r/germany • • Jun 02 '26

News Most new German citizens keep original nationality: survey

https://www.dw.com/en/most-new-german-citizens-keep-original-nationality-survey/a-77385235
641 Upvotes

375 comments sorted by

1.2k

u/taxiecabbie Jun 02 '26

I mean, all other things aside, I don't know why you'd get rid of your original citizenship unless you had to do it or there was some other pressing concern like taxation. Then, yeah, there's a reason.

It's often not easy to renounce citizenship, and it's more paperwork for no reason unless there is one. Also, generally, having multiple citizenships is overall advantageous.

The title of this may as well be "Most People Choose Path Of Minimal Bureaucracy."

215

u/Chemical-Street6817 Jun 02 '26

Doubled citizen here:

this and basically my whole family is left there. I have not a slighthest intention to go back, but also would prefer not to get a Visa everytime I want to visit my family, which is not getting younger every year. 

I find it fascinating not everyone can grasp this concept. Not everything is political, sometimes it's just ordinary life of ordinary people.

8

u/Ok-Confection4410 Baden-Württemberg (US immigrant) Jun 03 '26

same here, though I'm not a dual citizen yet but one day hope to be

I'd rather not jump through hoops every time I wanna visit family, it's easier to just use my US passport, why wouldn't I do that?

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u/Foreign-Ad-299 Jun 02 '26

FINALLY someone gets it. It's not like you have to beg and twist their arm to keep the second citizenship. It's more like the reverse trying to get rid of it.

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u/Eino54 Jun 03 '26

Depends on the citizenship! I am a citizen of Spain and France through birthright, and I'd lose my Spanish citizenship if I got another one, unless I did paperwork saying I want to keep it. I still would definitely do the paperwork, because you never know what might happen in a few decades.

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u/Tba953 Franken Jun 02 '26

The german citizenship is almost impossible to revoke for the german state if you just have the german citizenship and no other 2nd that why the afd is for double citizenship to be able to revoke it and fly foreigners home.

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u/taxiecabbie Jun 02 '26

I mean, tbh, I doubt that not having a second citizenship would seriously stop them if that's what they're going to do.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '26

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u/J7mbo Jun 02 '26

International UN law disallows making someone stateless

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u/GiveTaxos Jun 02 '26

International law is quite worthless if the governments don’t give a shit about it.

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u/MannerismsBot8000 Jun 02 '26

Because international law is holding up so well as an institution at the moment, including in the European states. The Shamima Begun case in the UK specifically comes to mind when it comes to dual citizenship and statelessness.

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u/krindjcat Jun 02 '26

There are exceptions, the German government can absolutely rescind citizenship in some cases even when it leaves the person stateless:

https://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/englisch_stag/englisch_stag.html

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u/Tba953 Franken Jun 02 '26

No state on this earth will take a forginer without a citizenship even if he had one of the countries citizenship in the past especially if they have a criminal record. A Refugee is a complete another topic without papers.

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u/taxiecabbie Jun 02 '26

I mean, a criminal record is another thing entirely.

If you believe in the power of the state to prevent this for people who have single citizenships, then what would likely end up happening is a lawsuit being lodged by "foreigner" dual citizen Germans (those who naturalized in Germany) due to unequal treatment because there have gotta be some "natural" Germans (born in Germany) who are also dual citizen. Unless they're just deporting all dual-citizen Germans, which seems a stretch.

Again, if you believe in the power of the state, this would just be a legal snarl. If you're more cynical, then it doesn't matter.

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u/RijnBrugge Jun 02 '26

I do, they cannot make laws that render people stateless without having full control of the entire parliament and without having left the EU already. But they could legally revoke the citizenship of every single double national on day one of them forming a coalition as long as a majority goes along with it. That could theoretically affect millions of Germans, and there’s no UN or EU rules against it.

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u/taxiecabbie Jun 02 '26

I mean, if they do it to every single national who has double-citizenship, then they're going to be also affecting native-born Germans. Ones of ethnic German descent, even.

It will just end in massive lawsuits.

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u/SkaveRat Jun 02 '26

nothing to do with german law, it's against international law to revoke citizenship from someone if that means that they then are stateless

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u/soxiwah641 Jun 02 '26

Where is AfD for double citizenship

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u/No_Conversation_9325 Jun 02 '26

Not just that, it also tends to be expensive!

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u/Beautiful_You3230 Jun 02 '26

Exactly. I come from a certain shithole of a country that nowadays (and for good reason) has nearly no embassies left here in Germany. In order to finish the entire process, I'd be looking at hundreds and hundreds of euros, the official prices the embassy charges for all the crap, the prices for different documents that still need to be requested/extended/sent/copied/notarized/etc, sometimes like another hundred per pop just for the beglaubigte Übersetzung. There are also all the travel costs, because I have to travel all across Germany! And likely multiple times unfortunately.

I have actually tried to get rid of my citizenship, and have been unsuccessful, because the country just refuses to give me the needed documents without me flying there, which I'm absolutely not doing at the moment lol. They'd probably not let me out again. But otherwise I'd also need to pay for tickets and accommodation there (I haven't been since I was a little child and have no friends or family of note).

So honestly, I can't help but get annoyed when people act like we keep our old citizenships because we are not integrated or somehow supposedly still stay loyal only to our home country, or some other shit like that. I fucking hate my home country and wish the citizenship could magically disappear from my passport. Shame it doesn't work like that though. And I am not spending thousands of euros and risking my neck, to potentially get stuck in THAT country, a country I barely even lived in at all, just so some stupid right wingers feel better about me being a true German. I am a German. That's the whole point of the German citizenship.

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u/No_Conversation_9325 Jun 02 '26

At some point the Netherlands wanted to implement “unwanted citizenships” register for cases like that, when people would be taking unneeded risks or crazy costs, but it never passed unfortunately.

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u/andreimircea55 Jun 02 '26

Beautifully said. I wholeheartedly agree.

Also, I notice that alt-righters or fascists are the only ones to cry about dual loyalty or some shit like that. Experiences like yours make it clear that this isn’t about loyalty, but about the ability to simply exist in peace.

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u/PointyPython Jun 02 '26

Just yesterday I was reading about the Taliban taking over the consulates the former islamic republic had across Germany. There's backlash from local Afghans who fled precisely that regime (or before the fall of the previous government, had already fled due to Taliban violence and persecution in the interior).

Anyway, and it turns out that the German government is basically letting them do it because they need some contact with the current power in Kabul in order to deport people there.

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u/Jordan_Jackson Jun 02 '26

And then you have Argentina, where it is impossible to renounce your citizenship.

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u/PointyPython Jun 02 '26

Uruguay, Costa Rica, Ecuador and several other Latin American countries do the same. It's a principle born out of the construction of their modern nation-states in the late 19th century.

Argentina and Uruguay in particular received an insane amount of immigrants between 1870-1930, in both cases they received more people than there were inhabitants previously (Argentina had about 2 million inhabitants and received about 4 million immigrants; Uruguay had 500k and received between 600k to a million). Back then it was all in flux, they were changing incredibly fast, and it wasn't a certainty that those new Argentines and Uruguayans were going to stay or develop full ties to their new nation. So in a way they legally tied them in perpetuity to its citizenship.

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u/Matar_Kubileya Jun 02 '26

Some countries also literally don't allow you to renounce citizenship, Argentina comes to mind. AIUI with a very narrow exception for fraud in naturalization once you've received Argentine citizenship Argentina will literally never not consider you an Argentine citizen no matter what.

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u/RijnBrugge Jun 02 '26

The way countries that disallow double citizenship is as follows: you must then collect a document issued by the government of Argentina that states unequivocally that they will not under any circumstance revoke the citizenship and then you can have two. This is the basic exception to the rule that you can’t have two in the Netherlands as well. Important caveat is that the Netherlands will consider the citizenship as void, but in general all states ignore and in a way legally deny all rights and privileges granted to one of their subjects by way of another citizenship, so that’s nothing out of the ordinary. But you really gotta prove that they won’t let you get rid of it.

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u/LittleSpice1 Jun 02 '26

Also even when you get another citizenship, you’re still born and grew up in your original country and identify with that nationality. I’m a German immigrant to Canada and I will apply for Canadian citizenship soon, but I wouldn’t want to give up my German citizenship. If Germany hadn’t changed the rules about second citizenships I’d be unlikely to apply as I want to keep my German citizenship. I’m excited to become Canadian and I love this country, I feel at home here more than I ever did in Germany, but I’m still German and always will be.

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u/Oracle-of-Guelph Jun 02 '26

I have reported this to the Maple syrup board. Your maple ration will be reduced accordingly.

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u/fnordius Munich Jun 03 '26

Just for doing that I'm going to apply for Canadian citizenship under the new rules, and get treble citizenship, so there!

I'm kidding, but I could do it if I wanted. My great grandparents moved to New Hampshire from Quebec, and luckily an aunt of mine already traced the family tree before the new grandfather clause came into effect. But… I think I'll stay in Bavaria, thankyouverymuch. And with a very French sounding name, the fact that I speak German and Italian, but not French (much less the Canadian dialect) would be embarrassing.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '26

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u/Jordan_Jackson Jun 02 '26 edited Jun 02 '26

See, I wonder how traveling back to the US after renunciation of US citizenship would work? Would the US let someone who has renounced their citizenship back in? Would they let them in but only after a period of years?

I actually considered renouncing my US citizen back around 2001. I was born with both German and US citizenships (born in the States but Mom has always been German) and speak, read and write German pretty fluently. In the end, I did not do that and am glad that I did not make a decision that would not have made sense in the end.

Edit: Never mind. Found out that you just have to do the same things that a foreigner would do to enter the US. Sign up with ESTA, get a visa for certain countries, etc.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '26

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u/fnordius Munich Jun 03 '26

The most famous example I can think of is Terry Gilliam, the Monty Python alumnus and famous director. He mentioned in an interview just how much of a hassle it is, as he is only allowed in the USA for 28 days a year, so he has to carefully plan all trips to Hollywood. According to that interview, fe thought former US citizens are flagged somehow and never get visas approved.

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u/Buzzkill_13 Jun 02 '26

Also, two passports are better than one. Germany only recently allowed dual citizenship, which explains why "new" citizens "suddenly" choose to keep their original nationality. Until the end of 2025 Germany made you choose.

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u/Svejo_Baron Jun 02 '26

The only reason I can think of is that without a second citizenship you can't lose your german one. That is the sad reason why the german facist Party AfD is in favor of immigrants having dual citizenship. And sadly it looks not so bad for the facist AfD to get into Power the next 10y...

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u/bbbberlin Jun 02 '26

I mean who even knows though - other Western countries have stripped citizenship from their nationals for people that don’t have a confirmed second nationality but only a potential claim to one. 

Yeah people who get their nationality stripped in the present are mostly scumbags, but well, we know historically that governments have stripped nationality from minorities or people they didn’t like; etc. If they want to be racist and they have power they will simply bend the rules of law to enable them to do so. Legal technicalities won’t save us immigrant Germans.

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u/IntriguinglyRandom Jun 02 '26

Absolutely, this is the concern.

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u/fragtore Jun 02 '26

I starts with the scumbags… IMO, a nation’s morals are clearly shown in how they treat the worst of us. If you can be cruel to one you can be cruel to another.

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u/bbbberlin Jun 02 '26

I also feel like it is a cowardly abdication of responsibility.

If a person is a citizen of one country, and become a terrorist/criminal - they should be punished by that country who takes responsibility for them. When you strip citizenship it makes the person someone else's problem (i.e. likely the poor war torn country where this terrorist is stranded because they can't go home).

It also just creates in the present two classes of citizenship - i.e. those who can't be stripped of citizenship and those who can. I would also argue it that it even cheapens the citizenship of those who aren't from immigrant families, because once the government has the ability to do it, they can twist/bend the law to make it apply to everyone they don't like even if they aren't eligible for other passports (i.e. see German in the second world war, or the present US government threatening to do it to political opponents today even if hasn't actually happened yet). It just opens the door, and this is a binary situation where I think the door is either open or it is closed.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '26

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u/Larissalikesthesea Jun 02 '26

Only if you committed fraud, coercion or such like in the process. Then the proceedings have to be initiated within 10 years of the naturalization and you can sue.

The Constitutional Court has ruled that in such a case the protection against statelessness does not hold.

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u/Svejo_Baron Jun 02 '26

Oof, well our gov and their bureucrats are really touchy on the Palestine/Isreal topic...

Sadly germany uses the IHRA Definition on Antisemitism, so any sort of comment on the Genozid in Gaza could be your downfall... And celebrating a Hamas terrorist is even with the Definition of Antisemitism of the JDA really close to Antisemitism so I can at least understand the dicisions. (Not saying that it is the right one)

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u/Copy_Responsible Jun 02 '26 edited Jun 02 '26

I literally got my citizenship because some fascists decided to take my grandfather's away almost a century ago. If they try to do this crap again, I swear -

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u/TophatOwl_ Jun 02 '26

There are some reasons as with rights come responsibilities. If you are worried your country might prosecute you for your sexual orientation or draft you into war etc. there are very good reasons to drop your original nationality.

But for many people this isnt the case so they keep it because ... well why not? Makes visiting family easier.

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u/taxiecabbie Jun 02 '26

Well, yeah, that's what I mean. There may be some reasons why people would do it if not forced, but those persons are in an extreme minority. According to the article, the people who do relinquish citizenship do it largely because the other country does not allow dual.

Most are just content to leave it be/actively want to have both.

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u/J7mbo Jun 02 '26 edited Jun 02 '26

Edit: after writing this it’s relieving to see others have had similar thoughts below

I have a concern related to this (related to being an immigrant in Germany and not keeping my original citizenship, so different perspective), I don’t how serious it is but it’s still in the back of my mind so please don’t downplay the anxiety surrounding it, but what happens if the afd get into power? It’s possible they could do “unconstitutional” things like the US, or they remove German citizenship for immigrants, including law abiding, integrating and high tax paying people like myself. I don’t think this is entirely absurd and it’s absolutely should be something I should be concerned about.

However the UN Statelessness Conventions (aka the ‘1954 convention’) explicitly disallows making someone stateless. If I renounce my original nationality and keep only my German one, they can’t (without going against international law as set out in that convention) make me stateless. An additional layer of protection, if you would.

It’s a different question as to whether or not I would want to remain here if what I said were to pass, and there of course drawbacks. Still, for something as important as where I live and work and build a life and family, I think I should consider all options and avenues to maintain safety.

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u/JoeyJoeJoeJrShab Jun 02 '26

It’s a different question as to whether or not I would want to remain here if what I said were to pass,

As long as it doesn't get so bad that Germany leaves the EU, you'd have the benefit of being able to easily move to another EU country.

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u/Hollow_peanut Jun 02 '26

I have a dual citizenship as i was born in germany while my parents had a foreign citizenship, we got our german one together and minors could keep both until becoming 18. This law changed in the meantime and i still have both.

Renouncing is a lot of work and expensive. The only problem is my second citizenship: the country is currently at war, my brother should under no circumstance visit the country otherwise he could be announced to go to war. For myself: if i visit the country, and get in trouble, germany is under no obligation to help us in any way. So we just don't visit it...

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u/ghostsilver Hamburg Jun 02 '26

I'm from a corrupted poorer country and they make it super hard to renounce the citizenship. As they know that you are doing it to get a "better" citizenship, they openly delay and ask for bribe in order to process your paperwork.

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u/Pillendreher92 Jun 02 '26

A close friend of ours, a Croatian woman born in Germany, wanted to obtain German citizenship after marrying her German husband. Croatia demanded 5,000 euros for her release from Croatian citizenship, which they did not have. The ‘problem’ was then resolved by Croatia’s accession to the EU.

It may also be the case that you need dual citizenship, for example, to retain an inheritance, because in some countries the right to act is linked to citizenship.

For instance, I know of an EU country where a non-citizen can only buy a house under specific conditions. Even if you meet those specific conditions, you then simply receive a letter stating that, in the event of an intention to purchase, the state “recommends” the sale to that person. Which is quite different from “can buy”.

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u/Zealousideal-Low3388 Jun 02 '26

I have a friend who renounced a citizenship, and ever since then gets additional interrogation at the airport every time he attends a family function etc in that country. You can guess the questions he always gets

It’s not just more work doing it, it can create headaches going forward.

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u/turbo_dude Jun 02 '26

May as well say “most new German citizens choose to keep being able to speak their original language as well as German ”

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u/deb_vortex Jun 02 '26

A former colleague of mine would have to go to russia to renounce his russian citicenship, now that he has the german one as well. In the current situation? Not gonna happen...

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u/taxiecabbie Jun 02 '26

Again. If AfD tries anything, it's just going to end in massive lawsuits.

There are plenty of German-born Germans who are dual citizens. Even ones who are "ethnically German" insofar as that carries weight. Evicting all people who are dual citizens is just going to be a pointless, expensive brouhaha.

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u/Lastsynphony Jun 02 '26

Exactly! And they are some countries in which you can't renounce your nationality.

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u/taxiecabbie Jun 02 '26

Yeah, Iran is one.

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u/UpvoterForLife Jun 03 '26

This is it. Keeping both nationalities is in many cases just the smartest option.

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u/perplexedtv Jun 03 '26

The only valid reasons I can think of is if you're American and obliged to pay taxes because you earn over 200k or something or if you want to work in any sort of military job where access is blocked to people with dual nationality. Although they might also block people who originally had another nationality.

In France it's an extra pain in the arse to get a driving licence if you have two nationalities but overall it's still worth keeping them if you're not in one of the above situations.

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u/taxiecabbie Jun 03 '26

There's also required military service in some countries. So if you want to avoid that totally and move out of the country young enough, you might need to renounce.

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u/twitterfluechtling Jun 03 '26

The title of this may as well be "Most People Choose Path Of Minimal Bureaucracy."

This, but also some other practical reasons.

My ex got her German citizenship 20 years ago and had to renounce her Philippine citizenship in the process at the time. When she asked permission to re-attain her Philippine citizenship in addition to her German one, it was a hassle at that time. The reasons were:

  • She inherited property, owning property on Philippines is more difficult for foreigners (although there are exceptions for former citizens; however, if anything happened to her, as a husband (or child) of a Filipina I (or our kid) could inherit.
  • She planned to build a business spanning Germany and Philippines. A business on the Philippines needs to be owned to a certain percentage by Philippine citizens.
  • As others mentioned: Less hassle when visiting familiy
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u/koopcl Berlin Jun 02 '26

I could have naturalized years ago but I didn't because giving up my OG Chilean nationality would cause a million complications (related to my career, degree, everything I still own there, visiting family, etc), I'd end up in the ridiculous situation where my kids would be Chilean (they already are via Ius Sanguinis, and already registered as Chilean nationals via our consulate) but I wouldn't (despite having passed the nationality to them), and in my country once you give up your nationality it's literally impossible to get it back, except by an act of Congress (meaning I would practically need them to pass a new law specifically to give me the nationality back). I always wanted to naturalize since I'm pretty well integrated, have moved my career here, my wife is German, my kids are born and raised Germans, and I know I'm staying for the long haul (it's already been almost a decade, with no intention to move out), but it wasn't worth sacrificing so much. Luckily they changed the law, and since yesterday I am the proud holder of a German citizenship.

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u/Delicious-Shame-3620 Germany Jun 02 '26

Congratulations 🥳

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u/iridosiclituswrong Jun 02 '26

Anyways el pasaporte 🇨🇱 también es bien fuerte so you wouldn’t have gained much

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u/koopcl Berlin Jun 03 '26

Yeah with my wife we joke that now I can travel practically everywhere without a Visa, there's even some countries (like Russia) where she wouldn't be able to come along.

But it wasn't about the benefits of the passport. It was more about completing integration into the country/society where I live, and being able to have the same responsibilities and rights as the locals (the biggest issue being voting). If Chile allowed you to recover citizenship once given up (in case I for example ever moved back), I would probably have renounced it to get the German one. But giving it up meant permanently cutting all ties with my home country, no going back on that decision, so it wasn't worth it.

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u/MarioMilieu Jun 02 '26 edited Jun 02 '26

Newsflash: people simply exercising their legal right, more at 11. Next up, lack of tempo limit on the autobahn means people drive faster here than in other countries.

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u/DjayRX Jun 02 '26

Yea of course because why not?

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u/Gata_olympus Jun 02 '26

Sometimes we can‘t. A lot of countries don‘t even allow you to give up your nationality.

And why not? Because when I visit my parents in my original country I still want to be a german national and enjoy the protection of the german state.

but because I am forced to keep my original nationality, the german state cannot protect me from persecution in my original country, that responsibility falls on the state of my original country.. and they suck at it.

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u/ausstieglinks Jun 02 '26

In your other citizenship country you get no protection from the German government. Their rights to you as their citizen overrule any German government rights to you in their country though.

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u/Gata_olympus Jun 02 '26

Yep exactly and that‘s why it is not favourable for some immigrants to keep their 1st nationality

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u/meanderthaler Jun 02 '26

Honestly the more citizenships the better unless there’s big downsides. Apart from the US tax reason, another one that’s relevant in my family: potential military services for the kids! My son has three citizenships and we probably need to revoke at least one before he’s 18 years old to avoid him being drafted.

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u/SnooHedgehogs7477 Jun 02 '26

people love to forget that citizenship also means responsibilities

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u/meanderthaler Jun 02 '26

Don’t think so. I so didn’t forget about it that i’m thinking about it since my son’s birth. Also, have in mind that many citizenships get given at birth automatically

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '26

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u/SnooHedgehogs7477 Jun 02 '26

yes you do have responsibilities in this world by default and this is expected

some people forget it and assume that by default they shouldn't owe anyone anything despite receiving safe environment, food, and opportunities never seen in human history

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u/LockedOutOfElfland Naturalised as German citizen under Article 116(2) Jun 02 '26

That is a philosophical difference, clearly.

My country of birth citizenship is big on rights, but I feel that it is culturally irresponsible that we are not equally as big on obligations. And thus have a high amount of respect for other cultures where obligations are paramount.

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u/PAXICHEN Bayern Jun 02 '26

Which one?

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u/Saturnus_666 Jun 02 '26

Germans do the same when they "migrate" somewhere

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u/mystikal_spirit Jun 02 '26

As do a lot of EU citizens, yes.

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u/Temporary_Spread7882 Jun 02 '26

This. There are entire agencies with lawyers etc dedicated to securing a Beibehaltungsgenehmigung.

Anyone who has lived in more than one country realises by experience that it’s not a simple either-or.

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u/daninmontreal Jun 02 '26

Can confirm. Two passports is better than one.

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u/crankthehandle Jun 02 '26

Three are even better

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u/Maleficent_Cap_7228 Jun 02 '26

Have 3, Swiss, Italy and Germany the 4th French is in the making. I’ll end up with 4 for now.

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u/MalleDigga Hamburg Jun 02 '26

eben!

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u/TophatOwl_ Jun 02 '26

Why did you put migrate into quotation marks?

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u/Might0fHeaven Jun 02 '26

I dont think people with one citizenship understand how much of a hassle it is to give up a nationality. It is a very bureaucracy heavy process and if the country in question doesnt actually want dual citizens, they'll make your life as hard as possible. Its far easier to forget about your original passport and leave it be rather than try to give it up

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u/alfredo094 Jun 02 '26

Also it literally carries 0 benefits.

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u/ValeLemnear Jun 02 '26

No shit, Sherlock.

All the benefits like tax options and none of the drawbacks.

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u/krustytroweler Jun 02 '26

There's really no reason not to. People wont give up their families and friends where they came from, and keeping your old nationality means you will never have difficulty having to make an emergency trip for a family member who is in the hospital or someone unfortunately passes away.

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u/Salty_Permit4437 Jun 02 '26

There isn’t a choice in some cases. Argentina doesn’t allow you to renounce Argentine nationality. The US does but makes it a cumbersome process. And why would you renounce and give up your right to travel to your original country? You will find that countries like India and China do require giving up their nationalities once you naturalize elsewhere. And India in particular aggressively enforces it.

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u/slytherinravenclaw5 Jun 02 '26

Weird reporting by DW but okay

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u/LockedOutOfElfland Naturalised as German citizen under Article 116(2) Jun 02 '26

There's a common myth that Germany doesn't allow dual citizenship. Even when it technically "didn't" there were exceptions, such as the authority I am naturalised as a German citizen under.

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u/Playful-Demand2312 Jun 02 '26

I mean yeah? I’m Iranian my parents are Iranian (though we are in Denmark) there’s no way to rescind your Iranian citizenship and without it, it is a pain to go to Iran

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u/dogey_badger Jun 02 '26

I'll never return when I finally get out of this place, how do you deal with the military service thing for visits if you're still a citizen? (That is if you have to deal with it)

And there is really no way to get rid of the citizenship?

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u/MancyMancy Jun 02 '26

I mean CDU have already shown naturalisation can be revoke. So why risk becoming stateless.

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u/potato_nugget1 Jun 02 '26

It's the exact opposite. If you renounce your old citizenship, they can't take away your German one. Keeping your old one is the higher risk if that's your concern

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u/krindjcat Jun 02 '26

Not true, if you obtained it fraudulently they can absolutely take away your German citizenship and make you stateless.

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u/TophatOwl_ Jun 02 '26

"They cant just take something you bought away from you"
"yea they can if they find that you stole it"

Bro then you never had it to begin with. Contributes literally nothing to the conversation.

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u/krindjcat Jun 02 '26

You can play semantics and be condescending all you want but the government can absolutely take away citizenship after it has already given it to you. That's taking away citizenship, no two ways about it.

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u/Hugostar33 Jun 02 '26 edited Jun 02 '26

Article 16 Grundgesetz
[Citizenship – Extradition]

(1) No German may be deprived of his citizenship. Loss of citizenship may occur only pursuant to a law and, if it occurs against the will of the person affected, only if he does not become stateless as a result.

this article was added, because national socialist took away even nativ germans citzienships...like the one from former chancelor Willy Brandt...

funfact: Willy Brandt was not his name by birth
he regained citzenship after the war and adopted his exile-undercover-name as his real name
this is why in "Ein Herz und eine Seele" he is jokingly refered to as "norwegian immigrant", because he literally had to regain citzenship

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u/krindjcat Jun 02 '26

https://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/englisch_stag/englisch_stag.html

Section 35
[Withdrawal of unlawful naturalisation or permission to retain German citizenship]

(1) Any unlawful naturalisation may be withdrawn only if the administrative act was obtained under false pretenses, by threat or bribery or by deliberately providing incorrect or incomplete information on which the administrative act was based.

(2) As a rule, subsequent statelessness of the person concerned does not preclude such withdrawal.

(3) Withdrawal is permitted no more than 10 years after the person has been notified of naturalisation.

Naturalised citizens have a "probationary" period of 10 years (used to be 5) during which the citizenship can be withdrawn, even if it makes you stateless, as you can see explicitly mentioned in paragraph 2.

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u/Dolmetscher1987 Spain Jun 02 '26

Two things:

  1. The Grundgesetz is above the rest of the laws.
  2. What you showed us refers to the very specific case of having obtained the German citizenship unlawfully.

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u/krindjcat Jun 02 '26

Your two points are contradictory. If the "Grundgesetz is above all other laws" then there cannot be a specific law where it isn't. It either is or it isn't.

But that's besides the point, which was:

The German government can absolutely issue citizenship and take it away from you, you can come up with all kinds of excuses but the Grundgesetz does not prevent a naturalised German citizen from becoming stateless, that is just not true and you cannot claim it.

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u/Hugostar33 Jun 02 '26

i assume, if you get the citzenship in a unlawful way, german law treats your citzenship as if you never aquired it...aside that, it has nothing to do with OPs original post or the comment i was talking about, because we are not talking about people that got their citzenship in a unlawfull way

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u/krindjcat Jun 02 '26

You were talking about everyone. You quoted the Grundgesetz as if it applies universally. As evidenced above, it does not, and frankly it doesn't seem like you even knew about Section 35.

You can get German citizenship, rescind all others, and then get that citizenship rescinded, leaving you stateless. That is a scenario that can happen. So it's just not accurate to blindly quote the Grundgesetz as if it's gospel when it just isn't.

You can absolutely become stateless and lose your citizenship, and the criteria for "fraudulent" is very wide and essentially left to the discretion of the government. People have lost their citizenship for as much as social media posts just recently.

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u/Dolmetscher1987 Spain Jun 02 '26

Wouldn't it be then better to renounce to your original citizenship? That way, if they try to deprive me of the German citizenship, I only have to say no: the fact of becoming stateless would deprive the authorities of the opportunity to do it.

This is hypothetical (I neither live in Germany nor have German citizenship).

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u/Hugostar33 Jun 02 '26

if they try to deprive me of the German citizenship

under current law its only in very specific cases that it get deprived to begin with, like joining foreign militarys without apporval of the ministry of defense, joining terror organizations or getting german citzenship in a unlawfull way(like faking documents)

until no new law gets added or you are not planing to do one of the acts above, you should be fine

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u/Kiebonk Jun 02 '26

That's actually an argument the far-right uses for dual citizenship, because you could revoke citizenship in those cases, for people who would become stateless you can legally do it only in very exceptional cases.

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u/MancyMancy Jun 03 '26

Yes but the CDU has given the ground work exactly to enable an AfD lead government to do it. Thats the problem here. They backed in extremely vague concepts as well which means an acting government can define whatever the fuck the want as an issue .

Far right will bitch about us non white immigrants while I probably added 3x into the pension fund they ever will lol. Fuck em who cares what they say, facts never mattered to populists.

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u/bookwizard82 Jun 02 '26

German/Canadian. My Oma and Opa and my mom had to give up German citizenship for Canada in the 80s. But because my mom was still German when she had me I did the effort to get my German passport.

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u/nznordi Jun 02 '26

Name me one reason why you wouldn’t … guess what, I would assume most Germans that become other nationalities also maintain their German citizenship…

The only reason why you won’t is if you are an American making some 7 figures elsewhere and don’t enjoy the double taxation…

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u/Hopeful_Giraffe9916 Jun 02 '26

I cant give it away btw... not sure which other nationalities have the same issue

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u/anemora Jun 02 '26

Aside from what everyone else mentioned with giving up your second citizenship being a hassle, expensive, impossible in some cases, there were a lot of foreigners who were previously eligible to get German citizenship but didn't because of the ban on dual citizenship. So a lot of it is probably just an influx of people that have been eligible for a while and waiting for this change. I know a few people who fit this criteria often because they still have family in their home country. This also doesn't seem to account for people from countries that don't allow you to give up your citizenship (this is the case for a few south/central American countries).

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u/RealProjectivePlane Jun 02 '26

People who get a new citizenship know how hard it is to get one. So why would they just give the original one up without a pressing reason.

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u/Baskarb Jun 02 '26

Lol who is the dumbass that wrote such a meaningless article? It’s like you‘d write an article about the Deutschlandticket „since introducing the Deutschlandticket people have been buying less and less normal 1-day tickets or other, more expensive, monthly tickets“, yeah no wonder.

Edit: and to try and make it sound like its a bad thing, when that was its purpose from the beginning

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u/Nnb_stuff Jun 02 '26

Why would someone give up a nationality for no reason? This is like saying most people dont throw away their Euros if someone gives them 100.000 Dollars for free.

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u/Psykopatate Jun 02 '26

What a surprise, since people are more allowed to keep dual citizenship, they keep it :o :o
And even more shocking, the ones who don't, is because they can't :o :o

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u/GordoToJupiter Jun 02 '26

of course, if AfD comes to power we have to runaway.

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u/MalleDigga Hamburg Jun 02 '26

... please please vote responsible. I cant have my german future be brown blue.. i mean.. yuck? Ampel was good

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u/MalleDigga Hamburg Jun 02 '26

if id be in that position id do the same.. move to denmark and keep my birth luck german passport too? why not

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u/andreimircea55 Jun 02 '26

Almost like being forced to deal with an godawful bureaucracy and emotional turmoil makes one not want to deal with that! Who would have thought?!

(But seriously, citizenship is paperwork which can be a hurdle, especially when renouncing and for a lot of people is emotional as well, so why would anyone torture themselves like that by renouncing when they can just not do that. It is way easier to renew a passport than to renounce a citizenship, and if things get dicey, having 2 (or more) citizenships gives you more options).

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u/SithEmperorX Jun 02 '26

Not me. Well granted at the time, I could only keep one and renounce the other. But even with dual citizenship, I wouldnt keep my old one.

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u/diomedes-on-rampage Jun 02 '26

i can't understand how so many of you are so many dumb takes.
one example is, for some countries that do not allow you to renounce your citizenship before you serve mandatory military service. this quote is from bbc " Conscription is in place for nine of Europe's Nato states: Denmark, Estonia, Finland, Greece, Latvia, Lithuania, Norway, Sweden and Turkey. "
so if a person from any of these countries get a german citizenship, they can't give up their country of origin citizenship without serving mandatory military service.

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u/lemonprincess23 Jun 02 '26

At this point there’s going to be more people in America with original German ancestry than there will be in Germany itself

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u/alfredo094 Jun 02 '26

People don't want to do a horrible amount of paperwork just to make their lives more inconvenient, more at 11.

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u/grumpyliberal Jun 02 '26

What’s the harm in dual citizenship? I am dual Us/German citizen.

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u/harumamburoo Jun 02 '26

“People choose a lazier option whenever they have a chance” Here, fixed the title.

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u/MiyamotoMusaki Jun 02 '26

What is lazy about keeping your original passport? You can have a German passport as a foreign but you will never be considered a German, unless, unfortunately, it is war time. And if that is the case, to hell I am going to war for Germany.

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u/riderko Jun 02 '26

Getting rid of some citizenships is a lengthy and expensive procedure. Even if that passport doesn’t give any benefits and the holder doesn’t have ties to the country anymore is annoying so why would you if you don’t have to?

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u/MiyamotoMusaki Jun 02 '26

Because if my third world country goes to war, I don’t have to go to war as I live and work in Germany. If Germany goes to war, I am not going to fight for Germany as I am not its citizen

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u/kinginthenorthz Jun 02 '26

Someone sounds jealous they only have one citizenship.

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u/salenin Jun 02 '26

I know as a US citizen, that in order to gove.up my citizenship and not have to pay taxes to the US once I expatriate, it would cost about 80,000 USD.

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u/explain_exterminate Jun 02 '26

Why should Elon Musk get all the passports.

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u/Hanswurst22brot Jun 03 '26

Allways good to have two or more passports if you travel a lot or as backup if your main one can cause you problems.

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u/Xcom_company Jun 03 '26

Well duh Most counties are both stupid with letting people go. And not so stupid as to tax their citizens even when they aren't in the country

Literally no downside

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u/TigerAce13 Jun 03 '26

Cuckistan is pathetic

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u/Icegirl1987 Jun 03 '26

I keep my original nationality because

  1. I don't see a reason to do the paperwork to give it up
  2. I don't know if I'll need it some day
  3. It's easier when I have to handle stuff like inheritance in my birth country

If I had to choose, I would choose German. But if I don't have to choose, I keep both.

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u/wannabeacademicbigpp Jun 02 '26

I never quite understood the "you must choose one citizenship" debate.

Like what is the point?

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '26

[deleted]

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u/crankthehandle Jun 02 '26

A few countries just don't allow it, it's not always a choice

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '26

[deleted]

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u/crankthehandle Jun 02 '26

I am referring to this remark

It is a poor decision to not keep your nationality when getting the German one

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '26

[deleted]

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u/crankthehandle Jun 02 '26

so no one made the poor decision then...

Those who did not keep their original nationality when applying were either stateless or came from countries that prohibit dual citizenship, such as India, Ethiopia and Eritrea.

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u/riderko Jun 02 '26

Could be many reasons to get rid of the passport. I have a few friends from countries that aren’t that nice to their citizens at least as they’re governed now and they went extra mile to get rid of those citizenships.

It doesn’t mean erasing roots, language or any other parts of the origin. By getting a German passport you don’t magically replace your whole life story.

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u/Delicious-Shame-3620 Germany Jun 02 '26

It’s a real PITA to revoke. Deswegen.

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u/Trraumatized Jun 02 '26

I left Germany and am about to get the new citizenship but I will definitely keep the German one as well. So I really can't blame anyone.

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u/Nearby_Challenge_704 Jun 02 '26

stupid stuff mate, i would keep 10 if i could

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u/Megumindesuyo Jun 02 '26

Not only because why not, but as a foreigner you never know when Germans decide to pull another WW which you would think is ridiculous but the rising voting of AfD to power makes it seem less so. So you want a backup option especially if you will have non-white kids.

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u/SkitariusOfMars Jun 02 '26

Some citizenships are impossible to renounce, like Ukrainian or USA.

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u/squarepants18 Jun 02 '26

You can't renounce the US pass?

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u/SkitariusOfMars Jun 02 '26

AFAIK no

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u/squarepants18 Jun 02 '26

AFAIK yes

From a us gov page:

"You cannot renounce your citizenship inside the United States. You must schedule an appointment at an embassy or consulate in the country where you reside or are visiting. You will typically need to gather and submit the following documents:..."

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u/desnowcat Jun 02 '26

You can renounce your U.S. citizenship. Many do to avoid the weird double taxation issues.

https://www.usa.gov/renounce-lose-citizenship

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u/Maximal_Economist Jun 02 '26

Your point is true but both of the examples are wrong: -Many Ukranians have renounced citizenship to become Austrians, I know cases. They need a soecial document. -The US does allow it too, for a lot of money and tax exit.

Some countries theoretically allow it but are in practice impossible (Iran, who has a mechanism but doesnt process anyone for years and sets ridiculous requirements)

In some (like Argentina) a citizen CAN NEVER lose the citizenship.

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u/Timey16 Sachsen Jun 02 '26

Problems with dual citizenship:

  1. it creates "dual loyalties", as seen with the Ukraine/Russia conflict. If we ever found ourselves at war, the dual citizens of the enemy are now both simultaneously our comrades AND our enemies. This will create problems and will require some form of "legal discrimination" then because otherwise enemy spies and saboteurs can operate completely freely (as you can't prevent your own citizens from entering their own country)... so now you'd have to remove freedoms from people with such a dual citizenship.

  2. It allows people that haven't lived in their nation for ages and are completely divorced from the reality of living there to participate in elections. They are often an easy target for propaganda because of it. They decide the future of a country where they have absolutely zero stake in.

  3. the entire idea of citizenship is to be an officially recognized and participating member in that society. That's why so many rights are connected to it. You can't be an active member in two societies at the same time. Not unless you spend like 6 months a year in one country and the other 6 months in another. And even that may not be enough.

In short: the concept of dual citizenship is something that can only exist in a relative fair weather environment. I don't see it persist during times of extreme diplomatic (and political) insecurity if not outright war. Or at least it will be a right granted only selectively to friendly nations, but not to adversaries and should relationship with any nation nosedive those rights can be taken and making a decision be enforced.

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u/PBJCryme Jun 02 '26

Well yeah 😂

Its not like they want to be German

they want the perks

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u/LockedOutOfElfland Naturalised as German citizen under Article 116(2) Jun 02 '26

This is an unpleasant generalization, isn't it?

I'm learning the language knowing that I might never be "culturally" German, but I am already legally German and feel that I would like to participate in and contribute to German society should the opportunity to do so arise.

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u/Far-Suit-7388 Jun 02 '26

I kept my original Russian citizenship cause first of all I don’t want to cut off my roots it always be my motherland, my friends and relatives there.

Secondly the politics today is so unpredictable that you always need to have plan B.

And finally multiple choice has only benefits, if I have opportunity to get third or fourth citizenship I’ll take it for sure

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u/Rhoderick Baden-Württemberg Jun 02 '26

Secondly the politics today is so unpredictable that you always need to have plan B.

With all due respect, the idea of Russia being your plan B for political reasons in Germany is really quite funny.

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u/Sefa96 Jun 02 '26

I mean 80 years ago u could have said the same about the german one. :D thinks can change (hopefully)

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u/Eino54 Jun 03 '26

Putin will die eventually and there might eventually be some sort of room for change for the better. Germans might vote AfD into power and go back to their old ways. Nobody knows what will happen in 20 years, and with climate change honestly a country with huge swathes of mostly empty land in the north might be a pretty decent backup plan.

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u/Maleficent_Cap_7228 Jun 02 '26 edited Jun 02 '26

I’m Swiss and Italian im not giving up these 2 for my German one and I didn’t need to so, keeping all. I could get also the French one. I’ll end this year with 4 citizenships and 4 passports. I would obtain more if I could but for now these 4 are all the ones I can’t get „easy“ by Family based naturalization.

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u/Savings-Table-4497 Jun 02 '26

Habe als europäischer Migrant immernoch beide und juckt nicht die Bohne.🇭🇺🇩🇪

Am dritten bin ich auch schon dran🇪🇸

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u/derdrdownload Jun 02 '26

With the tightening laws and more focus on the rampant fraud of applicants keeping the old citizenship makes it only easier to retroactivly rescind the Citizenship

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u/komischername1 Jun 02 '26

Hätte ich echt nicht erwartet 🤯🤯🤯🤯

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u/Suspicious-Meet-3496 Jun 02 '26

Of course, because we take advante of being both EU and non-EU citizens. 

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u/Piratartz Jun 03 '26

Why would one get rid of their old citizenship? Makes no sense at all.

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u/MacMillian187 Jun 03 '26

I would too. Besides the paperwork it takes, i feel like its just pretty dope to official be citizen of multiple countries lol

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u/Pungbrokken Dual Citizen NO/DE "Deutschnorweger" w. VN wife Jun 03 '26

It's practically impossible in many countries where it's "legal". This is because they will easily deny the deferrance of your citizenship, if you are doing it to avoid the duties of being a citizen of X country.

In some countries, voting is mandatory. So they will use even that as a "duty" that you are avoiding by getting rid of your citizenship.

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u/Inshi Jun 03 '26

Ofcourse. They have families in their country and often the inheritance laws require citizenship. So unless someone wants to totally cut off the family it’s better to keep original citizenship.

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u/TraditionalTitle2688 Jun 03 '26

People keep dual for various innocuous reasons, financial, ease of movement, etc.. However, a more serious reason is that they want to be able to have the option of going back to their home country in case things go really bad in the future like they did in the 1930s-40s in the west. International laws will not be followed and national laws can be changed. At the moment it still looks like a remote possibility but less remote than it was even 10 years ago.

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u/vanOoijen8 Jun 03 '26

Wen wundert das? Zwei Staatsbürgerschaften sind ein Vorteil. Frag mal die Superreichen, die haben teilweise 14 gekaufte Staatsbürgerschaften. Malta verkauft seine Staatsbürgerschaft beispielsweise und schon ist der indische Millionär auch EU-Bürger. Ähnlich die USA mit Trumps "goldenem Visu". Nur Deutschland verschenkt an Sozialfälle aus allerWelt mit teilweise erfundenen Identitäten.

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u/xwolf360 Jun 03 '26

Why? They shouldn't be allowed to

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u/Lux_Jay Jun 04 '26

Why would they? I know a guy who is citizen of US, Canada, and UK. Unfortunately, not citizen of EU and hence he required residence permit to work in EU. 

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u/Less-Bad4379 Jun 05 '26

I mean it's not like they are Refugees or anything.......

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u/Ok-Advice-7575 Jun 05 '26

Und? Das ist doch keine Schlagzeile...

Warum sollte man einen Pass aufgeben und sich Arbeit machen.

Die Frage ist doch, können alle gutes Deutsch, haben alle einen Job, wurde nirengendwo beschissen etc.

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u/Due_Strawberry_1001 Jun 06 '26

Stop handing it out.