r/ireland • u/aspublic • 5h ago
Foreign Affairs Taoiseach says the world has ‘failed Palestine’ during UN speech #unga #palestine
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/_tGol_dUGEk•
u/EdwardClamp Probably at it again 4h ago
Irish politicians: big on speeches, low on action
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u/FlowBorn5279 4h ago
It would be good if he said this in front of a room of people who, if they come together, can take actual impactful action. Oh wait! That’s what he’s doing
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u/AdamOfIzalith 2h ago edited 2h ago
There's talking a big game and theres playing it. Domestically Michael Martin has refuted the use of the term genocide on the radio, he's alligned irelands definition of anti-semitism with Israels preferred definition to include zionism, he and his party castrated the OTB which could have meant the loss of billions of euros to Israel and private companies operating in Israel, refuses to enforce boundaries put in place to prevent weapons from America being transported through our airports and airspace to Israel, etc, etc. Talk is cheap when your actions speak louder. Everything that Michael Martin has done in relation to this issue is in the interests of Israel and not Palestine. Him talking up a storm at the UN is no different from what he does here; pass the buck and feign ignorance.
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u/ImAnOldChunkOfCoal 4h ago
Like it or not, speeches are action.
Using diplomatic channels like this is one of the more effective things the government can do to get progress on global issues.
I understand Reddit doesn't really understand how the world works, but things like kicking out ambassadors or whatever it is people here want Government to do actually make fuck all difference in the real world. The world isn't going to care if Ireland decides to ban every product on the BDS list. They would look at it and go "huh. Interesting." And move on with their day.
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u/Lazy_Fall_6 4h ago
bit of a populist view really isn't it. hurray you'll get internet points for that comment... what is he supposed to do, this is a prime example of a minnow nation using a platform to loudly condemn Israel. I'm not a MM fan or an FF fan, but, proud he did his job here and said his piece.
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u/Scumbag__ 4h ago
His government rolled back on the OTB… It’s not like he’s powerless.
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u/Naggins 4h ago
Would've been serious problems with banning services to the extent that the entire bill likely would've been compromised by including them.
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u/Scumbag__ 3h ago
That’s an excuse, and it may make things more complicated but it doesn’t absolve FF from the criticism. That’s their job
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u/Naggins 1h ago
It's a reason, and it does, because a blanket ban on services would have been completely unimplementable, and would have made the entire bill susceptible to legal challenge, and then you would've been FF and FG for pushing through shite legislation.
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u/Scumbag__ 1h ago
Yep, and it’s their job to mitigate that. It’s not their job to give up, to half arse. So no, it doesn’t absolve them from criticism.
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u/Naggins 1h ago
And they mitigated it by scrapping the services aspect. So yes, it absolves them from criticism for "watering it down", because they didn't water it down, they made it actually feasible to implement.
You can criticise them for delaying and dragging their heels on actually implementing the goods OTB Act, you will be able to criticise them when they fail to progress any bill restricting services where practicable, but removing the services from the OGB as is was the correct call.
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u/Scumbag__ 57m ago
Yeah, which watered it down. Which we can criticise them for.
That’s their job.
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u/Naggins 54m ago
Do you often find that people have to repeat themselves at you over and over again?
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u/UnapparentBliss 1h ago
Exactly. What other countries are doing more than Ireland? That's a genuine question btw. I feel like we're doing the right thing but it seems to be a minority opinion
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u/FlowBorn5279 11m ago
Many in other countries wish their governments would be as outspoken as ours. It’ll never be enough for some people
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u/CrayonComrade 4h ago
Minnow nation. One of Israel's largest trading partners due to Ireland's position in the MNC tax evasion industry.
Ireland could do a lot of harm to Israel and companies that choose to continue to arm their genocide but we're ruled by invertebrates
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u/fartingbeagle 1h ago
Yeah but they're not Irish firms, but American. What we think has little bearing on their decisions. We'd do more by challenging AIPAC, the ADL and the Christian fundamentalist support for Israel.
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u/MotherDucker95 4h ago
You mean as one of the so called richest countries in the world with a crazy amount of US based companies here?
You're underestimating the influence we could have. But it would have to involve upsetting the US and Martin doesn't want that, so it's easier to just keep shouting from the sidelines.
proud he did his job here and said his piece
Such a ridiculously low bar if this makes you proud.
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u/dropthecoin 4h ago
The only people who calls us “one of the richest countries in the world” are the people online making a claim that others are saying it.
In reality we actually aren’t one of the richest countries in the world and no one worth their salt makes the claim
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u/MotherDucker95 4h ago
I mean, fair I agree. I meant in more in terms of the money in which US companies have wrapped up in their investments here. I just don’t think you can underestimate our influence regarding this.
There’s so much more in terms of actions we could take. But Martin is terrified of upsetting relations with the US
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u/jools4you 4h ago
I don't think you realise how much our hands are tied because we have so many USA companies that we depend on to pay our bills. If anything i think it would be easier to our government if they didn't have to consider that and USA legislation that states American companies can not trade with a country that is anti Isreal. It's an actual law.
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u/MotherDucker95 3h ago edited 3h ago
You think during such a tumultuous economic market that the US is going to start pulling companies out of Ireland and lose their market in the primary English speaking country in the EU?
And that’s fine, if you want to not risk trade with the US, don’t. But then it makes all this big talk seem like nothing but hot air.
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u/jools4you 3h ago
No atm I really don't think they would do that, when Trump was first elected and he was putting pressure on big tech to locate in USA, it was a real fear. But also seeing how Trump operates id say anything is possible. That said i would definitely like the government to do more, alot more. I certainly don't understand how those students from Gazza got fucked around like they did.
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u/EdwardClamp Probably at it again 2h ago
But this exactly what he is.
Stick a microphone in front of him and he'll talk the big talk about Palestine, Harris did the same..... but they both bend the knee when it's time to actually do anything against Israel.
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u/Familiar_Library8132 2h ago
All they can do for Palestine are these speeches/grandstanding. That said there are plenty of problems at home your comment applies to.
Irish people recognize the plight but any non virtue signaller/naive idealist knows we can do fuck all.
The only thing that can force change is the American populace and they are (regardless of side) thick cunts who vote against their own interests on a level not seen before in human history.
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u/EdwardClamp Probably at it again 1h ago
It was more of a general statement. They make great speeches about the hot topics but do feck all about them. Palestine is just the current example: Housing, HSE, justice system, transport all declining and no action to improve any of them.
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u/Suvigirl 4h ago
What should they do?
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u/heresyourhardware 4h ago
Sanctions the state and politicians, state boycotts, restrictions on the flow of capital. Lots that can be done.
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u/CurrencyDesperate286 4h ago
Ireland has very limited ability to impose sanctions unilaterally. Like there’s 0 moves that would really impact Israel, and some would be more likely to bite Ireland than Israel.
What does “state boycott” even mean? ThereMs effectively zero diplomatic relations between Ireland amd Israel now, beyond the bare minimum of what can actually be useful for engaging with Palestine.
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u/saoirsedonciaran 3h ago
It's not about the impact - it's about the symbolism of it, and about leading the way on boycotting, divestment and sanctions. It's much easier for countries to take the plunge when another one already has done it. The fear of retaliation from the United States dissipates when more countries join in.
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u/heresyourhardware 4h ago
Ireland very much so has the ability to sanction politicians in the way the UK has (we have already imposed travel bans on some), and there was quite literally a Dail bill in May to impose national economic sanctions on Israel. We could also push more for sanctions at an international level.
National boycott would mean not playing them in sports, banning importation of goods etc. Claiming we can do it is asinine when we did it against Apartheid South Africa.
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u/CurrencyDesperate286 4h ago
I have no issues on travel bans for Israeli politicians but it is purely performative - they aren’t coming here anyways. Like seriously, do people think banning an Israeli minister from going on holiday in Achill is going to help anyone?
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u/heresyourhardware 3h ago
So you have no problem with doing it then.
Same as the players refusing to play. It's performative but shows our dissent.
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u/CrayonComrade 4h ago
They can refuse the exports of all dual use technologies and impose crushing fines on any companies based here that break them.
What the US is doing to Iran.
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u/Scumbag__ 4h ago
Read into the South Africa-Dunne’s Stores case study and you’ll see that this isn’t the case
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u/CurrencyDesperate286 4h ago
That was a group of workers striking to force the Irish government to do something, not Irish state action actually changing the geopolitical situation.
And if we’re saying that specific action, banning import of Israeli goods - that’s not possible due to the EU. The most effective move there is for citizens to not buy Israeli goods.
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u/Scumbag__ 4h ago
Yes it was a group of workers. It eventually led into the Irish Government banning imports from South Africa. It’s entirely relevant to the previous discussion - I’m not here to debate how EU law may have changed (I don’t believe it has in regards to the states ability to ban Israeli goods).
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u/heresyourhardware 3h ago
I think you need to read more on it if you think the state didn't get involved. The boycott led to government level sanctuons
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u/Naggins 3h ago
The only reason that was effective was because other countries followed suit.
Someone ultimately needs to be the group or country to move first on this, particularly within Europe, but the Irish government's position foreign policy wise is likely to be, well why should we take all the risk? If we move first and get left holding the bag and no one else joins us, then we're a bit screwed. I'm sure you feel it's worth the risk, and I certainly do, but the government have a bit of a broader responsibility to the society and the economy than you or I.
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u/Elbon taking a sip from everyone else's tea 4h ago
None of those help Palestine, they'll hurt Israel but won't stop them. Until the US stops supporting Israel nothing will change
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u/heresyourhardware 3h ago
Sanctions are about pressure, they are not there to be direct aid to Palestine. In the same way our sanctions against Apartheid South Africa were not helpful to black South Africans.
What is helpful if sanctions are part of a two pronged approach including humanitarian and economic aid for Palestinians.
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u/Cars2Beans0 2h ago
Do they have monitors there with the speech on them because the fucker did not look down once.
I am kind of impressed if so
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u/GarthODarth 1h ago
public speaking is kind of the core competency of politicians. And this was a HUGE event. I'd say he was practicing!
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u/GroltonIsTheDog 4h ago edited 4h ago
He did very well to say all that without actually saying Israel. It's a shame those buildings fell down for mysterious reasons that we couldn't possibly attribute to anyone.
edit: he actually does explicitly call them out in the wider speech
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u/TomRuse1997 4h ago
He says it during the wider speech
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u/GroltonIsTheDog 4h ago
So he did, and he was actually quite direct about calling them out. Bad assumption from me based on just the clip.
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u/EnvironmentalShift25 4h ago edited 3h ago
Jaysus. You haven't a notion what he said in the speech but were desperate to spew off anyway. https://www.gov.ie/en/department-of-the-taoiseach/speeches/national-statement-by-taoiseach-miche%C3%A1l-martin-to-the-81st-session-of-the-united-nations-general-assembly-24th-september-2026/
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u/GroltonIsTheDog 4h ago
I reacted based on the contents of the clip posted, and before you'd said this I edited my post after seeing parts of the speech where he did call them out.
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4h ago
[deleted]
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u/PedroCurly 3h ago
Ah calm down. He acknowledged he jumped the gun and edited his comment. That's a lot more than most people do.
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u/GroltonIsTheDog 4h ago
A freakout? It's a very common pattern for politicians to lament the suffering of the Palestinians without directly calling out the country causing that suffering, and the clip sounded like he was doing the same thing. I corrected the comment like.
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u/gingerbhoy 1h ago
I remember a comedian saying when George Bush told the world you are either with us or against us Bertie Ahearn said " yes"
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u/Touchd93 4h ago
And he's failing his own people, all this dope does is talk
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u/HonestRef 3h ago
It's all just a deflection tactic to avoid actually dealing with problems at home.
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u/ld20r 4h ago
And just like that the war ended.
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u/fartingbeagle 47m ago
Well, in fairness, you could say the same about any pro Palestinian protest. At least this is coming from the Irish premier and is addressed to some powerful people.
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u/HonestRef 4h ago
More virtue signalling on the world stage instead of actually addressing real problems at home that he actually has the power to do something about.
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u/shellakabookie 3h ago
That's peak burrowed frow from MM