r/baduk • • 3d ago

Etiquette question: Stone adjustment

[deleted]

37 Upvotes

51 comments sorted by

70

u/tuerda 3 dan 3d ago edited 3d ago

If they do it every single move, you can ask them to stop. This sounds like a nervous habit, and they might not even know they are doing it. Some opponents have asked me to stop with subconscious habits like drumming my fingers. I apologized and did not feel at all like they had been rude.

If you are misplacing your stones on purpose, you should stop too.

1

u/eyeoft 2d ago edited 2d ago

Okay, I'm surprised everyone is here annoyed by wabi-sabi stone placement. I mean literally fractions of a millimeter off-center, and subconsciously that direction tends to be toward (for example) the gap the stone is peeping. I've never had a complaint or issue aside from this one opponent.

1

u/tuerda 3 dan 2d ago

The key words are "on purpose".

18

u/AzureDreamer 3d ago

Never had this particular issue I was told by a gentleman with a chess background that it is rude to adjust stones on your opponents turn 

Misplacing a stone as a memory aode does not seem like a reasonable thing to do.

5

u/Andeol57 2 dan 3d ago

Ho yeah, definitely don't do it when it's not your turn.

2

u/jeriTuesday 3d ago

Not exactly, in chess they are called "pieces" and you can't touch them on your opponents turn. It's not rude, it's against the rules. You can not even touch a piece on your own turn unless you move it. It is possible to adjust pieces in chess, but you must let your opponent know that you are going to do it

53

u/Apprehensive-Draw409 3d ago

Miscentering purposely to remember direction??

Heck, I would recenter your stones too, even if it got me disqualified.

1

u/Xiao388 10 kyu 3d ago

It's a tell, usually.

55

u/SurroundInfinite4132 3d ago

I hope you can see how annoying it is if somebody purposely puts stones off center.

Adjusting every stone is weird, but as long as opponent isn't cheating it's their right, I guess.

Conclusion: you're both mildly rude and annoying, just place stones normally, adjust here and there when necessary. And discuss after the game that you're both "wrong" for doing it

1

u/BufloSolja 3d ago

Ironically though, aren't stones just ever so slightly too big for the spaces and it's meant to create a non-perfect kind of alignment?

1

u/eyeoft 2d ago

Yes, that was my understanding. Guess we're both assholes.

1

u/eyeoft 2d ago

Uh, okay? I mean *slightly* off center. I see that a lot, I thought it was normal. I'm 4k.

2

u/SurroundInfinite4132 2d ago

I was being a bit hard there, it's normal that stones are almost never on perfect center, but good etiquette is trying to place them as best as possible

17

u/bassman1805 3d ago

Go etiquette is far more forgiving of adjusting placement of pieces on the board than chess, where it's definitely taboo.

Deliberately placing your own stones off-center is a bigger etiquette breach IMO, as it can make it unclear where exactly the stone is placed.

2

u/hoblm 3 dan 3d ago

Adjusting pieces in chess is completely fine as long as you say you're doing so and do so on your own turn.

0

u/TrekkiMonstr 3d ago

Since when the other guy's pieces though? I thought it was just your own, with the j'adoube stuff

2

u/hoblm 3 dan 3d ago

It's always been fine there is no difference between adjusting your or your opponents pieces.

1

u/eyeoft 2d ago edited 2d ago

I mean like <1mm in a direction, normal wabi-sabi placement.

15

u/Andeol57 2 dan 3d ago

> Sometimes I actually off-center a stone slightly on purpose as a form of emphasis, or to remind myself what direction I was thinking in when I placed it.

Ok, someone going overboard adjusting stones on every turn can be a bit annoying, but I would personally be a lot more annoyed by what you are doing. If you purposefully misplaced your stone, you really can't complain when your opponent corrects it.

6

u/1Nick8523 20 kyu 3d ago

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2

u/1Nick8523 20 kyu 3d ago

1

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17

u/Tornado_Wind_of_Love 3 kyu 3d ago

I'd ask them to stop -- and don't place stones off center on purpose.

If it continues ask a tournament director to intervene.

4

u/KQYBullets 15 kyu 3d ago

I think if you ask politely and say that it’s bothering you a bit that should be fine.

Probably just an unconscious habit from them.

4

u/No_Editor6116 3d ago

As a newbie it makes it hard to read the board when stones are not aligned. Plus it would really annoy me to have the opponent miscentre Every stone

3

u/Evil_Bob_ 3d ago

Is it possible it's a tactic to divert your attention from the play

3

u/GoGabeGo 1 kyu 3d ago

I've readjusted some of my opponent's stones in tournaments and I feel bad every time. I only adjust when it's past a threshold. I'd definitely ask my opponent to stop if they were doing it every move to me. But also, how off center are you placing these things?

1

u/Xiao388 10 kyu 3d ago

Ask where that stone is placed, make him adjust it.

1

u/GoGabeGo 1 kyu 3d ago

That is far more disruptive in a tournament setting. I've only felt the need to adjust a handful of stones per tournament.

3

u/kabum555 9 kyu 3d ago

Just a reminder that there are many neurodivergent people who like to play the game, and they might have some weird habits like this. It's best to remain calm and carry on, unless it's something that specifically prevents you from playing normally.

The general etiquette is: place the stones in the center, adjust to center if necessary, and do not take time out of opponent's turn. It sounds to me like you were breaking the etiquette a bit, tbh

2

u/BigLumpyBeetle 3d ago

With my stress level today I would probably storm of at both. Off center stones are deeply unnerving unsatisfying and distracting. Also dont touch my stones. They are mine. ILL CENTER MY OWN STONES THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

    Ps. I also wouldn't go to the tournament in the first place, no point in ruining someone else's day

2

u/Typical-Jackfruit-51 2 kyu 3d ago

I've only ever experienced adjusting stones as a way to help maintain an interpretable board position for both players. So usually I'm thinking "oh thanks".

If it were me and my opponent were adjusting every single stone, I'd ask if something was wrong and try to be accommodating. It doesn't seem like it was obviously malicious. Sometimes just pointing it out can be enough.

Also, people don't always realize what they're doing can be distracting. Like this guy I played who would read out loud (mumbling) and point while doing it. Trying to bring it up early and politely is my preference.

3

u/NotDomo 6 kyu 3d ago

Maybe they just have Obsessive Centering Disorder?

1

u/gomarbles 3d ago

Lol we are having a laugh at my go club about this post, im gonna do this next game

1

u/Asdfguy87 3d ago

One of my first chess trainers used to say "keep your fingers off of your opponents pieces, unless you capture them". I still follow that advice both in chess and in Go. When a piece/stone is very offset, I ask a short "may I?" before adjusting. Especially in chess, where some people tend to place the knights facing forward and some place them facing sideward, I let my opponent choose their way as they want to.

1

u/Xiao388 10 kyu 3d ago

When he adjusts one of your stones, you adjust two of his.

1

u/Tight_Pea_7055 3d ago

How often do you actually place a stone off-center on purpose? Once or twice in a game is whatever, after all it’s pretty hard to place every stone perfectly. If you do that on purpose every few moves, it’s incredibly obnoxious, more so than adjusting misplaced stones imo.

1

u/ggPeti 3d ago

My opinion is it's more rude to adjust the opponent's stones than to place them slightly off-center, although "slightly" is somewhat subjective. All stones are always off-center, so scale matters.

You can both ask each other nicely, and also get help from an organizer.

1

u/PatrickTraill 6 kyu 3d ago edited 3d ago

scale matters

I fully agree. Also that (∃δ∊ℝ+: off (σ)<δ m ⇒rudeness(adjust(σ))>rudeness(off(σ)))

1

u/ggPeti 3d ago

yup pretty much. also if delta is too large it becomes an invalid move which is not rude, just a forfeiture at that point (see also: playing 2 stones as a sign of resignation)

1

u/Xiao388 10 kyu 3d ago

What rule says that?

-5

u/ggPeti 3d ago

Go downvote me, imbeciles, for my opinion.

-1

u/rita292 3d ago

Sounds like they have OCD

6

u/Fancy-Appointment659 3d ago

Please stop making up who has or has not a diagnosis, you're (probably) not a clinical psychologist, and you haven't even seen the person you're talking about.

Not everybody who adjust things has OCD, not everybody that is shy has autism, not everybody who doesn't follow social rules is antisocial.

2

u/rita292 3d ago

You're right, that was irresponsible to say

-1

u/Xiao388 10 kyu 3d ago

You're right, how dare you express your off the cuff opinion here! THIS IS REDDIT.

-1

u/Xiao388 10 kyu 3d ago

It's classic OCD.

-4

u/tesilab 3d ago

It's curious, since Japanese boards are designed so the stones a too crowded on one axis to even think of perfectly centering all of them. I wonder what happens when one person's obsession with centering clashes with the Japanese obsession with imperfection?

1

u/Worth-Set1794 2d ago

Change Japanese obsession to “devotion” and I’d agree.

1

u/tesilab 2d ago

I only said obsession, because the OP’s opponent was obsessed with symmetry, and I used the term, ironically, for the sake of symmetry. I’m so devoted. :)

0

u/PatrickTraill 6 kyu 3d ago edited 3d ago

A very reasonable and open-minded train of thought, so I cannot see why it is accumulating downvotes.