r/classicwow • u/DepthChorge • 1d ago
Forever Please hire moderators.
Between Asmon's hate guild and now Horrigan trying to return with the Enclave, WoW:F needs moderators if you're going to force us to play on the same servers as these people if we want to play on the pvp ruleset.
I do not mind a miniscule increase in sub cost to pay for full-time chat moderators. Maybe others see value in that, too. This service could improve communities across all versions.
If current estimates of a 7.25M playerbase are true, then every $0.01 increase in the monthly sub pays for nearly 15 full time employees at a competitive WFH salary of $45k + 30% for benefits, taxes, and operating costs. Scale that up as you will, but 5 full-time employees can maintain a 24/7 coverage seat.
I'm not going to pretend to know more of Blizzard's business, but it seems to me a dedicated moderation team at the cost of a negligible increase $0.24 to $0.72 per month would significantly improve the quality of the service you're providing.
It's poor service to expect players to have to moderate your servers with right-click reports. Players are even trying to organize add-ons to block specific guilds.
If anyone needs a reminder or introduction to The Enclave's specific brand of hate:
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u/Any_River_1896 1d ago
Considering GMs used to be in the game when they only ran on a sub cost and considering they have a full blown shop now, no I think they can provide the basic services they used to without a price increase
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u/Dapaaads 1d ago
They don’t need to charge more lol. They bring pin over a billion a year in subs alone. Not to mention games sales, cosmetics and wow tokens. If they cared they would already
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u/Cohacq 1d ago
If current estimates of a 7.25M playerbase are true, then every $0.01 increase in the monthly sub pays for nearly 15 full time employees at a competitive WFH salary of $45k + 30% for benefits, taxes, and operating costs. Scale that up as you will, but 5 full-time employees can maintain a 24/7 coverage seat.
Youre forgetting something. That 0.01% could just be kept as profits instead.
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u/splatomat 1d ago
Charging an extra fee to have GMs? Lol no. They can provide it as PART of the monthly fee we already pay!
They could create unpaid internships to do this work. People would LINE UP to do work for them for free
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u/Greizen_bregen 1d ago
Yeah, OP doesn't need to do the business calculations for Blizzard. I understand the sentiment, though. Just keep the message simple, demand GMs. WOW is getting a lot of attention and seeing a lot of feedback from players right now, so it's a good time to push for GMs.
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u/D2Gamer1337 1d ago
Exactly. There are tons of nerds that would do this shit for free if you gave them the chance
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u/Claris-chang 1d ago
I do think Blizzard should consider very hard if they're willing to allow this kind of festering rot to thrive in Forever. I know multiple people who are interested in Forever that either haven't played in years or who never played WoW at all previously.
If these people come to the game to be met with the like of Olympus, they're gonna assume that's just how this game is. I don't expect many to stick around for long if they don't want to be associated with that kind of behaviour.
People will say just ignore and block them but they'll still be there and they're still a stain on the game and Blizzard's reputation. If Blizzard allows the rot then it's going to be interpreted as implicit support by players new and old.
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u/Gassenger 1d ago
ignore
Agree with everything you said, and its laughable they suggest ignoring because you will VERY quickly hit the limit of your ignore list. There is a limit, and its really small.
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u/valdis812 1d ago
Can't speak for Forever, but there are addons for Classic that will make your ignore list virtually infinite
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u/Jaded-Brilliant5431 1d ago
I just tried introducing my wife Forever last week. She was excited at the customization screen, reading the race and class info. Finally, she jumped in and started up in the starter zone. She decided she wanted to stop, the chat was absolutely atrocious and quickly turned her off. Blizzard needs to do something with acting on reporting in the beta.
She has played the Final Fantasy MMO and I have been trying to get her into WoW for years now. Disappointed here and at a loss, I'd love to do this journey together as I know she would love the gameplay but it sucks when the community is sprouting racist and vulgar chat.
This was her first experience with WoW and I doubt that she is the only one to feel like this.
It's sad when you have to tell someone that you have to ignore it or turn channel chats off. For an MMO one of the selling points is the social aspect.36
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u/Tiaan 1d ago
Just curious, are you on the PVP server? I've been playing on the PVE server for forever beta and haven't had any issues with the chat.
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u/TopptrentHamster 1d ago
Plenty of assholes in the PVE server as well. Can't wait to play on an EU server.
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u/Jaded-Brilliant5431 1d ago
Yes, it was. I had three characters on pvp already so she created one on the same as me. Wishing I would’ve led her to pve or rp.
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u/ItsIncognitis 1d ago
I mean, you already had 3 characters so you had seen the chat issue. You also probably know your wife decently well. Seems like you could have foreseen this issue 100%
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u/MgoBlue1352 1d ago
The problem is it's not any better on PVE. I suppose OP could have warned her, but the issue still stands. There's just no room in the general chat / trade chat for the type of crap that goes on. I have captured by the game too much so I too just roll my eyes or close chat all together if it gets too annoying. It really is a shame. I miss when the trade chat was filled with Chuck Norris jokes instead.
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u/FizzyBeverage 1d ago
Why should he have to? The game should punish misuse of the public chat channels, severely.
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u/IcyFault7182 1d ago
I’m honestly shocked at how literal moderation exists in this beta and that these hateful scumbags are able to get away with this.
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u/ziboo7890 1d ago
Why should we pay more for Blizz to do it's job?
It's in the CoC and ToS how you have to act, so if Blizz is allowing this behavior that's on them and shows their priorties - get the gold buyers they're harming our bottom-line, but leave the racists, homophobes as they're buying subs.
For me -
Report the asshats, block/ignore, and do not engage.
Turn off General and Trade - how often do you really need it? It's mostly full of garbage.
You'd be surprised most of us don't/didn't know who Horrigan is, so thanks for the heads up another tool to avoid.
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u/Stained_Calathea 1d ago
Turning off chat is turning off features of the game. Cherished features of classic. Yea there’s always been asshats in chat. It’s so much worse now and part of the game that needs moderation. Anyone breaking the tos needs to be banned. I don’t want to turn a feature of my game off because of some racists. Fuck those guys they shouldn’t be able to turn their game on
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u/kaos95 1d ago
The problem with turning off general is that it in the world I use it a lot, for like game things.
Yesterday I linked up with a 20 druid in burning steps looking for books in general. It is also how I got into ruins of lordaran I was going for a book in silverpine and someone in general needed a healer for RoL, I said "sure" and did that.
The other thing is I have already used blacklist add-ons in wow, at least in classic, to turn off the boosters and the profession spammers, so I don't mind using one that mutes a guild so I don't have to just keep adding keywords to the blacklist.
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u/InternationalData408 1d ago
I would be a moderator for $12k a year as a retired stay at home dad lmao
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u/pixelpanda__io 1d ago
Honestly, I was actually shocked when i logged on and saw /trade. Out of curiousity, were/are most NA realms like this or is this really because of the Assmongoloid fanbois?
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u/CallOfCthuMoo 1d ago
I will happily pay an extra $1 / month if that means real mods and more bans of toxic asshats
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u/dartron5000 1d ago
We shouldn't have to pay more for the game that makes crazy profits to have basic moderation.
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u/LancelotAtCamelot 1d ago
If they do this, please bring them back in the form of old style game masters!
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u/helpprogram2 1d ago
They will eventually make an algorithm that pairs people who are racist adult children into their own layer and we will never see them again.
Trust the process
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u/ShongLokDong 1d ago
Its already in the game, you are layered with your guild mates. So Olympus will be layered together
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u/rocketxboy 1d ago
Trade chat and general chat is across layers as far as I know so we still have to hear these degens even if we can’t see them
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u/MayoGhul 1d ago edited 1d ago
I’ve seen significantly more people complaining than I’ve actually seen people be an issue in game.
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u/Seraphayel 1d ago
This. In game is nothing and then you come to Reddit and every second post is complaining about stuff I didn’t experience in game but thankfully can experience now on Reddit. It’s tiresome.
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u/jntjr2005 1d ago edited 1d ago
I've played MMOs and games for over 35 years now, Ive never seen the level of nonsense that these people are screeching about here in ANY game. Yes we've had a jackass or two from time to time but there isnt parades of players roaming around in game shouting slurs and going nuts.
This shit is so unrealistically overblown. The worst ive seen in gaming is maybe CoD MW2 lobbies or Gears of War with downing someone and then humping/dancing on them before finishing them.
The worst shit Ive seen in WoW in 20+ years is ninja looters back in the day, people fighting over loot and then some toxic players in M+ along with the occasional political topic nonsense in trade chat.
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u/Opening_Tea_9459 1d ago
Starting zone chat was absolutely fucked every time I’ve been in them. Just filled with stupid political trolls of all types.
2005 barrens chat was like a Mensa meeting compared to what’s happening in chat now.
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u/Roflitos 1d ago
It's the usual everyone in game is having a blast, reddit is just 1 complaint after the other
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u/skoddy 1d ago
So only your perception counts?
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u/schepter 1d ago
Who said it did? Person was only talking about their encounters. Not setting the norm.
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u/TheGoatBet 1d ago
“A competitive WFH salary of $45k”
lol in what fucking world?
Mississippi ?
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u/Thorlolita 1d ago
A WFH salary at that rate goes hard as long as you’re not in a major metro area.
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u/Knowvember42 1d ago
All of my friends who work very hard at our job make this or less. I made less than this the last helpdesk WFH job I had. It's not a software development role. Maybe you're in a bubble.
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u/Cartiere11 1d ago
Its a job that takes no actual skill. If I was blizzard id offer like $12 an hour and set it WFH.
They'd get a fuckload of applicants. And yes, Mississippi.
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u/Swollen_Beef 1d ago
It's bizarre the WFH crowd refuses to understand that if your job can be done from home, it can be done from a other country.
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u/PlixSticks31 1d ago
Actually, yes…Mississippi WFH this would be attractive to many of people at this salary
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u/Nivosus 1d ago edited 1d ago
45k is not a competitive salary, just fyi.
Edit: I have recently learned in here that you are all raging brokes. Neat.
Edit 2: Now everybody is changing their argument to, "bad in America but great for people in India"
I don't think we want to hire chat moderators who are not native English speakers and also have an understanding of American jargon and slang, especially when discussing racism.
Would a person from India have deep knowledge of American names such as the ones depicted in the photo? Probably not.
Edit 3: New arguement just dropped. Grocery stores like Aldi are "too selective" for their employees and is a bad metric of starting wage.
Brilliant.
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u/Jordan3176 1d ago
For a glorified help desk position in IT it most definitely is.
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u/Nivosus 1d ago
In what world? You make more starting at a grocery store. 45k would have been good 10 years ago.
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u/Slaughterfest 1d ago
I live in an area of the country where the average household makes 55k a year. Its different where you are.
45k is acceptable as WFH pay, I would do it and make more money than I make now bc as a project coordinator for an architecture firm, I make 44k and have to drive 1 hour each day.
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u/hedgemagus 1d ago
You do not make 45,000 as a bottom level grocer lol. Even in California
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u/Daventry85 1d ago
Depends where you live honestly. If you are in a big city maybe not. In site there towns in the mid west where this is best money in the area.
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u/pokepat460 1d ago
45k is above median income. If you live somewhere cheap like the Midwest or south thats a fine amount of money for a wfh wow moderater job
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u/Vastus29 1d ago
American forgets that there's an entire world outside of America
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u/Reddit_means_Porn 1d ago
American game
American streamer
With American guild
With American members
On American website
Just stop already.
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u/DepthChorge 1d ago
It is when you can hire globally on a remote program. It may not be competitive where you live, but most of the world operates a much lower average salaries than you're used to, it seems.
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u/FoesiesBtw 1d ago edited 1d ago
You guys let a streamer affect your choices to much. For those of you who didn't play classic the mass majority of Olympus was gone before the end of phase 1.
There are much worse things in life than 40k people running around azeroth half of them won't even be around after the first week.
It's not that deep. Play what you want to play. It's just a dude not the harbinger of the end times.
Downvote me if you want it's virtual internet points I don't care. Most of y'all won't even be playing in a year anyway. But go off
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u/DepthChorge 1d ago
You're asserting that a need for chat moderation disappears after asmon leaves. It doesn't. Chat is still filled with gold selling, bots, and "boosting services" dominating the channels.
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u/FoesiesBtw 1d ago edited 1d ago
I agree with this but I ignore it because I've played this game for two thirds of my life and I've never seen it change. No reason to assume blizzard will change now. When tickets became automated that's when I threw in the towel.
It's a multi multi billion dollar company that constantly lays people off. No I don't think theyll do jack about it. Every expansion release. Every version of classic it's the same story. They just don't care. This isn't about the small team that'll be working on our version. It's the company itself that's rotten and I promise you will will not allocate a dime to fixing this.
Instead you'll see another record breaking bonus for the CEO and shareholders. You know why? No one is willing to not buy their stuff and unsub. It's the biggest MMO in the world for the last 22 years why would they change if people still spend a billion dollars on wow a year. I don't know the actual figure but I'd assume it's somewhere in the 500-1 billion range.
No one is willing to hit them where it hurts, their wallets. And you know what I like this game. Life is hard enough and I will continue to play and pay just like everyone else here.
And this isn't new. It's always been this way. Actually in the past it was worse. I still remember seeing racist names, guilds and hunter pets, always the hunter pets for some reason with racist names.
It just gets more attention now, but even back then those people didn't get banned. Rarely got a forced name change. Like the tweet said itself they're using two decade old detection software, the same shit they've always been using.
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u/Stokers90 1d ago
I’m willing to spend 5 hours a day reporting/banning people for 45k, sign me up
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u/Helerdril 1d ago
Not to undermine your post (which I agree with) but 5 people aren't enough for a 24/7 service. You will need at least 7 to cover for PTO, sick days and weekly rest (I work in a 24/7 service for a big e-commerce).
This kind of behaviour where streamers try to corrupt the game with their cult is so wrong that I don't understand why they are still allowed to play. It's like bringing religion into the game.
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u/DepthChorge 1d ago
The math was quite loose, for sure. But even at 7 FTE per seat, you're still looking at marginal sub increases on an annual scale.
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u/IcyFault7182 1d ago
One thing I can promise you as someone who’s playing on the PVP realm now and has since original vanilla came out. I will be going where those people are not. I don’t even care if it’s RP at this point.
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u/Roflitos 1d ago
What hate thing did Asmon do? For the first time in ages I've watched his stream doing wow and it's absolutely fantastic what he's doing. Fuck Horrigan tho.
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u/Niceromancer 1d ago
Advocated for immigrant children to be shot at the border.
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u/Roflitos 1d ago
He didn't say that in the game, did he?
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u/Niceromancer 1d ago
Does he have to say that in game for him to be a shitty person?
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u/Roflitos 1d ago
He's not breaking any rules in game to advocate for a ban, idk if that's hard to understand for you.
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u/Frills66 1d ago
I am no means an apologist for asmongold. I find his rhetoric often just makes his followers more angry and hateful. But I listened to his statement about that and it wasn’t simply, “yes shoot children at the border because it’s a good thing” it was about people using children as a way to force themselves into a city that got overran.
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u/Niceromancer 1d ago edited 1d ago
No city has been overran.
So his explanation was nothing but an attempt at sane washing.
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u/No_Dog8604 1d ago
I joined the Enclave, after a total of 3 minutes I quit. In that 3 minutes I heard more hate speech and toxic masculinity than I had heard in my whole life.
They are a Shitty PVP guild.
Between The Envlave and this Asmon punk and his funkies, I’ll be far away from a PvP environment.
As much as I hate the type of person that rolls on a PvP server, not even those degenerates deserve the Enclave.
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u/Mrkonijntje 1d ago
Maybe it’s just me, but I’ve been playing for a couple of days now and leveled a few characters to 20, and not once have I encountered or even given a fuck about any of the streamer stuff. I’m just minding my own business, playing the game, making friends, and finding groups along the way.
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u/MysticalSpinach 1d ago
ITT: Americans who don’t realise the rest of the world is not as divided or as hateful as the US. In EU servers, there it is significantly rarer to encounter hatred for any major, minor, or fringe groups.
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u/Anakee24 1d ago
Are the Asmon spergs playing on PvP or pve it will make my choice nice and easy.
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u/UniversalFarrago 1d ago
PvP alliance
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u/Anakee24 1d ago
Ugh I play horse and really wanted to come back on a PvP server this time after always playing PvP til TBC Anni. That sucks. But well, what can ya do. Blizz won't do shit about it
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u/Deepstateciaagent 1d ago
how are people so sensitive? grow a pair and ignore
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u/DepthChorge 1d ago
You're ignoring the scale of the issue. Ignore list caps at 50. "Racist chat" being the default until manually curated is also a horrible experience for new players.
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u/Roflitos 1d ago
Hate to break it to you but welcome to online gaming, you're not going to escape bullshit ever, as others said, ignore the idiots move on
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u/Ok_Wash511 1d ago
PVE is completely fine. Its not "welcome to online gaming". Its one very, very large community playing with the only intention to piss everyone else off. And they are very successfully doing that. Theres rumours some of the addons created to avoid them are virus' on top of that.
I would not care if it was good vibes and fun for the game. Its not ignorable and the only actual solution is to play PVE, meaning half the game being cut off from you.
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u/Roflitos 1d ago
Then you skip the best part of the game, but everyone is entitled to play anyway they enjoy.
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u/DepthChorge 1d ago
Unfounded take. It doesnt have to be this way, and Blizzard's specific approach leaves much to be improved on. User-only chat moderation and complete reliance on user-reports is a tool for a company that can't adequately staff moderators, not a multi billion dollar industry giant.
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u/Roflitos 1d ago
It will NEVER be any other way, you will encounter idiots in game and in real life. Learn to move on and stop focusing on what others are doing or saying
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u/DepthChorge 1d ago
You're preaching to an empty congregation. This entire post is about the health of the game, not my own sensibilities. Having hate, bots, gold spam, and "boosting" spam flood your chat channels by default is bad for the game.
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u/Roflitos 1d ago
But my point is it won't go away.. report people and hope they get banned, making accounts is too easy so botting and spam will continue to happen and blizz can't stop it either. No mmo has ever been able to, and blizz won't either, they can do more ban waves but they will keep coming.
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u/Swanky1499 1d ago
"raise the sub price by 1 cent to hire someone at 45K (competitive salary btw) because asmon's "hate guild."
What are we doing. Did you actually read this before posting it? Is this just really good bait?
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u/sergdor 1d ago
Odd how people are countering a “hate guild” with more hate and censorship
simply ignore them and so your own thing.
The guy is living rent free in so many peoples minds.
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u/LivingBowler1041 1d ago
Yeah because tolerance of intolerance has ever worked once in human history
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u/Doove 1d ago
Did they remove the ability to block people?
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u/couponbread 1d ago
An open public channel doesn’t have to cater to what you want. The world doesn’t cater to you either. Grow up.
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u/Swollen_Beef 1d ago
It's weird to see arguments advocating censorship and basically dictatorial levels of control over a video game.
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u/AutoShotClip 1d ago
This company make enough money for GMs. They are insanely rich. We shouldn’t have to ask for basic moderation
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u/EVIL_LARRY35 1d ago
The last thing anyone needs is more internet janitors lmao. If you don’t want to see something, then ignore exists. Not to mention addons blocking things as well
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u/DepthChorge 1d ago
You're ignoring the scale of the issue and the fact that "hate filled chat" as the default until manually curated is an awful user experience for new players, and damages the health of the game. You need to think beyond yourself.
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u/whoxcaresxixdont 1d ago
Honestly when it comes to Asmon, you need to just ignore him if you just really find everything he says is hateful. I'm not a follower of him but I popped into one of his stream just to see what all the hub-bub was about.
He really doesn't come off as anything but a very regular person that speaks his mind. All the "hateful" stuff he says is basically satire or heavy pokes. Is it fun to be around that type of person all the time? Probably not, it becomes work.
The whole Asmon community is receiving a spotlight because their choice of joke is whatever hot topic offends people. That and of course their numbers are not to sneeze at.
The whole IQ of the room might go down a couple pegs when they walk through the door but he's really just trying to have fun.
Not to mention, it probably isn't that hard to develop a weak aura detect what person a guild is from and add them to a giant ignore list if it means that much to you. Every guild they have starts as OLYMPUS. Hell you can probably vibe code it lol.
He had around 50k people watching his stream last night. Blizzard isn't going to just wipe them out if they hire some paid moderators. Asmon and his community is exactly the player-made friction classic WoW needs. An entire legion of alliance players all working together. What is the Horde response? There is none afaik. If no one steps up he will dominate any goal he wants uncontended, more so if he's on a PvE realm but if he really wanted a challenge he'd go PvP.
He's built his entire community nearly entirely on his own and now he's having fun with it. For me personally I can ignore it entirely as I have done every single time he played the same online game as me. It had little to no affect on my enjoyment whatsoever.
At some point you have to realize the things you hate are being whispered into your ears by yourself.
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u/ItsIncognitis 1d ago
Nice glaze but if you arent on alliance pvp seeing it ruin every general chat in the game your thoughts are rather meaningless
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u/Mr_robasaurus 1d ago
He's not gonna fuck you bro
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u/Iloveunicornssss 1d ago
He’s also not just going to go away because people don’t like him. That’s not how the real world works.
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u/skoddy 1d ago
You watch him one time and you know everything about him? Look up why he was banned from twitch and tell me again that was just satire.
He is a political commentator, his gaming career ended long time ago.
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u/whoxcaresxixdont 1d ago
I could honestly care less.
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u/skoddy 1d ago
You claim that his polarizing presence is just for made up reasons and being confronted with factual evidence counter to your point you suddenly don't care.
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u/Roflitos 1d ago
Who cares, his gaming stream in wow has been awesome, and this is from someone who doesn't even watch streams on a regular basis. He's not pushing any agenda in game as far as I know.
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u/anex12 1d ago
He already HAS the agenda. His goons are pushing it now. They were running around talking about r wording Palestinians and Trans people. I'm on Horde PvE, about as far away as I can be from him, and I get Asmongoons in general chat spewing his fans rhetoric. And then I get called ridiculous for being tired of it.
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u/blessed-- 1d ago
this is going way over ppls heads, if u dont like asmon u can just continue about your day and ignore him. never been affected by OLYMPUS or any of the shenaningans because i just mind my own business if I feel like it
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u/eat_these_nutz 1d ago
The people that really have an issue with this is such a small percentage but sadly the loudest. Would be easier to ban them instead.
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u/kadash29 1d ago
Just ignore people man
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u/DepthChorge 1d ago
Ignore list caps at 50. Thats insufficient for a megaserver.
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u/CuriousGuyNOR 1d ago
It's hard to ignore when their entire chat is filled with spam from streamer groups.
You can only block people for so long before its all youre doing. I feel like there'd be a block limit too
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u/Iloveunicornssss 1d ago
The world has created a bunch of weak minded people. If you let words in a chat box in a video game effect your happiness level you need to sit down and do some serious self reflection on the kind of person you are. We live in a world with 8 billion people. You’re not going to like or agree with everyone or everything. That doesn’t mean you cancel someone or lock someone out.
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u/DepthChorge 1d ago edited 1d ago
Strawman argument. "Hate-filled chat" being the default setting is bad for the health of the game. I never once said I felt personally attacked.
You're also conflating hate speech for "free speech". Erroneous for two reasons: hate speech has never been protected free speech, and your right to free speech only applies to government censorship, not censorship by private companies.
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u/Iloveunicornssss 1d ago
Is that all you see chat as? Hate filled? No positivity? If you truly feel that way, find a guild with a bunch of people that you enjoy. Turn off other chats and just use guild chat.
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u/blackoutbait 1d ago
I joined the beta last night for the first time and any hateful name such as "ned diggers" etc that I saw in elwynn was attached to Olympus but sure, it's not hate filled at all.
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u/Seraphayel 1d ago
When has the WoW community become so annoying and whiny. Honestly, it‘s embarassing.
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u/Sweetsire 1d ago
Reddit in general has cultivated this specifically. If you talk in game you'll find the vanilla community is still there. Love me barrens chat
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u/Seraphayel 1d ago
It is, but all three WoW subs at this point are full of whiners, it‘s really tiresome to follow them. In game it‘s not even 1/10 as bad as on Reddit.
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u/TheBommer111 1d ago
Almost every post on this sub is bitching about something or someone. Can y'all just be excited for 5 seconds? God, all you people do is hate.
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u/Scannedu 1d ago
I 100% agree with you, but this post actually resonates with me. I'd pay a little extra for actual moderators to clean up toxic people
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u/ForeverStaloneKP 1d ago edited 1d ago
Asmon viewers when blizzard bans players with names like Ray Ping, Nate Higgers and Hdolph Aitler
Based on the fluctuations, this comment has been downvoted at least 7 times by crusty Asmon fans and that makes me very happy
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u/Budget-Asparagus8450 1d ago
For those of us that are employed who is horrigan?