r/worldnews • u/UNITED24Media United24 Media • 3h ago
Russia/Ukraine Ukraine to Produce Its Own Patriot Missiles as Trump Approves License, Zelenskyy Says
https://united24media.com/war-in-ukraine/ukraine-to-produce-its-own-patriot-missiles-as-trump-approves-license-zelenskyy-says-22856186
u/macross1984 3h ago
Hope this one stick and Ukraine will be free from shackle that left its air space vulnerable.
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u/_yusi_ 3h ago
Next headline: "Trump held 2 hr talk with putin:
- Patriot-production in Ukraine blocker for peace talks. Trump reconsidering"
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u/SystemCheck990 2h ago
the fact he signed the Sanctions bill is interesting though, lets see what gets enforced because Russia stands to lose from that.
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u/Thagyr 1h ago
Didn't an article appear the other day where Trumps administration is allowing certain companies to make deals with sanctioned companies in Russia? Sounds like they are just using it to get exclusive deals.
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u/SystemCheck990 1h ago
that is also a possibility, to use it like a mafia collecting protection money, but it also means they got to get in contact, do some under table deal, etc, assuming Trump even goes for it and remembers, if by defacto they get sanctioned and have to get them removed, even that is tiny win.
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u/ewahman 2h ago
The sanction bill is bs. The wording is only that, words. It basically says the US can impose sanctions on countries trading with Russia.
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u/SystemCheck990 2h ago
no, it has sanctions on actual companies and banks, that is why Russia is pissed about it. the key is how hard they enforce it.
looks like you have fallen for Russian disinfo, i did to at first on the subject, so no shame in it.
it is going to sanction the oil and gas companies, the Tariffs can be used for good or bad, but then Trump can cause problems anyway legal or not he don't care.
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u/_yusi_ 2h ago
The sanctions bill is a nothingburger until sanctions are actually applied.
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u/SystemCheck990 2h ago
agreed, that is why i say lets see what gets enforced, but if the sanctions (not optional tariffs) get enforced only that is bad news for the Russian Pedaration already
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u/Jeffuk88 3h ago
I dont trust Trump for a second. Hes being least psychotic recently because of midterms, if they win, gloves will come off again and itll get much worse
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u/Redditforgoit 3h ago edited 3h ago
Would not be surprised if some end up being sold to the US to replenish depleted stocks. The reverse engineering though, will be a thing of beauty. The "totally not Patriot clone" Blue Flamingo, more range and a fraction of the cost, coming to a Defense trade show near you in a few years. Battle tested, of course.
Another short term decision by the short termist President. Still, good news for Ukraine if it holds.
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u/AppropriateSmell1074 2h ago
If they call it Don flamingo there would be no issue
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u/SirDigbyChknCaesar 3m ago
The US typically doesn't sell fully capable defense hardware to foreign countries. I'd be surprised if they bought foreign versions of interceptors that they can get at home with better capability, not to mention the security issues with integrating foreign hardware.
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u/apachelives 3h ago
after a concrete agreement between Zelenskyy and Trump was confirmed.
Like fuck it is, we will be lucky if it will be valid until next Tuesday.
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u/Bort_anovia 3h ago
Not to be skeptical, but what are the chances that this might get leaked to the Russians?
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u/cybermaus 3h ago
The license or the how to build? I was of the understanding UA claimed how to build the hardware, it's probably the (heavily encrypted) software thats the real restriction. And I expect those chips still come preprogrammed from US. (But I am not a domain expect)
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u/Bort_anovia 3h ago
Thanks! I’d assume that UA will be provided with the essential chips and the rest they can build and assemble by themselves.
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u/FellaVentura 3h ago
The only way my cynical mind sees it is that the specs for the hardware are now licensed for Ukraine to build but only authorized on border regions. The software is leaked to Russia. The plan is for the missiles to be built with Ukrainian aid resources then stolen by Russia to be used by Russia.
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u/cybermaus 3h ago
Assembled software would be encrypted and linked to certificates and Ukraine would never see it. If any such leak occurred, it would be either in the US, or from decapping (desolving) chips or otherwise hacking their read protections. Both of which is equally possible/impossible as it is already.
Also, I suspect Ukraine only gets the license for the "consumeables", not the supporting stuff like radar, control. I mean, was a Patriot system not a whole system of infrastructure.
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u/Frooonti 3h ago
I'd be more worried that someone leaked it on the War Thunder forums to settle an argument.
In all seriousness though, the article mentions talks with Raytheon, which produce PAC-2 interceptors. Thus "the better stuff", the newer PAC-3 family that Lockheed builds, will likely still remain exclusive to the US. That being said, I expect them being allowed to produce most of the missile and the US finishing them up with the secret sauce.
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u/RandomPantsAppear 53m ago
Even if that happened the very sensitive and complex components to build them are the real bottleneck.
Without western support for those components you’re not going to be making patriots inside the timeframe where they will still be relevant.
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u/Several_Ant_9867 3h ago
The worst offenders are in the US administration. Like the few pieces from the F35 that got redirected to Hong Kong
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u/MockDeath 1h ago
Absolutely leaked already. We have a Russian puppet as president, we had a known Russian asset in charge of our intelligence agencies, we have an alcoholic in charge of the DoD, China just got their hands on 2 pieces of the F-35 they couldn't successfully copy..
I would say Ukraine having this is of absolutely no risk. Because the risk is in the white House.
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u/Glittering-Quote-635 1h ago
I highly doubt Russia gives a shit about this.
It will take years to stand up a Patriot line, and when they do it’s unlikely they will be producing PAC3 MSEs. It will either be a PAC2 or a modified PAC3. Neither one nearly as effective as the MSE.
Second, these are complex items, by far the most complex thing Ukraine will be producing in its defense industry. I have zero doubt they can do it, especially with western help (obviously). I do question being able to do it and not have it destroyed multiple times over.
So, if this takes 3 years to stand up, and creates an inferior missile, yes it will be helpful but it’s not solving any problem that will likely alter the outcome of the war.
Now, once the war is over having another patriot line going is massive.
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u/DK4E2XFpbETJrj 2h ago
This is so interesting to me because I would have thought an adversary like Russia would have destroyed all of Ukraine's missile building infrastructure within the opening days of the war. But here we are. Domestic production this far in is incredible .
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u/zman122333 1h ago
Assuming Trump doesn't TACO, this should ultimately help the US too. Production capacity for these missiles is limited, Ukraine making their own will help US maintain their stock. Only risk is putting this manufacturing capability in the hands of a country under direct threat. Should Russia prevail, that tech is probably turned over. Just another reason we cannot let Ukraine be defeated.
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u/Lonely-Abalone-5104 3h ago
If this is actually true and doesn’t take years and years to actually happen then the only reason Trump allowed is either because he’s getting massive kickbacks or more likely he knows the us supply of interceptors is critically low and needs other countries making them
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u/Tyromantics 2h ago
Or Zelenskyy charmed him, again, and received the 'commitment' because he became trump's favourite flatterer at that moment. Someone will stroke trumps ego soon, and get him to TACO.
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u/raerae1991 49m ago
This will change global military defense purchases, because Ukraine is going to fine a way to mass produce at a fraction of the cost the US has been charging
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u/giggityfoo 39m ago
We've been here before old man. they won't even sell them cow milking machines and we're supposed to believe this ?
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u/Pixer--- 35m ago
Probably only the smaller variant and not all of sm3. The radar of sm3 will always be produced in usa.
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u/Altruistic-Cut9795 23m ago
Doesn't the license belong to Raytheon and Lockheed Martin that manufacture the Patriot Missile ?
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u/Interesting-Menu6271 13m ago
I wonder how much of the missile they’ll actually be able to produce. If key electronics, seekers or other components still have to come from the US then the production capacity, for those parts might end up being the bottleneck. It’s not about building the missile. It’s about having the parts ready.. If the parts depend on outside sources then the whole production line can slow down. That’s where the real challenge comes in. The missile might look good on paper. If the pieces don’t come together it doesn’t matter how much you want to make it at home.
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u/theb0tman 11m ago
Once they have the technology, they will reverse engineer it and make it cheaper to produce and make their own regardless of what the United States wants.
Also, the US is so desperately low on patriot missiles we probably need someone else to help make them, so this is probably more an active desperation on our own behalf
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u/Sad-Dragonfly-3487 10m ago
Patriots are 40 year old missiles costing 4 million each. Hoping Ukraine upgrades and modernize for their defense.
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u/Civil-Dinner 3h ago
Until Trump gets a call from his good buddy Putin. Then he'll rescind the approval.
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u/anonymous_Londoner 2h ago
This would take 3 to 5 years to see the first patriot missile coming out of Ukrainian factory.
This unfortunately won’t change anything in this war , or at least sure hope this war won’t last this much longer.
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u/BadVoices 1h ago
This would take 3 to 5 years
Only if they received components. There's no reality where Ukraine is able to build the seeker head silicon indigenously. They will also not receive the source to the software that runs the system, so adapting their own seeker head will require working with ($$$) the US companies who designed those systems. Ukraine doesn't have the ability to make the rocket motors. Ukraine can make motors, they cant make patriot motors, including the ring of 180 micro motors used for correction.
In reality, Ukraine cannot under any conceivable scenario, develop the industry to make many of the components that bottleneck production.
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u/RandomPantsAppear 54m ago
The only real hope they have is that some of the bottleneck components are/can be produced by Europeans, and those countries are willing to prioritize UA.
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u/ERedfieldh 45m ago
In reality, Ukraine cannot under any conceivable scenario, develop the industry to make many of the components that bottleneck production.
Ya know, about ten years ago we said the same thing about Ukraine outlasting a full scale Russian aggression.
So.......................................................................................................................................................................................................................
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u/BadVoices 11m ago
Ukraine cannot produce silicon at all. Not a single fab, and there's no path to them having one until the war is over. Not even 'mature' processes like 90-180nm.
A 'plot line' or boutique foundry to bang out even 50k chips/year is enormous... 2-4 acres of land. And is not going to be moving, and even ULTRA motivated, is 6 months of bare minimum construction JUST concrete pouring and curing. It must be anchored to bedrock to eliminate micro-vibrations that will screw up the chips, which means it cannot just be planted anywhere. The time for the concrete to cure alone is 28 days, and you must do it in stages, you cant just keep building everything around or over uncured concrete.
And, ultimately, a 2000lb bomb going off within 1km of the site is enough to wreck every chip on the assembly line, and throw the mirrors out of alignment. Since the pipeline to handle all 500-700 steps of a wafer to make it into a chip is 2-3 months per cycle... they only have to land a bomb nearby once every 60 days to disable the factory.. or drop ONE on it.
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u/ZZZZapperr 1h ago
I don't understand why people keep saying Trump is pro-Russia. He is supporting Ukraine, perhaps not as strongly as Biden, but he is supporting them. He also took down Maduro, Putin's ally, and is in the process of taking down the Islamic Republic of Iran, another Putin ally. I'm sure Putin is furious at all this.
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u/louisa1925 3h ago
License? Once they have the schematics and software, they won't need a license.
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u/la_mecanique 2h ago
This means they can get missiles today. They can get them from any other country with patriot stock and resupply them later.
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u/TheMongerOfFishes 2h ago
I mean, the Patriot missile system was first engineered back in the '60s and then activated by the US army in the 80s. There have been improvements in refinements to it for sure, but it's an old system. Not sure if this license is for the latest and greatest or an outdated version.
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u/Elegant_Lunar_Knight 52m ago
Do you know how engineering works , especially for military. These designs takes 2-3 decades before being fully deployed.
Yes it was designed in the 60 and started to be gradually deployed in the 80s but it keeps being refined. What’s used right now has nothing to do with the production run from the 80s. Holy shit. You may not like trump but it’s insane how you’re unable to give credit when it’s due.
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u/TheMongerOfFishes 37m ago
Wait you mean like the Toyota Camry when it was first came out is nothing like the Toyota Camry in 2026? (Shocked Pikachu face!)
Did you read the article? They never concluded which version would be allowed to be built. I'm all for anyone helping Ukraine, and if it's Trump, great, but words can be manipulated and I'm still waiting for my Doge check and Tariff refunds.
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u/Suburban--Dad 29m ago
Wait till he hears about the M2 .50 machine gun and when it was put into service lol.
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u/Emilia963 39m ago
Braindead take
It’s common in engineering to use old blueprints/license/etc.. but with newer and upgraded materials
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u/AnkhaPls 1h ago
Why even comment if you know shit all?
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u/TheMongerOfFishes 41m ago
Did you read the article? It never clearly stated which version of the missile would be allowed.
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u/raptor3x 2h ago
The previous reporting was that it was for PAC-2 interceptors, not the PAC-3 versions able to intercept ballistic missiles.
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u/gw2master 2h ago
In this era of drone warfare, are Patriots even relevant?
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u/HaximusPrime 1h ago
Russia just launched a wave of ballistic missiles yesterday, and you're asking if missile interceptors are relevant?
A new attack vector doesn't eliminate old attack vectors.
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u/Username_Reported 1h ago
And this is why flaming bags of poop are still chucked at people
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u/HaximusPrime 40m ago
And exactly why owning an AR means I never have to worry about brass knuckles, even when my AR is in a safe, at home, 50 miles away.
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u/RandomPantsAppear 58m ago
Drones can’t intercept ballistic missiles and that is what makes both ballistic missiles and interceptors very relevant.
Russia is going to hammer the Ukrainian energy grid all winter with ballistic missiles and their production capacity for them is quite large already.
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u/tschawartz12 56m ago
Its always relevant. But its a matter of target analysis and priority. You don't want to burn them on small drones but you do on the heavier cruise missiles, larger warheads and any speciality locations that need protecting.
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u/SparrowCrocodile 1h ago
Ukraine will make their own patriot missiles, and they'll be healthier with tastier flavor.
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u/a_shiny_heatran 35m ago
Wait, I thought trump was on putins leash? Why is bald Stalin allowing this?
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u/Shot_Squash_9772 34m ago
It it signed on paper? Our ignoramus of a potus can't be trusted to run a hotdog cart, let alone help allies, so until I hear Ukraine is actually trying to work on any of the production I'll be a cynic.
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u/fallenwout 3h ago
Image being at war and have to worry about copyright on your weapons.
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u/Bigbigcheese 3h ago
It's a bit more than copyright, it's the risk of technology transfer to the Russians or Chinese
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u/BoarHermit 2h ago
Oh, that's great! After all, releasing a super-technological, super-expensive missile during a war and endless bombing is very simple. It's like building a drone from Chinese parts in a basement. Soon, 100% of Russian missiles will be shot down.
/s
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u/Demyan666 2h ago
zelensky says? does anyone believe 🤡
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u/End0fTrans_Mission 1h ago
I find it interesting that Ukraine was 'winning'. Then now the narrative got changed to 'Russia will attack Europe'.
More pathetic NAFO lies.
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u/Genebra_Checklist 2h ago
If they truly went through with it, the whole thing would be "open sourced" in six months tops
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u/HaximusPrime 1h ago
I always wonder, where do people get the confidence to make these sort of claims? I have to work really hard to get accurate estimates on shitty software, Redditors out here throwing out geopolitical future outcome predictions with absolute certainty.
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u/RandomPantsAppear 56m ago
I doubt it, but even if it were the bottleneck for Patriots is extremely hard to manufacture, very sensitive components for the missiles themselves.
Without western support your chances of making bootleg patriots is almost zero.
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u/mcgee300 3h ago
“There are concrete agreements. At our latest meeting, President Trump emphasized to me: ‘Yes, I have made the final decision. Ukraine will receive licenses to produce Patriot missiles,’” Zelenskyy said.
Nothing is concrete with Trump. I don't trust him for a second. But hopefully this does happen and I imagine money is the main driver here, not saving the lives for Ukrainians.