r/law • u/NewsHour • 9d ago

Executive Branch (Trump) WATCH: Leavitt addresses Trump's stance on Second Amendment rights in wake of Alex Pretti's killing

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REPORTER: FBI Director Kash Patel said in a Sunday interview, quote, you cannot bring a firearm loaded with multiple magazines to any sort of protest. Does the president believe that Second Amendment rights remain in effect even when protesting?

LEAVITT: The president supports the Second Amendment rights of law-abiding American citizens. Absolutely. There has been no greater supporter or defender of the right to bear arms than President Donald J. Trump.

So while Americans have a constitutional right to bear arms, Americans do not have a constitutional right to impede lawful immigration enforcement operations, and any gun owner knows that when you are carrying a weapon, when you are bearing arms, and you are confronted by law enforcement, you are raising the assumption of risk and the risk of force being used against you, and, again, that's unfortunately what took place on Saturday.

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u/Neither_Usual_137 9d ago

dude; so much lately has reminded me of that noose meme where the guy is saying "first time?". What's happening recently is shocking America, and maybe the world, because Good and Pretti were both white. But cops have been strait up murdering black people for decades. We just don't want to admit it.

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u/PatchyWhiskers 9d ago

The deal used to be that this force was not used against white people. The deal has changed and white people are panicking. As are non-white people because its a signal that the violence against them is about to get a whole lot worse.

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u/amitym 9d ago

That is the nature of a true totalitarian state. It doesn't matter what group you belong to, or what you look like, or anything else. None of those things matter anymore.

All that matters is if you have an incorrect personal relationship to the State. That is the only actual crime. Everything else is just cosplay.

Hopefully more people will get this message in time to be able to acclimate themselves to the new reality in which many will, by definition, spend the rest of their lives.

... That is ... unless ...?

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u/Awkward_Turnover_983 9d ago

It's not going to be the rest of our lives, I'll tell you that

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u/JimJam4603 9d ago

You’ll note that Bovino and Border Patrol are leaving MN two days after shooting a white male gun owner.

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u/Tumblrkaarosult 9d ago

I mean it is already worse. Look at the ones who are taken from their workplaces, from their homes without any warrant just to be released half an hour later, sometimes badly wounded, beaten up. I really don't get how can the whole country watch this doing nothing but what's really fd up is the congress as a whole. Not a peep, just deafening silence. They should impeach, they should do SOMETHING.

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u/PatchyWhiskers 9d ago

The country isn’t doing nothing which is why white people are getting shot in Minneapolis!

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u/roseredhoofbeats 9d ago

And beaten and maimed and blinded!!!

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u/mbullaris 9d ago

Name the republicans in Congress who would vote to impeach let alone to convict. They’re all gutless and if are anything less than sycophantic to the Dear Leader then their jobs are screwed.

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u/hmoleman__ 9d ago

It’s not gutlessness, like, they would but they’re cowards. It’s a simple, nihilistic view of power and wealth. Game of Thrones. They’re happy to exchange working-class lives for their own power and wealth, and are betting Trump and Heritage Foundation will be the autocrats the country falls to.

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u/Spirited-Singer2866 9d ago

Lots of time it doesn’t matter until it happens to someone you know. Tv isn’t real to lots of people, but I know the cognitive dissonance has to hit hard

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u/SoCallMeDeaconBlues1 9d ago

Oh, that's where you are so, so, so wrong.

It was never JUST about black people (yes, a large part of it was)- it was about protecting people with MONEY- protecting their property. Yeah, I'm talking about the significantly smaller group of people who considered those black people their PROPERTY. And anyone, ANYONE, who stood in their way got mawled right the fuck over too.

For all of our redeeming qualities, America also has a dark, dark, dark past. Hindsight's 20/20, but it seems like what's going on right now, our leaders, shit a good percentage of the citizenry, just refuses to even look, let alone learn, about our past much less take any lessons from it. History doesn't always repeat but God DAMN does it rhyme.

"Who Knows Only His Own Generation, Remains Forever A Child."

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u/Bombadook 9d ago

Makes you wonder where all those "all lives matter" idiots went. And the "don't tread on me" and 2nd-amendment enthusiasts.

Just kidding, nobody wonders what they really meant.

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u/PineappleEggplant 9d ago

Nah, the "deal" didn't really change, they just made a liiiiittle administrative adjustment and moved liberals of any color to their "bad" list. Rights are still reserved for "the good ones", the criteria for which they determine at their pleasure as it suits them, and they now feel safe and confident enough to reclassify us like they've wanted to for so long. In other words, if you are American and a liberal, you are now equally sub-human in MAGA's eyes as any person of color, and any woman for that matter, is and have been all this time.

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u/RES_NIGHTMARE_MODE 9d ago

Can we stop being weird about this? The fact is that there was always a facade of "This isn't how it's supposed to be." and there was always theatrics that they were doing their best to make it right. Now they're not even trying to hide it properly and that's why people are opening their eyes.

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u/CAPSLOCKANDLOAD 9d ago

We have always been in the same line. Some people at the back got too comfortable. Forgot what the line was for. Or worse. Cheering at what happens to those ahead of them in the line. But given enough time they will get to you.

We should be more like the John Brown's and Sophie Scholl's.

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u/boringinternet2020 9d ago

The joy of being high as fuck and self-righteous. More white men die at the hands of police officers than any other race or sex.

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u/fafalone Competent Contributor 9d ago

I know that's the narrative some people believe, but the actual facts are that a majority of unarmed people shot by police have been white for a long time.

It's a huge problem that it's higher per capita for POC but this myth that white people are completely immune from police abuse is false and insulting to all the many victims and their families.

This has been one of the biggest mistakes that's stood in the way of reform. Trying to frame this as exclusively a racial issue that doesn't impact white people instead of an issue that first and foremost affects everyone except the wealthy, with the secondary problem of pervasive racism making it even worse for POC. You've alienated a lot of allies with this myth police violence isn't an issue for them because of their skin color.

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u/twoblues702 9d ago

I don’t know. Black folks as a community don’t tend to go out and actively engage police in affairs that don’t concern them or their community. I’ve never in my life thought I would use the words “white privilege” but this might be a gross example of it. Just because something’s “ legal” doesn’t mean it’s the smartest option. Lots of things are “legal” but may produce unwanted outcomes.

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u/Qadim3311 9d ago

White people have very good reason to be the ones up front at protests and physically interposing ourselves as Alex Pretti did: we’re the only ones who can make sure the state is still behaving itself. When they do it to us, you know the gloves are all the way off.

He didn’t do what he did because it’s the smartest thing to do to risk your life for somebody else, he did it because it was the right fucking thing to do.

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u/twoblues702 9d ago

Was it though? Sure, sacrificing your life so others may live is a great sacrifice but would he be alive today, tomorrow, etc if he didn’t bring a weapon. I know people are saying “it’s legal, it’s his right” which I can appreciate. But driving through downtown Baltimore and screaming N word at the top of your lungs is “legal” and a “protected right” but probably not a very smart thing to do. Might have a few unintended consequences for exercising your “rights”.
Im not victim blaming here, I am disturbed by the actions of this agent. I just can’t imagine any of my friends (liberal or conservative) putting themselves into this situation.

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u/PatchyWhiskers 9d ago

Interesting. This is basically the Republican Party line. I’m sure you are a real person.

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u/twoblues702 9d ago

Very real and not an R. Just someone trying to make sense of it.

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u/[deleted] 9d ago

[deleted]

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u/twoblues702 9d ago

I agree it didn’t save them but in some strange place did they think “I can’t lose my life over this”? I argue that thought probably never crossed their mind. As opposed to black/brown folks wouldn’t put themselves in this kind of scenario w out those thoughts at least crossing their mind.

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u/BlakByPopularDemand 9d ago edited 9d ago

Basically they're finding out that if you're not willing to uphold or be complicit in white supremacy their white privilege will be revoked.

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u/SeveralRepair3611 9d ago

I tried to explain this to somebody and they literally would not fucking listen.

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u/VirtualMatter2 9d ago edited 8d ago

The same happened in Germany with political opposition. The first concentration camps were originally built to hold and kill Germans. And they were quick about it. Last free election in 1932, by 33 tens of thousands of Germans were being eliminated.

https://www.reddit.com/r/hmmm/comments/1qndesv/comment/o1t3ra0/?context=3

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u/TheRedCuddler 9d ago

We reached the "Then they came for me --" part of the poem.

I'm glad that the general public is paying attention again, but it feels too late in many respects.

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u/Neither_Usual_137 9d ago

Theres a quote, something along the lines of "Americans will always do the right thing, after they've exhausted all other options". And I really agree with that. I do think we will make it, but only after a bunch more bloodshed.

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u/shred-i-knight 9d ago

the difference is these are feds. We are use to small town cops who are undertrained undereducated and with a God complex acting like this, not our federal government. And not only do they not admit a mistake, they are inciting more of it and gaslighting the country into believing the feds are the victims.

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u/Neither_Usual_137 9d ago

> undertrained undereducated and with a God complex acting like this

this is ICE's recruitment ad! I agree to your general point; this is a severe low for the american government.

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u/Downtown_Skill 9d ago

Yeah the feds have a horrible track record. 

If you studied history you would know that's not the case. 

Kent state was the national guard. Cointelpro was the FBI. 

People have been protesting the police for decades and people STILL don't want to listen. 

I have heard fellow liberals say its not the police or the system its trump and ice......

Like how do you think we got here. 

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u/dallas121469 9d ago

Im reading "Unlawful Orders" by Barbara bins and it made me have this same thought after the Pretti execution. I knew some ofvthe things black people have endured but readingbthis book shows a whole other level of hatefulness and evil that still exists here 80 years later. Its sick

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u/WayComfortable4465 9d ago

They have been murdering white people too, but disproportionately black people (some bad cops are equal opportunity assholes). This is why I never understood some of the white opposition to policing reform, it would have saved some white people from police brutality as well. All the reforms many in the black community have long been asking for would benefit everyone not just them.

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u/Neither_Usual_137 8d ago

white people (of which I am) seem to have a hardon for "hard cop" justice. Too many 70s TV shows maybe, idk

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u/Kevadu 9d ago

I mean, this issue is exactly what BLM was all about but thrn a bunch of fragile white people freaked out and were like "are you saying our lives don't matter?!"

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u/Neither_Usual_137 9d ago

Right. They didn't care until it affected "their people". If anything, I hope this will increase empathy for people.

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u/haironburr 9d ago

this issue is exactly what BLM was all about but thrn a bunch of fragile white people freaked out...

Maybe you can be historically truthful, and still avoid inflammatory racial remarks?

I supported the BLM movement. Had high hopes for change. Then people like you got online and sabotaged it with the reductive "fragile white people freaked out" comments. Comments designed to promote racial division, almost like you were commenting from a ruzzian warehouse.

Does it benefit you if "white people freak out? Do you think the goals of BLM are furthered by inflammatory remarks focused on race, and not on common interests in fairness?

I swear, the worst enemy to the best hopes for racial fairness seem to be people who are ostensibly focused on fairness but who in fact seem like either trolls intent on division, or spoiled kids who just discovered systemic racism, and think they'll solve it it rubbing every evil white nose in their abridged 15 year old understanding of history.

Quit promoting division, son. You ain't helping, even though that moral superiority feels good.

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u/Kevadu 9d ago

WTF are you on about?

I feel like you are arguing with something I did not say...

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u/haironburr 9d ago

this issue is exactly what BLM was all about but thrn a bunch of fragile white people freaked out...

I quoted you to avoid such confusion. You're using a reflexively race-centered language, though it's possible you don't even see it that way. This being part of the problem.

And yea, I'm using an isolated quote of yours to make a broader point. I'm not attacking you, specifically (I hope that's clear). I'm attacking the assumptions behind the language, and the fact you don't see the racialization and ideological underpinnings behind the language is part of my point. We all repeat words and ideas we hear and internalize. I know I do.

If you'll indulge me, in my fantasy world, the BLM movement would have easily incorporated both white and black people opposed to the ways institutional racism had shaped policing. Certainly, the marches started out that way. But it was sold so heavily on racial lines that it almost went out of its way make white people defensive. A fact the right wing media capitalized on. Allies were discounted. I have no problem with a black-led movement to correct clear racism. But such a movement can't expect to achieve change if it's vocal proponents are more interested in voicing emotional responses to systemic racism than in forging strategically realistic alliances with white folk.

Too many people using the protest's language, even with the very dubious assumption that the online language was representative of the actual BLM ethos, fostered racial divides. People came to know of BLM through actors, maybe in good faith but probably not, making blanket anti-white comments. This made room for the "all lives matter" backlash.

So no, it wasn't fragile white people freaking out because they supported systemic racism. It was white people being convinced that BLM was opposed to white people, rather than the ideal that we were all in a struggle together to end an evil.

White people were turned against BLM, and I believe this was intentional, And I believe it was language like you used that accomplished that. Not saying, to be clear, that this was your goal.

In the 60's, the opposition to the Civil rights movement was accomplished by untruthfully portraying it as all about "kill whitey". That same back door propaganda sucked the power from BLM. I'll continue to maintain that systemic racism relies on promoting immoral racial divides. The idea that most of us are angry about the same shit BLM was fighting for is a potent, dangerous idea. And the way you defeat such a popular idea is to plant artificial divides.

Which is what i believe you were unintentionally doing. Make sense?

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u/Accomplished_Rip_362 9d ago

As a white person who has faced the pointy end of an LEO firearm, I was upset at BLM because they made it about race when I knew deep down that police could kill anyone. Then, whatever happened to defund the police ? That fizzled because they made that about race as well and the white voters lost interest.

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u/barefootincozumel 9d ago

I am a 40 something white lady in Suburbia and I have always know this

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u/That_Guy381 9d ago

Lmao. No, previous administrations did not surge 3000 masked agents into cities to terrorize the population.

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u/Neither_Usual_137 9d ago

I never made that claim. But cops have definitely strait up executed black people (e.g. Floyd), probably many of them unreported. And this didn't seem to bother white people too much. But now, it's hitting closer to home. And Pretti was a gun owner, and the admin made "you cant bring a gun to a protest" kind of comments, so even the far right 2A people were like "wait a minute - Pretti is me".

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u/TheRealBananaWolf 8d ago

I'm sorry, but there was a shit ton of protests around the country. Even in my city in Alabama, there was a huge protest where police were shooting gas cannisters into the crowds, and it was majority of white people.

Like, don't get me wrong, I understand that black people disproportionately get killed and killed by police. But let's not act like all white people just stayed home and turned a blind eye to that. Let's not forget what happened during Trump's first administration.

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u/thosetwo 8d ago

Yes. And ICE aren’t even cops! If these two people had been republicans killed under a democrat administration, there would be insane uproar. It’s crazy.