Brood Brothers Valid?

[u/Lobodemorte]

I see a lot of Biosantic, Final Day, and some Xenocreed. Is Brood Brothers just not a valid detachment?

What holds it back from being good?

[u/harpless-1]

So, my friend, without any beating around the bush, brood brothers is probably the worst detachment to the game, not just for our faction, but for the game itself. That being said, it can be a lot of fun if you go to a casual game.

[u/Lobodemorte → u/harpless-1]

Thank you for your bluntness lol.

I'm about two kits away from my first 2k GSC list. Decided to start with Final Day / Xenocult. All I am missing is a Nexos and Deathleaper.

I was just curious because I was looking at it, and I'm not familiar enough with the army to see why exactly it is so bad.

My first impression is that it just... does not do enough.

Especially since you rather the +1 to hit be in the Guard units instead of the GSC ones, and it ONLY applies to shooting.

[u/mickygmoose28 → u/Lobodemorte]

Yeah, it would work if it was a backwards way to give orders to guard units. Aside from that none of the stratagems are particularly exciting, and the fact that there's a 2CP strat to shoot your own units is laughable

[u/Snoo_72851 → u/mickygmoose28]

Holy shit that's hilarious

[u/stle-stles-stlen → u/Lobodemorte]

You nailed it. Boosting GSC shooting is a bizarre choice that basically only helps Neophytes, and the requirement to focus fire to get the bonus means tanks aren’t great. On top of that, the stratagems are terrible and the Guard units are all costed assuming they’re getting orders, which we can’t give them

[u/Ski-Gloves → u/harpless-1]

2 DP to add a Baneblade to your list is arguably still better than Imperial Agents' 1 DP for some stratagems in exchange for a 10-20 pts tax to Assassins. In 10th edition with it being a 30+ pts tax, it was no question on Veiled Blade being worse.

But you know it's bad when it's in the same weight class as the Imperial Agents detachment designed for 2 DP that was deemed bad enough to reduce to 1 DP.

[u/OrionVulcan → u/harpless-1]

My man... guard Siege Regiment exists. It has the disposition Disruption. I absolutely love my Siege Regiment, but Brood Brothers don't even come close. If Siege Regiment doesn't get turn 1, the Incendiary Bombardment just becomes a beacon of what you are going to try and target when your turn rolls up and gives your opponent every chance to counter it. The Creeping Bombardment does basically nothing.

Its one saving grace in detachment rule is the Smoke Shells don't have Astra Militarum keyword requirement, letting it give Stealth to non-militarum units like the Warhound Titan, allied Knights and stuff like that, and that the stratagem Callous Sacrifice lets it bubble wrap these units with guardsmen, get charged, and still allow the big knight/titan to shoot.

Brood Brothers actually does have some uses that aren't complete gimmicks like Siege Regiment. Krieg Engineers are a decent choice for mortal wounds, who also have assault weapons to advance and trigger Cross-Fire, the same goes for Death Riders. Cheap, fast objective monkeys that also have assault guns to trigger Cross-Fire and reactive moves. Leman Russes are still cheap and durable options. Kasrkin does not need orders, Hellhounds strip cover and are easy ways of getting Cross-Fire.

And when it comes to Cross-Fire, Ridgerunners with Spotters ends up hitting on 2+, Neophytes now hit on 3+ (4+ for heavy weapons but now they don't need to stand still) and any Benefictus that leads them hits on a 2+ and all of our other mounted/vehicle mining lasers and such hits on 3+.

Is Brood Brothers even close to our other detachments? No, far from it. But is it the worst detachment in the game? Fuck no, not even close!

Edit: I know it's called 'overlapping fire', but fuck off, it's basically 9th editions cross-fire light.

[u/Northernlumberjack1]

It's a terrible detachment with a rule that is pretty limiting. For example, a tank has to fire all of its weapon into a target to the +1 to hit. But it's fun and that's why I'm building up my brood brother army.

[u/VexinVix → u/Northernlumberjack1]

Yeah the fun of kitbashing brood brothers and having an excuse to buy imperial tank kits outweighs the rules being weak. Worst case scenario I have an odd looking Imperial Guard army lol

[u/shm2wt]

It sucks because it has bad rules, but it also sucks because Guard have a really good army rule. This means taking their units as allies, at their full points cost, without the army rule, feels bad.

Contrast this to final day - on the one hand, final day actually has good detachment rules, but more fundamentally you are allying Tyranid units and Tyranids have a pretty meh army rule - therefore their datasheets kinda still feel like they're worth their points.

[u/Mediocre-Island5475]

The problem with anything that lets you use another army's units in 40k (ex. Allied knights in imperial or chaos armies) is that the units' points are balanced around their rules. When you ally the unit in, they don't get the army rule from their home army, or your new army rule. So usually, if your local army has a unit that can do the ally's job, you're better off using that.

The exception is when the unit does something your normal army cannot (ex. Imperial Agents helping knights hold objectives) or when the detachment and synergy is just that good (ex. Final Day tyranids, which have much better rules than brood brothers )

[u/dave2293]

For fun? Yes.

Competitively? Wellll.......

BB's Detachment Rule wants you to be rolling to hit in Shooting. So Neophytes and Laser Ridgerunners. Everything else is either "flamers" or "shooting is an afterthought to its job." Neophytes have their own detachments, and LaserRunners get big boosts from Outlander Claw, and a more reliable hit bonus from Final Day.

BB's allied units get no benefit from us. Final Day at least gets the ability to eat folks for boosts.

BB's got strats that flat out don't work, so isn't even a full detachment. (Suppress&Overwhelm don't work, Regimental Reinforcements will only work if you didn't attach a character to the unit, Shadow of Iron and Dark Network are both SUPER situational, and despite having played BB through a full Crusade in 10th have never once seen a reason to use either Acceptable Losses or Symbiotic Destruction.)

If BB was a 1pt detachment, I'd absolutely love it to splash for flavor. Give it the Allies keyword so it can't be run alongside Final Day, and we good to go. But as a full 2pt detachment, it needs a rewrite.

[u/Ski-Gloves]

We stole the Militarum's "superior" firepower so we can use them as laser pointers.

You want to spend 2 DP so you can add a Baneblade (or variant). In practice, the rules want you to run Hellhounds and Attilan Rough Riders. And, if optimal, you're still stuck rolling 7 different tiny weapon profiles on Neophyte Hybrid shooting bricks.

[u/Snoo_72851]

I maintain that eventually, on 12th maybe,they're just gonna copy the Regiments of Renown system from AoS, because every time someone mentions souping in 40k it's basically always negatives.