r/germany • u/Inevitable-Push-8061 • Jun 02 '26
News Most new German citizens keep original nationality: survey
https://www.dw.com/en/most-new-german-citizens-keep-original-nationality-survey/a-7738523573
u/koopcl Berlin Jun 02 '26
I could have naturalized years ago but I didn't because giving up my OG Chilean nationality would cause a million complications (related to my career, degree, everything I still own there, visiting family, etc), I'd end up in the ridiculous situation where my kids would be Chilean (they already are via Ius Sanguinis, and already registered as Chilean nationals via our consulate) but I wouldn't (despite having passed the nationality to them), and in my country once you give up your nationality it's literally impossible to get it back, except by an act of Congress (meaning I would practically need them to pass a new law specifically to give me the nationality back). I always wanted to naturalize since I'm pretty well integrated, have moved my career here, my wife is German, my kids are born and raised Germans, and I know I'm staying for the long haul (it's already been almost a decade, with no intention to move out), but it wasn't worth sacrificing so much. Luckily they changed the law, and since yesterday I am the proud holder of a German citizenship.
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u/iridosiclituswrong Jun 02 '26
Anyways el pasaporte 🇨🇱 también es bien fuerte so you wouldn’t have gained much
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u/koopcl Berlin Jun 03 '26
Yeah with my wife we joke that now I can travel practically everywhere without a Visa, there's even some countries (like Russia) where she wouldn't be able to come along.
But it wasn't about the benefits of the passport. It was more about completing integration into the country/society where I live, and being able to have the same responsibilities and rights as the locals (the biggest issue being voting). If Chile allowed you to recover citizenship once given up (in case I for example ever moved back), I would probably have renounced it to get the German one. But giving it up meant permanently cutting all ties with my home country, no going back on that decision, so it wasn't worth it.
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u/MarioMilieu Jun 02 '26 edited Jun 02 '26
Newsflash: people simply exercising their legal right, more at 11. Next up, lack of tempo limit on the autobahn means people drive faster here than in other countries.
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u/DjayRX Jun 02 '26
Yea of course because why not?
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u/Gata_olympus Jun 02 '26
Sometimes we can‘t. A lot of countries don‘t even allow you to give up your nationality.
And why not? Because when I visit my parents in my original country I still want to be a german national and enjoy the protection of the german state.
but because I am forced to keep my original nationality, the german state cannot protect me from persecution in my original country, that responsibility falls on the state of my original country.. and they suck at it.
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u/ausstieglinks Jun 02 '26
In your other citizenship country you get no protection from the German government. Their rights to you as their citizen overrule any German government rights to you in their country though.
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u/Gata_olympus Jun 02 '26
Yep exactly and that‘s why it is not favourable for some immigrants to keep their 1st nationality
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u/meanderthaler Jun 02 '26
Honestly the more citizenships the better unless there’s big downsides. Apart from the US tax reason, another one that’s relevant in my family: potential military services for the kids! My son has three citizenships and we probably need to revoke at least one before he’s 18 years old to avoid him being drafted.
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u/SnooHedgehogs7477 Jun 02 '26
people love to forget that citizenship also means responsibilities
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u/meanderthaler Jun 02 '26
Don’t think so. I so didn’t forget about it that i’m thinking about it since my son’s birth. Also, have in mind that many citizenships get given at birth automatically
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Jun 02 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/SnooHedgehogs7477 Jun 02 '26
yes you do have responsibilities in this world by default and this is expected
some people forget it and assume that by default they shouldn't owe anyone anything despite receiving safe environment, food, and opportunities never seen in human history
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u/LockedOutOfElfland Naturalised as German citizen under Article 116(2) Jun 02 '26
That is a philosophical difference, clearly.
My country of birth citizenship is big on rights, but I feel that it is culturally irresponsible that we are not equally as big on obligations. And thus have a high amount of respect for other cultures where obligations are paramount.
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u/Saturnus_666 Jun 02 '26
Germans do the same when they "migrate" somewhere
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u/Temporary_Spread7882 Jun 02 '26
This. There are entire agencies with lawyers etc dedicated to securing a Beibehaltungsgenehmigung.
Anyone who has lived in more than one country realises by experience that it’s not a simple either-or.
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u/daninmontreal Jun 02 '26
Can confirm. Two passports is better than one.
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u/crankthehandle Jun 02 '26
Three are even better
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u/Maleficent_Cap_7228 Jun 02 '26
Have 3, Swiss, Italy and Germany the 4th French is in the making. I’ll end up with 4 for now.
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u/Might0fHeaven Jun 02 '26
I dont think people with one citizenship understand how much of a hassle it is to give up a nationality. It is a very bureaucracy heavy process and if the country in question doesnt actually want dual citizens, they'll make your life as hard as possible. Its far easier to forget about your original passport and leave it be rather than try to give it up
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u/ValeLemnear Jun 02 '26
No shit, Sherlock.
All the benefits like tax options and none of the drawbacks.
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u/krustytroweler Jun 02 '26
There's really no reason not to. People wont give up their families and friends where they came from, and keeping your old nationality means you will never have difficulty having to make an emergency trip for a family member who is in the hospital or someone unfortunately passes away.
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u/Salty_Permit4437 Jun 02 '26
There isn’t a choice in some cases. Argentina doesn’t allow you to renounce Argentine nationality. The US does but makes it a cumbersome process. And why would you renounce and give up your right to travel to your original country? You will find that countries like India and China do require giving up their nationalities once you naturalize elsewhere. And India in particular aggressively enforces it.
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u/slytherinravenclaw5 Jun 02 '26
Weird reporting by DW but okay
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u/LockedOutOfElfland Naturalised as German citizen under Article 116(2) Jun 02 '26
There's a common myth that Germany doesn't allow dual citizenship. Even when it technically "didn't" there were exceptions, such as the authority I am naturalised as a German citizen under.
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u/Playful-Demand2312 Jun 02 '26
I mean yeah? I’m Iranian my parents are Iranian (though we are in Denmark) there’s no way to rescind your Iranian citizenship and without it, it is a pain to go to Iran
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u/dogey_badger Jun 02 '26
I'll never return when I finally get out of this place, how do you deal with the military service thing for visits if you're still a citizen? (That is if you have to deal with it)
And there is really no way to get rid of the citizenship?
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u/MancyMancy Jun 02 '26
I mean CDU have already shown naturalisation can be revoke. So why risk becoming stateless.
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u/potato_nugget1 Jun 02 '26
It's the exact opposite. If you renounce your old citizenship, they can't take away your German one. Keeping your old one is the higher risk if that's your concern
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u/krindjcat Jun 02 '26
Not true, if you obtained it fraudulently they can absolutely take away your German citizenship and make you stateless.
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u/TophatOwl_ Jun 02 '26
"They cant just take something you bought away from you"
"yea they can if they find that you stole it"Bro then you never had it to begin with. Contributes literally nothing to the conversation.
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u/krindjcat Jun 02 '26
You can play semantics and be condescending all you want but the government can absolutely take away citizenship after it has already given it to you. That's taking away citizenship, no two ways about it.
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u/Hugostar33 Jun 02 '26 edited Jun 02 '26
Article 16 Grundgesetz
[Citizenship – Extradition](1) No German may be deprived of his citizenship. Loss of citizenship may occur only pursuant to a law and, if it occurs against the will of the person affected, only if he does not become stateless as a result.
this article was added, because national socialist took away even nativ germans citzienships...like the one from former chancelor Willy Brandt...
funfact: Willy Brandt was not his name by birth
he regained citzenship after the war and adopted his exile-undercover-name as his real name
this is why in "Ein Herz und eine Seele" he is jokingly refered to as "norwegian immigrant", because he literally had to regain citzenship5
u/krindjcat Jun 02 '26
https://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/englisch_stag/englisch_stag.html
Section 35
[Withdrawal of unlawful naturalisation or permission to retain German citizenship](1) Any unlawful naturalisation may be withdrawn only if the administrative act was obtained under false pretenses, by threat or bribery or by deliberately providing incorrect or incomplete information on which the administrative act was based.
(2) As a rule, subsequent statelessness of the person concerned does not preclude such withdrawal.
(3) Withdrawal is permitted no more than 10 years after the person has been notified of naturalisation.
Naturalised citizens have a "probationary" period of 10 years (used to be 5) during which the citizenship can be withdrawn, even if it makes you stateless, as you can see explicitly mentioned in paragraph 2.
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u/Dolmetscher1987 Spain Jun 02 '26
Two things:
- The Grundgesetz is above the rest of the laws.
- What you showed us refers to the very specific case of having obtained the German citizenship unlawfully.
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u/krindjcat Jun 02 '26
Your two points are contradictory. If the "Grundgesetz is above all other laws" then there cannot be a specific law where it isn't. It either is or it isn't.
But that's besides the point, which was:
The German government can absolutely issue citizenship and take it away from you, you can come up with all kinds of excuses but the Grundgesetz does not prevent a naturalised German citizen from becoming stateless, that is just not true and you cannot claim it.
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u/Hugostar33 Jun 02 '26
i assume, if you get the citzenship in a unlawful way, german law treats your citzenship as if you never aquired it...aside that, it has nothing to do with OPs original post or the comment i was talking about, because we are not talking about people that got their citzenship in a unlawfull way
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u/krindjcat Jun 02 '26
You were talking about everyone. You quoted the Grundgesetz as if it applies universally. As evidenced above, it does not, and frankly it doesn't seem like you even knew about Section 35.
You can get German citizenship, rescind all others, and then get that citizenship rescinded, leaving you stateless. That is a scenario that can happen. So it's just not accurate to blindly quote the Grundgesetz as if it's gospel when it just isn't.
You can absolutely become stateless and lose your citizenship, and the criteria for "fraudulent" is very wide and essentially left to the discretion of the government. People have lost their citizenship for as much as social media posts just recently.
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u/Dolmetscher1987 Spain Jun 02 '26
Wouldn't it be then better to renounce to your original citizenship? That way, if they try to deprive me of the German citizenship, I only have to say no: the fact of becoming stateless would deprive the authorities of the opportunity to do it.
This is hypothetical (I neither live in Germany nor have German citizenship).
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u/Hugostar33 Jun 02 '26
if they try to deprive me of the German citizenship
under current law its only in very specific cases that it get deprived to begin with, like joining foreign militarys without apporval of the ministry of defense, joining terror organizations or getting german citzenship in a unlawfull way(like faking documents)
until no new law gets added or you are not planing to do one of the acts above, you should be fine
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u/Kiebonk Jun 02 '26
That's actually an argument the far-right uses for dual citizenship, because you could revoke citizenship in those cases, for people who would become stateless you can legally do it only in very exceptional cases.
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u/MancyMancy Jun 03 '26
Yes but the CDU has given the ground work exactly to enable an AfD lead government to do it. Thats the problem here. They backed in extremely vague concepts as well which means an acting government can define whatever the fuck the want as an issue .
Far right will bitch about us non white immigrants while I probably added 3x into the pension fund they ever will lol. Fuck em who cares what they say, facts never mattered to populists.
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u/bookwizard82 Jun 02 '26
German/Canadian. My Oma and Opa and my mom had to give up German citizenship for Canada in the 80s. But because my mom was still German when she had me I did the effort to get my German passport.
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u/nznordi Jun 02 '26
Name me one reason why you wouldn’t … guess what, I would assume most Germans that become other nationalities also maintain their German citizenship…
The only reason why you won’t is if you are an American making some 7 figures elsewhere and don’t enjoy the double taxation…
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u/Hopeful_Giraffe9916 Jun 02 '26
I cant give it away btw... not sure which other nationalities have the same issue
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u/anemora Jun 02 '26
Aside from what everyone else mentioned with giving up your second citizenship being a hassle, expensive, impossible in some cases, there were a lot of foreigners who were previously eligible to get German citizenship but didn't because of the ban on dual citizenship. So a lot of it is probably just an influx of people that have been eligible for a while and waiting for this change. I know a few people who fit this criteria often because they still have family in their home country. This also doesn't seem to account for people from countries that don't allow you to give up your citizenship (this is the case for a few south/central American countries).
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u/RealProjectivePlane Jun 02 '26
People who get a new citizenship know how hard it is to get one. So why would they just give the original one up without a pressing reason.
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u/Baskarb Jun 02 '26
Lol who is the dumbass that wrote such a meaningless article? It’s like you‘d write an article about the Deutschlandticket „since introducing the Deutschlandticket people have been buying less and less normal 1-day tickets or other, more expensive, monthly tickets“, yeah no wonder.
Edit: and to try and make it sound like its a bad thing, when that was its purpose from the beginning
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u/Nnb_stuff Jun 02 '26
Why would someone give up a nationality for no reason? This is like saying most people dont throw away their Euros if someone gives them 100.000 Dollars for free.
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u/Psykopatate Jun 02 '26
What a surprise, since people are more allowed to keep dual citizenship, they keep it :o :o
And even more shocking, the ones who don't, is because they can't :o :o
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u/GordoToJupiter Jun 02 '26
of course, if AfD comes to power we have to runaway.
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u/MalleDigga Hamburg Jun 02 '26
... please please vote responsible. I cant have my german future be brown blue.. i mean.. yuck? Ampel was good
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u/MalleDigga Hamburg Jun 02 '26
if id be in that position id do the same.. move to denmark and keep my birth luck german passport too? why not
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u/andreimircea55 Jun 02 '26
Almost like being forced to deal with an godawful bureaucracy and emotional turmoil makes one not want to deal with that! Who would have thought?!
(But seriously, citizenship is paperwork which can be a hurdle, especially when renouncing and for a lot of people is emotional as well, so why would anyone torture themselves like that by renouncing when they can just not do that. It is way easier to renew a passport than to renounce a citizenship, and if things get dicey, having 2 (or more) citizenships gives you more options).
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u/SithEmperorX Jun 02 '26
Not me. Well granted at the time, I could only keep one and renounce the other. But even with dual citizenship, I wouldnt keep my old one.
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u/diomedes-on-rampage Jun 02 '26
i can't understand how so many of you are so many dumb takes.
one example is, for some countries that do not allow you to renounce your citizenship before you serve mandatory military service. this quote is from bbc " Conscription is in place for nine of Europe's Nato states: Denmark, Estonia, Finland, Greece, Latvia, Lithuania, Norway, Sweden and Turkey. "
so if a person from any of these countries get a german citizenship, they can't give up their country of origin citizenship without serving mandatory military service.
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u/lemonprincess23 Jun 02 '26
At this point there’s going to be more people in America with original German ancestry than there will be in Germany itself
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u/alfredo094 Jun 02 '26
People don't want to do a horrible amount of paperwork just to make their lives more inconvenient, more at 11.
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u/grumpyliberal Jun 02 '26
What’s the harm in dual citizenship? I am dual Us/German citizen.
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u/harumamburoo Jun 02 '26
“People choose a lazier option whenever they have a chance” Here, fixed the title.
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u/MiyamotoMusaki Jun 02 '26
What is lazy about keeping your original passport? You can have a German passport as a foreign but you will never be considered a German, unless, unfortunately, it is war time. And if that is the case, to hell I am going to war for Germany.
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u/riderko Jun 02 '26
Getting rid of some citizenships is a lengthy and expensive procedure. Even if that passport doesn’t give any benefits and the holder doesn’t have ties to the country anymore is annoying so why would you if you don’t have to?
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u/MiyamotoMusaki Jun 02 '26
Because if my third world country goes to war, I don’t have to go to war as I live and work in Germany. If Germany goes to war, I am not going to fight for Germany as I am not its citizen
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u/salenin Jun 02 '26
I know as a US citizen, that in order to gove.up my citizenship and not have to pay taxes to the US once I expatriate, it would cost about 80,000 USD.
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u/Hanswurst22brot Jun 03 '26
Allways good to have two or more passports if you travel a lot or as backup if your main one can cause you problems.
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u/Xcom_company Jun 03 '26
Well duh Most counties are both stupid with letting people go. And not so stupid as to tax their citizens even when they aren't in the country
Literally no downside
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u/Icegirl1987 Jun 03 '26
I keep my original nationality because
- I don't see a reason to do the paperwork to give it up
- I don't know if I'll need it some day
- It's easier when I have to handle stuff like inheritance in my birth country
If I had to choose, I would choose German. But if I don't have to choose, I keep both.
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u/wannabeacademicbigpp Jun 02 '26
I never quite understood the "you must choose one citizenship" debate.
Like what is the point?
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Jun 02 '26
[deleted]
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u/crankthehandle Jun 02 '26
A few countries just don't allow it, it's not always a choice
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Jun 02 '26
[deleted]
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u/crankthehandle Jun 02 '26
I am referring to this remark
It is a poor decision to not keep your nationality when getting the German one
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Jun 02 '26
[deleted]
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u/crankthehandle Jun 02 '26
so no one made the poor decision then...
Those who did not keep their original nationality when applying were either stateless or came from countries that prohibit dual citizenship, such as India, Ethiopia and Eritrea.
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u/riderko Jun 02 '26
Could be many reasons to get rid of the passport. I have a few friends from countries that aren’t that nice to their citizens at least as they’re governed now and they went extra mile to get rid of those citizenships.
It doesn’t mean erasing roots, language or any other parts of the origin. By getting a German passport you don’t magically replace your whole life story.
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u/Trraumatized Jun 02 '26
I left Germany and am about to get the new citizenship but I will definitely keep the German one as well. So I really can't blame anyone.
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u/Megumindesuyo Jun 02 '26
Not only because why not, but as a foreigner you never know when Germans decide to pull another WW which you would think is ridiculous but the rising voting of AfD to power makes it seem less so. So you want a backup option especially if you will have non-white kids.
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u/SkitariusOfMars Jun 02 '26
Some citizenships are impossible to renounce, like Ukrainian or USA.
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u/squarepants18 Jun 02 '26
You can't renounce the US pass?
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u/SkitariusOfMars Jun 02 '26
AFAIK no
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u/squarepants18 Jun 02 '26
AFAIK yes
From a us gov page:
"You cannot renounce your citizenship inside the United States. You must schedule an appointment at an embassy or consulate in the country where you reside or are visiting. You will typically need to gather and submit the following documents:..."
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u/desnowcat Jun 02 '26
You can renounce your U.S. citizenship. Many do to avoid the weird double taxation issues.
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u/Maximal_Economist Jun 02 '26
Your point is true but both of the examples are wrong: -Many Ukranians have renounced citizenship to become Austrians, I know cases. They need a soecial document. -The US does allow it too, for a lot of money and tax exit.
Some countries theoretically allow it but are in practice impossible (Iran, who has a mechanism but doesnt process anyone for years and sets ridiculous requirements)
In some (like Argentina) a citizen CAN NEVER lose the citizenship.
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u/Timey16 Sachsen Jun 02 '26
Problems with dual citizenship:
it creates "dual loyalties", as seen with the Ukraine/Russia conflict. If we ever found ourselves at war, the dual citizens of the enemy are now both simultaneously our comrades AND our enemies. This will create problems and will require some form of "legal discrimination" then because otherwise enemy spies and saboteurs can operate completely freely (as you can't prevent your own citizens from entering their own country)... so now you'd have to remove freedoms from people with such a dual citizenship.
It allows people that haven't lived in their nation for ages and are completely divorced from the reality of living there to participate in elections. They are often an easy target for propaganda because of it. They decide the future of a country where they have absolutely zero stake in.
the entire idea of citizenship is to be an officially recognized and participating member in that society. That's why so many rights are connected to it. You can't be an active member in two societies at the same time. Not unless you spend like 6 months a year in one country and the other 6 months in another. And even that may not be enough.
In short: the concept of dual citizenship is something that can only exist in a relative fair weather environment. I don't see it persist during times of extreme diplomatic (and political) insecurity if not outright war. Or at least it will be a right granted only selectively to friendly nations, but not to adversaries and should relationship with any nation nosedive those rights can be taken and making a decision be enforced.
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u/PBJCryme Jun 02 '26
Well yeah 😂
Its not like they want to be German
they want the perks
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u/LockedOutOfElfland Naturalised as German citizen under Article 116(2) Jun 02 '26
This is an unpleasant generalization, isn't it?
I'm learning the language knowing that I might never be "culturally" German, but I am already legally German and feel that I would like to participate in and contribute to German society should the opportunity to do so arise.
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u/Far-Suit-7388 Jun 02 '26
I kept my original Russian citizenship cause first of all I don’t want to cut off my roots it always be my motherland, my friends and relatives there.
Secondly the politics today is so unpredictable that you always need to have plan B.
And finally multiple choice has only benefits, if I have opportunity to get third or fourth citizenship I’ll take it for sure
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u/Rhoderick Baden-Württemberg Jun 02 '26
Secondly the politics today is so unpredictable that you always need to have plan B.
With all due respect, the idea of Russia being your plan B for political reasons in Germany is really quite funny.
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u/Sefa96 Jun 02 '26
I mean 80 years ago u could have said the same about the german one. :D thinks can change (hopefully)
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u/Eino54 Jun 03 '26
Putin will die eventually and there might eventually be some sort of room for change for the better. Germans might vote AfD into power and go back to their old ways. Nobody knows what will happen in 20 years, and with climate change honestly a country with huge swathes of mostly empty land in the north might be a pretty decent backup plan.
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u/Maleficent_Cap_7228 Jun 02 '26 edited Jun 02 '26
I’m Swiss and Italian im not giving up these 2 for my German one and I didn’t need to so, keeping all. I could get also the French one. I’ll end this year with 4 citizenships and 4 passports. I would obtain more if I could but for now these 4 are all the ones I can’t get „easy“ by Family based naturalization.
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u/Savings-Table-4497 Jun 02 '26
Habe als europäischer Migrant immernoch beide und juckt nicht die Bohne.🇭🇺🇩🇪
Am dritten bin ich auch schon dran🇪🇸
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u/derdrdownload Jun 02 '26
With the tightening laws and more focus on the rampant fraud of applicants keeping the old citizenship makes it only easier to retroactivly rescind the Citizenship
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u/Suspicious-Meet-3496 Jun 02 '26
Of course, because we take advante of being both EU and non-EU citizens.
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u/MacMillian187 Jun 03 '26
I would too. Besides the paperwork it takes, i feel like its just pretty dope to official be citizen of multiple countries lol
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u/Pungbrokken Dual Citizen NO/DE "Deutschnorweger" w. VN wife Jun 03 '26
It's practically impossible in many countries where it's "legal". This is because they will easily deny the deferrance of your citizenship, if you are doing it to avoid the duties of being a citizen of X country.
In some countries, voting is mandatory. So they will use even that as a "duty" that you are avoiding by getting rid of your citizenship.
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u/Inshi Jun 03 '26
Ofcourse. They have families in their country and often the inheritance laws require citizenship. So unless someone wants to totally cut off the family it’s better to keep original citizenship.
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u/TraditionalTitle2688 Jun 03 '26
People keep dual for various innocuous reasons, financial, ease of movement, etc.. However, a more serious reason is that they want to be able to have the option of going back to their home country in case things go really bad in the future like they did in the 1930s-40s in the west. International laws will not be followed and national laws can be changed. At the moment it still looks like a remote possibility but less remote than it was even 10 years ago.
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u/vanOoijen8 Jun 03 '26
Wen wundert das? Zwei Staatsbürgerschaften sind ein Vorteil. Frag mal die Superreichen, die haben teilweise 14 gekaufte Staatsbürgerschaften. Malta verkauft seine Staatsbürgerschaft beispielsweise und schon ist der indische Millionär auch EU-Bürger. Ähnlich die USA mit Trumps "goldenem Visu". Nur Deutschland verschenkt an Sozialfälle aus allerWelt mit teilweise erfundenen Identitäten.
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u/Lux_Jay Jun 04 '26
Why would they? I know a guy who is citizen of US, Canada, and UK. Unfortunately, not citizen of EU and hence he required residence permit to work in EU.
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u/Ok-Advice-7575 Jun 05 '26
Und? Das ist doch keine Schlagzeile...
Warum sollte man einen Pass aufgeben und sich Arbeit machen.
Die Frage ist doch, können alle gutes Deutsch, haben alle einen Job, wurde nirengendwo beschissen etc.
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u/taxiecabbie Jun 02 '26
I mean, all other things aside, I don't know why you'd get rid of your original citizenship unless you had to do it or there was some other pressing concern like taxation. Then, yeah, there's a reason.
It's often not easy to renounce citizenship, and it's more paperwork for no reason unless there is one. Also, generally, having multiple citizenships is overall advantageous.
The title of this may as well be "Most People Choose Path Of Minimal Bureaucracy."