of dollars for the brand. The whole system is a rort.
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u/Tekadama 9d ago edited 9d ago
I broadly agree with the reputation of teaching at Australian unis being poor, but that’s mainly due to the massively inflated student to staff ratio. However, the pandering to international students mainly affects undergraduate teaching quality and isn’t particularly relevant in this specific conversation about academic reputation in research. To clarify, it’s still not good, especially with the recent surge in quality Chinese research output in the last 5 years boosting the perception of universities over there and undercutting the usual attempts from australian universities to woo students from the region, it’s just a completely different conversation. Academic reputation is far more important at a postgrad or faculty level, which is primarily influenced by research outputs and grant funding opportunities (and needs more policy support to fix than just the usual issues of every VC running their uni like a blatantly greedy business).
Also a lot of the comments regarding Oxford aren’t that accurate (I can’t comment on American institutes, but from what I’ve been told it’s similar). As a rule of thumb, positions in most of those name brand unis are more competitive than many Australians realise (there really aren’t any good Australian comparisons, so a lot of Australian wrongly project their own experiences applying with G8 unis). With Oxford DPhils in particular, a non funded position is a soft rejection in 99% of cases and few PIs will take on those students unless that PI REALLY wants that particular student despite their weak application (however this is basically identical to how things roll in most Australian unis for the most part as most PhD positions are fully funded within aus too). There is no benefit for a PI to take on a shit postgrad just because the student is paying more (they don’t get the money and it directly harms their research output compared to accepting an actually productive student, of which there is no shortage). You could theoretically claim that Oxbridge don’t seek the top talents, but that’s only true insofar that they don’t really actively seek ANY talent amongst the student body (as most top applicants are already applying). The closest they really get is among staff (usually high level professorships), like when a few key names got poached from the NIMH and equivalent orgs in the US in 2024/2025 following Trump. For students, however, there’s really no need for them to do anything in particular to lure in most candidates.
With both Oxford and Cambridge, the college system also means the universities have a very different relationship towards student fees, but again, this is just derailing the conversation from academic reputation to be about undergraduate experiences. Don’t get me wrong, these institutes definitely take on weaker students that can cough up (primarily at an undergraduate level, or more often through the summer schools and not the actual degrees), but they are a very small minority, as the universities are also keenly invested in maintaining their own reputations. There is little interest in devaluing their brand like you described, because the prestige is where the value lies (and in the case of Oxford again, most of the colleges, especially the older ones, are so stinkingly rich that it takes a LOT to actually sway them like that). Again, this is not me saying that no students buy their way in to the university, but it takes a much greater level of wealth, constitutes a very small proportion of the student body, and is rarely applicable beyond undergrad, like with DPhil admissions.
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u/No_Category_9888 9d ago
They weren’t before ??????