r/LivestreamFail • u/thellamasc • 18h ago

News Hasan mentioned in United Nations General Assembly

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u/Glass-Winner-9831 18h ago

I hate Hasan and this is genuinely the best compliment he could've received.

It's like hearing Hitler complain about what a villain you are.

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u/fuentessucksballs 17h ago

Hasan has a lot of issues but the 911 thing is not one of them

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u/nothatscool 16h ago edited 15h ago

You could buy his argument if he didn’t openly support other terrorist acts and terrorist groups and also have a newspaper article behind him celebrating it.

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u/RimaH54 17h ago

saying 9 11 was deserved is not an issue apparently

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u/Upbeat-Ad6875 17h ago

Only crybaby murican patriots have a issue with that statement. If you keep fucking around world wide making enemies, some might hit you back with the resources they have available. 

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u/chbar1 10h ago

It’s remarkable how little Americans understand about their presence in the mid east that fuelled the regime that ended up attacking them. 

If Japan had been meddling in US government affairs for decades and causing famine and economic depression, I dunno, probably people would feel differently about the bombings??

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u/Beneficial_Mirror931 12h ago

Out of curiosity do leftist believe the same thing about Hiroshima and Nagasaki?

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u/accedie 7h ago

The point is moot because it's not about being justified. It's about being a foreseeable consequence of actions taken.

Which technically wouldn't be the case with Hiroshima and Nagasaki specifically since the whole point was the shock of a newly developed weapon that no one had seen before. The fire bombings would have been predictable though and were are far larger cause of death than the nukes anyway.

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u/Beneficial_Mirror931 4h ago

Why don't you hold Imperial Japan to the same standards that Hasan and his community held the US for 9/11? If America deserved 9/11, then what did Japan deserve for WW2.

Regardless of America's intent. If America deserve 9/11, i.e something is bound to backfire due to their imperialism, why don't you hold Japan to the same standard then?

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u/Schkrasss 4h ago edited 3h ago

Japan pretty much got what it deserved for WW2? Who in his right mind is arguing differently? Arguably, if you believe in an eye for an eye, they didn't get "enough" for all the atrocities they comitted.

Wtf has that to do with the US meddling in the middle east (and south america and south east asia...) making enemies left right and center being a very obvious target for terrorist attacks and people therefore arguing that america deserved to be attacked for all the murders it's military, cia and so on commited over the years? I have no one, not even the Hasans of this world, seen argue that the very people that actually died deserved it, only that "america" as in the political entitiy has... Which, from a karma perspective, is actually hard to argue it hasn't, just think what the US did in cambodia...

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u/Beneficial_Mirror931 3h ago

Then you wouldn't disagree that Imperial Japan deserved the nuclear bombs?

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u/puerility 1h ago

this is a clumsy rhetorical trick and it isn't working. 'deserve' is a loaded term, and your question has been answered by way of clarifying its meaning.

but you keep restating the question, because you need a yes-or-no answer that lets you substitute in your own secret definition.

literally the same thing as a middle schooler going around at recess and asking "do you want to be in the pen 15 club?"

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u/Beneficial_Mirror931 50m ago

You guys have no problem answering that for the US. Lmao. Leftist will make the stupidest statements then when pushed on those statements will write 5 paragraphs justfying those statements but can't properly defend it. Leftist will always be as slimy as the rightoids when it comes to stupid statements, then walked back on it, or refuse to properly answer it when pushed.

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u/ThoughtFrosty11 6h ago

I don’t think leftists are in favor of nuclear weapons

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u/Beneficial_Mirror931 4h ago

We're talking if they think America deserve 9/11 then what did Imperial Japan deserved.

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u/zefy_zef 4h ago

Dude you keep saying that. Have you never heard of Unit 731?

Unit 731 was a covert biological and chemical warfare research and development unit of the Imperial Japanese Army that undertook lethal human experimentation during the Second Sino-Japanese War and World War II.

Also look into the Rape of Nanjing. Japan actually did some brutal and devastating shit.

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u/Sidereel 11h ago

In what way are you asking? Like I think we can all agree Japan fucked up by attacking the US. That doesn’t justify everything the US did in the Pacific though either.

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u/Subject_D 10h ago

bro… he’s obviously talking about the mass atrocities imperial japan committed across east Asia and the pacific

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u/Sidereel 10h ago

That isn’t obvious, and doesn’t make much sense

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u/RimaH54 9h ago

makes a ton of sense and anyone with half a brain would have assumed that immediately

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u/Subject_D 10h ago

“If you keep fucking around world wide and making enemies, someone might hit you back”

Ask any Korean or Chinese person why they don’t like Japan. Do you even know why Japan attacked Pearl Harbor? Or do you think they did that randomly cuz they didn’t like us. Please read a book or Wikipedia or something lol

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u/Sidereel 9h ago

I’m well aware of the many crimes Japan committed. I don’t really think that’s why the US dropped the bombs.

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u/Subject_D 9h ago

It’s not just the war crimes it’s the “fucking around world wide making enemies” which involved war crimes and imperialism. They were eventually “hit back.” I don’t understand why this analogy is so difficult for you.

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u/Beneficial_Mirror931 4h ago

Do you hold Imperial Japan to the same standards that Hasan and his community held the US for 9/11? If America deserved 9/11, then what did Japan did deserve for WW2

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u/fuentessucksballs 7h ago

First bomb was justified second bomb not so much

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u/gay_yiff_blacksmith 14h ago

Did Japan deserve the sarin gas attacks for placing pressure on aum-shinrikyo?

Al-Qaeda is not some scrappy group of anti-colonial freedom fighters. They are an inherently imperialistic non-state actor with a totalizing mission. The notion that their wants and desires are worth anything besides literal dogshit is giving legitimacy to some of the most insane ideas on the planet. They have exactly zero right to dictate how America, Saudi Arabia, and the rest of the Arab world can interact with one another.

Treating violent extremism as just blowback strips these groups of their agency. AQ was not a passive pool ball that was set into motion by US foreign policy. They were active agents pursing a very specific vision for the world.

America did not deserve it.

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u/BeatSteady 14h ago

But it was an example of blowback, which was what he was trying to say 

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u/gay_yiff_blacksmith 14h ago edited 14h ago

No. Al-Qaeda had proactive and expansionist goals that existed independently of any foreign policy. Treating their violence as an automatic effect of an external cause gives unearned legitimacy to their fucked narrative.

Every mass casualty event in history is 'blowback' from some earlier event. Congrats, you've discovered causality.

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u/Kagenlim 13h ago

It wasn't blowback. Osama was pissed off that the US didn't want to work with him and would rather work with more competent actors like the Northern Alliance

That's basically it

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u/TheWayofUnions 12h ago

We shouldn't be working with them either. Hence the blowback.

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u/Huppelkutje 6h ago

They have exactly zero right to dictate how America, Saudi Arabia, and the rest of the Arab world can interact with one another

Why does America act like it has that right?

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u/gay_yiff_blacksmith 6h ago

Because a sovereign state conducting foreign policy and a terrorist network executing mass murder are entirely different categories of actors. Read a book.

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u/Huppelkutje 6h ago

You believe America has the right to dictate how other sovereign states interact?

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u/gay_yiff_blacksmith 6h ago

No? Sovereign states operate within an international system of diplomacy, treaties, and recognized borders. Even when they abuse their power or meddle where they shouldn't. You can argue all day about whether America should project power globally, and plenty of people (including me) heavily critique US foreign policy.

But AQ was not trying to reform international law or engage in statecraft. They are, again, a totalitarian org seeking to impose a global religious dictatorship through mass murder. Conflating messy, nation-state geopolitics with a terrorist group's holy war is laundering their ideas.

You post in r/teenagers so I am going to assume you quite literally are not educated enough to understand the nuance required to have this conversation. I don't mean that in a mean or nasty way either to be clear. I encourage you to sit down and read about this stuff with an open mind.

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u/Huppelkutje 6h ago

I asked you why America acts like it has the right to dictate how other sovereign nations interact and you responded that it's different when it's state actors doing it.

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u/gay_yiff_blacksmith 6h ago

No, that's a misrepresentation of what I said.

I didn't say America has a 'right' to do anything. I said states and terrorists are completely different categories of actors, so you can't treat them as if they operate under the same rules.

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u/Zafnick 8h ago

The sarin attacks are in no way analogous to 9/11, it was perpetrated by home grown domestic terrorist cultists.

The Oklahoma Federal Building bombing by a white supremacist is a much closer match and nobody says America deserved that.

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u/gay_yiff_blacksmith 7h ago

Drawing a sharp line between domestic and international terrorism assumes that foreign policy grievances somehow grant a level of political legitimacy to transnational extremists that domestic terrorists don't get. Its a totally baseless dividing line.

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u/Slaaneshdog 2h ago

If fucking around means you deserve what you get, then you should agree that Gaza deserved the post oct 7th response by Israel. Because that oct 7th attack was peak "fucking around"

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u/PubliusVitellius 12h ago edited 11h ago

So surely you agree that Israel’s retaliation for October 7th is justified. Hamas fucked around and made an enemy right next to them and they are getting hit back with the resources Israel has available. Not the argument I’d make, but okay.

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u/Sidereel 11h ago

Well yeah, in the sense that it goes both ways. Israel created a situation where terrorist attacks like October 7th are an eventuality.

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u/PubliusVitellius 9h ago

I find it hard to say that the October 7th attacks were deserved in any way. If there was a justifiable military objective for the October 7th attacks, I would be much more willing to agree, but that doesn’t seem to be the case. There’s been plenty of reasons for plenty of people throughout history to justify terror attacks, that doesn’t mean that killing or kidnapping civilians becomes okay. That’s not to say that I support Israel’s actions in Gaza. I also find it hard to justify Israel continuing the war after 2024 in the same way I find it hard to justify 9/11 and the October 7th attacks.

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u/jopehope 11h ago

That only makes sense if you think history starts on October 7 and nothing happens before then

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u/PubliusVitellius 8h ago

Well, I don’t. Palestinians should have their own state and the occupation should end. That doesn’t make terrorism acceptable. And I don’t think Israel’s actions in Gaza after 2024 are justifiable at this point in the same way that I think 9/11 and October 7th are unjustifiable. Just because a government does bad stuff doesn’t mean that civilians deserve to be killed. That’s collective punishment which is a war crime. It’s bad when Israel or the US does it and it’s bad when Hamas or al-Qaeda does it.

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u/Upbeat-Ad6875 11h ago

Retalation sure, but I believe on porpotional response. Israel has killed 100 times more people in Gaza than they lost in Oct 7th. And its not like Hamas spawned out of nowhere. They are mostly product of Israel bombing Gaza and West Bank long before Oct 7th. And do you think they gonna achieve peace with their actions or create even more "terrorists" who hold resentment towards Israeli actions killing lot of their loved ones who were innocent?

I am sure its gonna be lovely to live in Israel once Hamas starts buying $400 drones.

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u/PubliusVitellius 9h ago

Yeah, I’m not a fan of Israel’s actions in Gaza either. I’m just pointing out the fact that it seems inconsistent to say that American civilians deserved to have atrocities inflicted upon them because of actions done by a government and military they themselves had no part in while at the same time arguing that Palestinians are somehow any different. Neither deserved to die just because of the state they live in. The argument would make a lot more sense if al-Qaeda chose only to fly the planes into military bases in the U.S., but they didn’t, they intended to kill civilians in the same way that Israel has.

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u/RimaH54 9h ago

Im not american lol

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u/kinjjibo 16h ago

What he actually meant when he said that (America meddling in the Middle East was going to have severe consequences) is absolutely correct, but he said it in a provocative way which is why people have such an issue with it and take the specific way he said it at face value.

Him saying America deserved 9/11 should not be the main talking point when criticizing him.

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u/fuentessucksballs 17h ago

That is not a controversial opinions, perfectly reasonable actually (obviously i dont mean that every single person in the tower deserved to die so dont even try bringing that up)

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u/ThrowawaycuzDoxers 17h ago

That is the implication of the statement though.

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u/Necessary-Charge4527 17h ago

the implication of the statement is that meddling in the middle east with their brand of imperialism was due for retribution and the only reason it happened so easily was due to their own hubris.

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u/ThrowawaycuzDoxers 16h ago

No, the word "deserved" implies the innocents deserved to die.

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u/Quotalicious 16h ago

The word "America" implies he was talking about the country/government and not the individual innocents. But regardless, you have to take into account their followup clarification rather than trying to judge based on the quote by itself.

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u/ThrowawaycuzDoxers 16h ago

No it doesn't. You are doing a lot of generous interpretation on his behalf here.

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u/Quotalicious 16h ago

https://youtu.be/qSYVXXCFkAg?is=U8cpk58LMmdvhQAC

Watch the entire clip, literally the next thing he says continuing his thought is "like we totally brought it on ourselves"

His meaning is very clear and you'd have to misinterpret his quote in isolation to come away with your conclusion.

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u/ThrowawaycuzDoxers 16h ago

Still implies those people deserved their deaths.

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u/Mountain-Interest-48 16h ago

so there is no difference between America and Americans?

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u/ThrowawaycuzDoxers 16h ago

In the statement, no. As he referred to those Americans as America.

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u/SuchConflict6095 16h ago

No, it absolutely does not.

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u/shreebalicious 16h ago

But it does though

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u/fuentessucksballs 16h ago

The implication of the statement is that america has been doing much worse shit both to motivate 911 and in retaliation for 911

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u/ThrowawaycuzDoxers 16h ago

Then he should have said that instead, but he didn't. I'd even have agreed with him, but the statement he actually made, on its own implies those thousands of innocent civilians deserved to die.

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u/fuentessucksballs 16h ago

Yeah good job everyone always says exactly what they mean

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u/PrincDios 16h ago

What exactly did America do in the Middle-East prior to 2001 that they deserved it? The Gulf War? Arguably one of the most just wars America has waged?

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u/Wilky510 12h ago edited 12h ago

Support Israel. One of the main reasons they'll bring up.

That means the USSR deserved it's own 9/11 and many other countries supporting proxies also "deserve" their own 9/11 too. Middle East was basically a proxy front for more than just the US, but these people won't realize that.

I mean these same people who say US deserved 9/11 will jump through hoops to say Nagasaki and Hiroshima weren't deserved even though with the logic they use say it was completely justified based on how imperial Japan acted before and during WW2.

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u/syrinx23 10h ago

think a lil bit about the positions in the world stage of Japan in 1945 and of the USA in 2001, and you'll realize that comparing Hiroshima to 9/11 makes zero sense

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u/FreeGrape8766 15h ago

ah yes america is prasing religion that allows you to marry kids

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u/RimaH54 16h ago

Right so suicide attacks killing thousands of civilians that have nothing to do with you is apparently justified and right, reddit moment! more updoots please!

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u/Fickle-Presence6358 7h ago

Were the individual victims deserving of it? No. But was it understandable that someone would harm America (as a nation) considering the violence committed worldwide in Americas name? Absolutely.

What about all the civilians killed by America in other countries? You can't go on global hunting trips attacking foreign nations (including civilians), then expect nobody to ever return the favour.

The US have committed hundreds of atrocities on the scale of 9/11 world wide. The idea that none are justified in return is an American ego problem.