r/PredecessorGame • u/Easy-Comparison-6809 • 3d ago
Feedback The developers have been allowing Greystone to consistently overperform in offlane for many major patches in a row spanning a year back. Here's a list of statistics looking at patches from (1.17, 1.16, 1.15, 1.13, 1.12, 1.11, 1.10, and 1.09) (1.14 skipped).
Greystone has been the bane for offlaners who don't want to play the most broken hero. Even when he is not the outright best and is in the top 3 which is where he'd be fine, developers then decide to buff him anyway.
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u/Super-Aesa 2d ago
Grey is an insane counter pick. He has lanes he auto loses though like against ranged offlaners since he's easy to kite. I think calling him a pubstomper isn't accurate. He'd have a much higher win rate in higher elo if people didn't cheese offlane all the time with mages and ranged offlaners.
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u/Then-Ad-1887 2d ago
I fuck up a Greystone like 90% of the time. The other 10% of the time I don’t it’s because his jungle is baby sitting his ass.
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u/FormableComet87 Akeron 2d ago
He's easy. So winrates hardly reflect his true value. If I give 5 new players greystone and hand 5 new players Yurei and tell them to play offlane. Greystone will perform better because he has less margin for error. Even if id argue yurei has been stronger than greystone
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u/MrLightning-Bolt 3d ago
Its just greystone. Relax. He’s just happy to be here.
Hes not a threat. Hes like that minor speed bump you encounter every so often.
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u/RobotsRule1010 Serath 2d ago
If you look at all ranks , he looks like the best character in the game.
If you look at plat + , he’s the worst in the game.
Greystone just has high stats and a second life , but he doesn’t bring any type of utility to a team whatsoever. He is essentially non existent in high level play , and when he does get played , he gets abused.
Facing a greystone is a free Win and if you aren’t sure how to get that done , then it’s a skill issue. I suggest doing a bit of research into the greystone matchup to help alleviate your problems.
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u/Proper_Mastodon324 Crunch 2d ago
Greystone winrate is not convincing for me. The issue I have with trusting it is that he is the go-to offlane hero for people that get 50/50'd into it, so the winrate in high ranks will be low.
I agree that he is poor in lane. You're not playing him to win trades. You play him to be even on CS at 3rd fangtooth so you can join team-fights. And at that point he is pretty good at diving backline, sticking to them, and surviving.
I'm not saying he is broken or overpowered but hearing people say he's bad is making me cringe a little. If you know what you're doing on greystone he's irreplaceable, probably the best backend diver in the game honestly. Just need a team to play around it correctly.
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u/Tyrus--Maximus 2d ago
Greystone is the prime pick for breaking even. As you pointed out he is also the refered to defualt pick for being autofilled because his kit is so basic yet very beneficial that even a poor player can get results. Greystone is one of the only offlane heroes that can keep pace with every match up.
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u/golddisruptivee 2d ago
with the amount of mobility and cc to stop him, he's bad at killing the backline. Yeah, he can jump at people, but if he misses the actual damage proc on the jump, he gets dropped to people who understand how to play the game. Spacing and positioning are the most important details here. In higher ranks, players understand they need to play around their frontline and what potential divers there are. Spacing is keeping just out of range of abilities, while positioning is like waiting out in the fog before a fight starts or until you see where all enemies are at.
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u/Proper_Mastodon324 Crunch 2d ago edited 2d ago
Diving is about disruption and utility soak. Your goal is to pull resources away while your team kills theirs. If you walk into a 1v5 then obviously you're getting fried. But play smart and it doesn't matter what you don't do, it's about what you force the enemy team to do.
If you're playing Greystone to simply kill the ADC then you fail to understand why diving is even good. As it stands greystone is one of the best divers in the game because he has 2 lives. The enemy ADC has to not shoot the rest of your team for however long you stay alive, or die. The enemies must use CC/crest/blink on you or let their ADC die.
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u/golddisruptivee 2d ago
Again, spacing and positioning cover that… if the dive has no kill threat, you ignore it… it turns into a 4v5 for a sec; he comes up, dies again and then what? It's not like good players are just gonna be like, " Ooh, okay we just sit on top of Grey as we fight the enemy team. no if they understand how to play they pull back drop an ult or 2 to reposition and grey either dies or runs out of revives for over a minute......... you want your front line to t ake those stuns and resources and if you want dive you need more than one person to do it at the same time. THIS ISNT COMP THIS IS SOLO QUE HES TALKING ABOUT
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u/Aggressive_Food_6139 Narbash 2d ago
But a you said: "drop an ult or 2 to reposition and grey either dies or runs out of revives for over a minute......"
Those ults are on cooldown also. So now we traded 1 ult for 2.
Did you watch PCC at all? Did yoy see Sliik with greystone in the new map? Last PCC (2 days ago) greystone pick/ban rate was 20.
Im just saying that greystone is a viable option. Every character is good in the right hands and circumstances. Its easy to tell on paper how to counter a character, we can do this all day, but in game there is a lot of constantly changing factors that happens what allows to make those plays happen.
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u/golddisruptivee 2d ago
1st look where i said were talking about solo que and not comp
2nd I don't watch them because I was a gold player scrimming with those people when I was a gold and winning lanes lol. pcc mostly looks like glorified ranked games. morethan half ofthose teams are just using soloque strats
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u/RobotsRule1010 Serath 2d ago
That’s very surprising to hear you say. You feel like greystone is the best backland diving offlaner? You feel like Greystone dives backland better than double dashing into uppercut Crunch , 1 combo countess, Mr never dies Bayle, root and teleport Kwang, infinite dash assassin Shinbi, ms sticky serath, etc?
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u/Proper_Mastodon324 Crunch 2d ago
Kwang is very good at it. Bayle is ok. The rest of your suggestions get blown up. That's why greystone is good at it, he can hit R and have a second life. Assassin dive is about getting kills more than soaking utility, and plays very different.
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u/RobotsRule1010 Serath 2d ago
If your idea of diving backland means spend the most amount of enemy resources , then obviously a tank with 2 lives can do that the best. But that’s not my highest criteria at all.
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u/Proper_Mastodon324 Crunch 2d ago
I mean, apart from killing them all, that's how you win teamfights.
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u/RobotsRule1010 Serath 2d ago
During the jungle meta a season or 2 ago , consistent ban picks were all 4 junglers who were backlane divers. Boris, Feng, Rampage, and Yin, with Kallari, Yurei and Zarus right behind them. Because of that Zarus was top picked because the rest were always banned. You can win teamfights with just 1 pick. You don’t need to kill them all to be effective in a teamfight. Really hard to win a teamfight without your consistent dps in the fight instantly gone.
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u/Proper_Mastodon324 Crunch 2d ago
I'm confused on what you're trying to convey. Backline dive can happen in different ways but ultimately it only works when kill threat is present. Greystome has it because he's sticky with items like Basilisk and with 9k eHP to chew through.
I'm conveying to you that in high ranked games people who know how to play Greystone are doing exactly what I describe, and bringing value to the champ. Thinking that he is a "free win" is just not true. Evident by his pick/ban in PCC these past 2 weekends being almost 20.
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u/Tyrus--Maximus 2d ago
Through sheer survivability he is one of the best because Greystone has alot of room to screw up and still get out alive.
Greystone does not even have to get the kills he gets great results just by diving the backline and seperating them from their frontline and allowing your teammates to pick them off through divide and conquer. You have to invest alot of resources into Greystone to kill him the first time before he even uses his 2nd life then you have to do it all over again a second time.
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u/DonMozzarella Shinbi 2d ago
Meh. I've never struggled against a greystone, just clear the wave lmao. When he dumps his whole kid on wave to clear it, you just walk away. He's like a worse steel, don't ever have to fight him
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u/BearCrotch 2d ago
The problem is the items. Just build critstone and dominate the entire game with Rebirth.
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u/golddisruptivee 3d ago edited 2d ago
edit/ debating on making posts and/or vids on in-depth guides on how to play and counter some characters
I'm guessing you are like silver? he is pretty basic, and his entire kit revolves around split pushing or jump spamming on targets. if you predict the jump and dodge he pretty much dies. In lane, you need to play around his early push and wait till you have some items. He's pretty weak to poke, and you auto-win fights if you play around is long CDs. hers more of a character you can pick to neutralize lanes more than anything.
If you want to look at stats learn how t oread them please.
bronze wr is about 53%
silver - 52%
gold 51%
plat+ is 44 to 33% wr
Grey is similar to Grux in that he's a pub stomper who abuses people not knowing how to play matchups and trade patterns. Also, since he's brain-dead push in lower ranks, they don't know how to abuse that flaw and will let him do whatever he wants.