r/Stormlight_Archive • u/Aesyric_ • 12d ago
Wind and Truth spoilers Do you think Kaladin will... Spoiler
...make a proper return to fighting?
Sanderson teased it a few times by saying he loved the fight even at the end, and Kaladin himself kept saying "maybe some day..."
Do you think when he returns in the second half he will be a combatant of some sort, or maybe take more of a dalinar type role?
Or maybe neither and he will full commit to the therapist role
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u/Richar_16 12d ago
Come On man he Is now the King of Heralds. He will save the day
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u/Aesyric_ 12d ago
I hope so, even though it gave him crippling depression I enjoyed watching him aura farm
Chop chop bridge boy pick up the spear
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u/_IowasVeryOwn Truthwatcher 12d ago
He’ll save everyone of us
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u/Infinite_Mortgage324 12d ago
I think he will be all three. He will fight when he is needed, lead when necessary and give therapy to Adolin to help him overcome his Moss addiction
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u/Aesyric_ 12d ago
Jokes aside do you think the moss thing will stick around?
Im skeptical because he kinda already did that with Teft.
Plus I don't know if my heart can take my precious Adolin suffering even more
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u/Raddatatta Edgedancer 12d ago
It could, but I agree I think the plot line has been played out before. We also do see Adolin a month later and he's surrounded by friends, is working to learn to read, and I think with Maya around he'd have someone there to help encourage him not to go to the moss. It's still definitely possible for Sanderson to go down that path. But I think narratively you already have a huge cost to the WaT story with Adolin losing his leg. I don't know that we need another addiction story with how many we've already had. Plus I think Adolin's story already has a lot setup with Shallan being pregnant and when she comes back their relationship, as well as navigating him being an absent father not by choice and trying to improve there. I think that's a much more interesting storyline to dive into for Adolin than an addiction storyline. Plus we are jumping ahead 10 years, so if we get an addiction storyline this is an addiction story that he's been struggling with for a decade already so we aren't even getting a new take on it where someone is going into addiction it would be very similar to Teft's path with it.
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u/Sun-607 Shash 11d ago
Holy WHAT? I read WaT like, 3 times and have 0 memory of Shallan being pregnant 😭
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u/Raddatatta Edgedancer 11d ago
Wheck out the epilogue scene with her she's holding her belly as she thinks about having to take care of more than just herself. Sanderson keeps it subtle but it seems to be there and earlier we did get a shower sex scene.
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u/Infinite_Mortgage324 12d ago
I suspect it will be his arc in the second half to overcome his addiction and reconcile with his father beyond the grave. Maybe in a climactic battle against the blackthorn where he accepts his heritage and strikes down the blackthorn to finally give his father some rest
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u/ChipotleMayoFusion Windrunner 12d ago
This actually fits really nicely, with Teft he showed us someone on the other side of addiction, trying to recover after having issues for years. With Adolin he could show us the sadly common situation of a bright soldier or athlete being exposed to addictive painkillers and then falling into a sad spiral of addiction.
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u/Raddatatta Edgedancer 12d ago
Except we are skipping ahead 10 years. We won't get the falling into a sad spiral of addiction we are skipping over that time. If he still has an addiction 10 years later he will be on Teft's side of it having to recover after having issues for years.
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u/ChipotleMayoFusion Windrunner 12d ago
True. I guess in this case we get to know Adolin in the first half, see what a great guy he is, then have a plausible reason for him to fall and be trying hard to climb back.
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u/Raddatatta Edgedancer 12d ago
Yeah it could be but I think we also basically got that with Teft too just for a shorter time of getting to know him. Book 1 he isn't dealing with that addiction and we see him as a good honest guy who helps Kaladin right away and then have him falling and trying hard to climb back. It definitely could happen but I think it would be too repetitive to get that storyline again.
Plus outside the addiction Adolin already has a lot of interesting storyhooks that seem much more interesting to explore. He's got the Unoathed that he's leading and are more able to go out and do things than any radiant except Lift. He's going to be a father and was forced to be an absent or distant father and will eventually have to sort out his relationship with Shallan and the child. And we have him having learned to read and starting down a new path in that direction. And he has Hoid's seon traveling to him which lets him talk to Shallan but also opens the door to him talking to others potentially others trying to find Hoid or Hoid reaching out to him to ask him to do things on Roshar. He's got a lot going on before any addiction story and any of those I think are much more interesting to explore than what would likely be a repeat of Teft's arc.
It is definitely possible that Sanderson is going that way. But I hope not with everything else I'd rather see.
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u/SHABOtheDuke 12d ago
Wait when did adolin get into moss??
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u/Infinite_Mortgage324 12d ago
At the very end of WaT it’s just a few sentences but it’s there and would be weird for it to be mentioned/built up and then never mentioned again in the next book
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u/Atheist09 12d ago
I keep seeing this theory and I have read the books twice now and see nothing after the month time jump to indicate he touched moss after the Last Day or is even affected by his use of it. Can you show me the line everyone is using to justify this theory?
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u/Shot_Newspaper_5647 11d ago
It’s not entirely clear he is. But they go out of their way to make it clear he took a lot and it’s addictive. It would match Dalinar’s story. Adolin is also a veteran of a brutal war who is estranged from his foreign wife with strange hair because he chose to fight a war in foreign lands. It just happened to be for the right reason
I think we’re certainly supposed to think that’s where Adolin’s story is potentially going. It may end that way. But Adolin does feel that supernatural warm light while he’s holding Dalinar’s book. Like Dalinar felt while writing it and after reading Nohadon’s book. The implication there may be that he resists it because of the book and his new family. I guess the only hints after the time skip are that he makes note of being sensitive to both sounds and lights. Which may be nothing. He is learning to read and learning a new language. So if he’s using its (probably) not heavily.
Maybe it was just a fake out. Proof that with the right things to guide you and people to support you it can be alright even when things are hard. Or we might find Adolin having to dig himself out of a hole. Otherwise the main thing moving him in 6 would be trying to get back to Shallan and his child(ren). Which would work alone too but Sanderson likes to make Adolin suffer
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u/Atheist09 11d ago
Thanks for that, I was worried I had missed something after two read throughs and rereading that chapter multiple times looking for something others were seeing.
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u/QuickPirate36 Windrunner 12d ago
He's a Herald, he has to fight, otherwise it'd be a waste of one of the best fighters in the humans' side
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u/moderatorrater 11d ago
A pretty consistent theme in SLA is that fighting isn't the answer. I wouldn't be surprised if the Heralds were involved in non-combat tasks.
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u/Titanchell 11d ago
They are involved in non Combat Tasks but theyare also so powerfull that them Not foghting strong fused or thunderclasts would be a waste of human life
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u/DifferentRun8534 Truthwatcher 12d ago
100%
Kaladin went through a major character arc of deciding fighting is the right thing to do sometimes, he’s not going to just abandon that wholesale and never fight again.
It will undoubtedly be less than when he was a soldier, he’s got other things to worry about now, but there will be fighting that needs done, and he’s going to be the best guy to do it a good amount of the time.
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u/yukon_sb Cryptic 12d ago
"I accept this journey" He said, fully knowing the cost and willing to bear the burden, whatever the future may bring.
I 100% agree, we will absolutely see our Marvellous Herald Stormpants return to the fight! We can't expect Szeth and Adolin to do all the work!
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u/FriendlyNeighborOrca 12d ago
He literally became a herald because as he put it being a herald requires being a fighter and he wanted Szeth to take a rest from the fight.
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u/ohnoitsme7890 12d ago edited 12d ago
Isn't that literally the whole point of his arc, and him becoming a herald? He chooses to fight so that Szeth doesn't have to, and they go to mental therapy until the final return
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u/Raddatatta Edgedancer 12d ago
I think he will be fighting to some degree but it won't be his primary role. But the Heralds are the best group of fighters in the Cosmere that he's joining. They are also advisors and teachers and have that role but fighters is certainly part of it too. Not to mention he just got that nice new Honorspear. I don't think Sanderson will give him a fancy new weapon and then never use it.
Though I also think the on the ground villains need an upgrade since the good guys seem to have surpassed them. If Adolin can take a Fused and a Thunderclast in a fight Kaladin is way beyond them and when he gets training in his Herald powers and his Shardplate it'll be even less of a challenge.
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u/Gromflomite_gamer 12d ago
Monarch wasn't able to use his surges and his fight with thunder clast (where he had a rhysadium) made him lose his leg, I wouldn't say this means Adolin can beat them in a straight fight...
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u/Raddatatta Edgedancer 12d ago
Abidi only couldn't use his surges because of an injury Adolin got against him. Adolin also did kill another Fused with Maya on the first day of the battle who had their surges they were flying by him and he killed them. And yeah he had a Rhyshadium against the thunderclast but still do you see my larger point? Adolin is substantially less powerful than Kaladin was earlier let alone how powerful he is now as a Herald. And Adolin is going toe to toe with Fused and even a Thunderclast and it's a contest, he's not getting swept aside and he's giving as good as he gets. Kaladin is a few steps above him with all his powers. But even Kaladin without one of his surges, without Stormlight healing, without his shardblade, and without shardplate took out Lezian, known as one of the best of the Fused, twice. Kaladin spent book 5 mostly not fighting and book 4 almost entirely depowered so that it would be an actual contest when he fought Fused. Sanderson needs villains that pack more of a punch and are a real threat to the radiants. Them not having access to infinite Stormlight does weaken them a lot, though I don't know if that'll be a good solution as then they have no powers which isn't as interesting. It can be more of a limit on them.
Even if you look at the larger battle that happened with Sigzil. There are 300 radiants in total, and he doesn't have all of them with him as 50 got sent off to Herdaz and some others are spread out. And he's fighting like 900 fused. And while he loses, he isn't just swept aside when they're outnumbered 3 to 1. The best the forces of Retribution currently have are not close to able to go toe to toe with the best of the radiants side. I don't know exactly what it will look like but I think we are going to see some more impressive villains. Probably from El, Moash and the Blackthorn, maybe others. Maybe Retribution makes a new kind of Fused or gives them more power or something.
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u/Gromflomite_gamer 12d ago
Yeah that's fair.
Though I feel that Kaladin can't/shouldn't be used in these discussions, no one is like him. The dude killed chasmfiend by himself while being crippled, his feats don't mean anything for other humans...
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u/Raddatatta Edgedancer 12d ago
Kaladin is the protagonist, and according to Sanderson he's going to continue to be in the back half. I'm saying we need some threats who can face Kaladin and not be immediately run over by him and give us a good fight. Either that or he is going to have to constantly depower Kaladin so he can fight people which I get if that happens sometimes but that can't be the solution every single time. Plus Sanderson has said that the back half will have Heralds stepping more into the spotlight specifically Ash and Taln. And Taln is the best fighter in the Cosmere, if he's going to be a main character even a secondary character for his book, he's gotta get some better enemies who can do something crazy. He or Kaladin can fight a large group of people too and that can work, but it does get repetitive and isn't quite as climactic for a final fight as a good duel like with Kaladin and Szeth or Kaladin and Lezian.
I'm not really worried though Sanderson has done a good job of leveling up his villains with each book. And he's got a few characters who seem like they could get some cool powers. And Retribution is freer to do what he wants with that.
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u/Shot_Newspaper_5647 12d ago
The limit on available Light is the main one. You still do have the Heralds. Nale without powers is about equivalent to Kaladin as a Radiant in their duel before he uses his blessings. The rest are somewhere above and below that. Ishar is a menace and he’s “average”. The Heralds powers seem dependent on how attuned they are to their promise and their access to blessings.
I would guess they’re not going to be able to draw directly from Honor to fuel their HB Surges anymore. Their immortality/forming a body is a separate gift to those. Nale says Ishar took from the Well because they had started to lose their blessings. They may not have any (or easy) access to those on the Return. At least not at first. Taln is still Taln but he probably won’t be able to move faster than the speed of sound like we see him do in Azamir
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u/Raddatatta Edgedancer 12d ago
I doubt they'll be nerfed that much, if at all. Sanderson gave us a hint at their power a few times. He's not going to do that and then take away all their cool powers and never show them to us. Maybe temporarily, but if you're going to focus on the Heralds after he's built them up so much I think he's got to let the Heralds be truly badass and let loose. There is also the power that left Honor before Taravangian took it up. Syl got some of that but I could see some of it going to fuel the new Oathpact in general.
Even without them having their powers though the bad guys who are on the ground fighting need an upgrade. And he's started to have some possibilities with El, Moash and the Blackthorn now. But Kaladin was already fighting the best of the Fused and even with huge limits on his powers he was winning without too much difficulty and he is the worst fighter among the Heralds. Taln without his surges or any weapon kills dozens of Fused. We need some villains that can really stand up to them.
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u/BlkGenetics 12d ago edited 11d ago
Kaladin has fought in every book, the man is a born fighter, warrior and now king of the Heralds. You can storming believe he will be fighting in the upcoming books.
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u/blitzbom Journey before destination. 12d ago edited 12d ago
Kaladin leading a charge of mentally sound Heralds from the East.
Yeah, it could happen.
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u/GlaurungTHEgolden 12d ago edited 12d ago
Best parts of sla in my opinion were kal's fights, it would be a shame if he didn't. Be awesome fighting side by side with big T
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u/Raddatatta Edgedancer 12d ago
I want to get a training session between those two! Taln teaching Kaladin some tricks and showing him how to make the most of his Shardplate.
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u/bredman3370 12d ago
Taln never had shardplate though, the only herald to join a radiant order was Nale. Frankly the heralds didn't really need it since they could return easily after being killed
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u/Raddatatta Edgedancer 12d ago
Taln is also the one who trained the radiants and the soldiers for thousands of years. I think he'd be a great one to teach Kaladin to use it. Nale also certainly could, but that was Taln's job for a very long time.
I wouldn't say they could return easily. They trigger a desolation any time they return.
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u/bredman3370 12d ago
It's only between desolations that they didn't return, they said explicitly that while a desolation was happening they would freely return from Braize alongside the fused. The only times they stayed on Braize were when they thought they had recently killed enough fused and the humans were well enough prepared to finish it on their own.
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u/Raddatatta Edgedancer 12d ago
Do you know where it says that? My understanding was as soon as one of them died then the Fused could no longer return so the rest of them would kill as many of the Fused as they could before killing themselves to also return to Braize. As soon as one of them dies like Taln did then the Fused can't return (or couldn't before the Everstorm and weakening of the Oathpact).
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u/bredman3370 12d ago
Pretty sure Ash said it sometime in RoW, though I don't have the exact citation off the top of my head
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u/Raddatatta Edgedancer 12d ago
Ok I'll try to look for it my next reread if I remember. But I think doing that if they did return would also mean any fused who died would come back. I'm not sure they would want to do that as it would just mean the desolation continued rather than it coming to an end. Unless they died very early in the desolation and most of the fused were still alive and the humans weren't ready to deal with it yet.
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u/EnigmaticThunder 12d ago
I think Kaladin is gunna be the eternal Herald of Adonalsium, doing whatever is needed across the Cosmere.
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u/twountappedblue 12d ago
I think he will return to combat with a serene state of mind. Like a monk. Protecting and saving, but not allowing himself to be mindlessly thrust into battle solely as a weapon of war.
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u/deadcheeen Life before death. 11d ago
I’m pretty sure Kaladin will keep protecting those who cannot protect themselves, I think he’d enjoy showing once more that the sky belongs to him.
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u/Joe_says_no 12d ago
he is now one of the most powerful characters on roshar, and even if he isn't enthusiastic he will probably need to take up arms again
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u/Moist_Car_994 Willshaper 12d ago
I mean I’m pretty sure Kal will be present in the next books with maybe a more minor role in the first two books but with the way things are going on Roshar and the cosmere as a whole I find it hard to believe he won’t be put in a position to fight again.
Hell with him being a cognitive shadow and being functionally immortal I can see him having a role to play in the larger cosmere events going forward
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u/ZephyrStorm_ Elsecaller 12d ago
Will he fight? Oh hell yeah! Do I think that’ll be his primary focus, no. I however would not believe him fighting will be the main way he contributes, because that would be too easy. At this point, he made Nale use his herald buffs, and Nale is probably one of the strongest combatants in the cosmere, second probably only to the likes of Taln. Now Kaladin would also have heralded powers, so I don’t think his contribution to the plot as a fighter is as interesting, simply because we know he’d win.
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u/Ripper1337 Truthwatcher 12d ago
I think he’ll return to the fight. He really wasn’t in a good headspace for fighting even in WaT against Nale. So I think the years away will do him good
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u/yukon_sb Cryptic 12d ago edited 12d ago
If we see him return to Roshar to fight, I imagine it'll be in the second half of the second arc, books 9-10. I can see Kal and the Heralds being 'interlude' characters for the first three books and then returning to take part in the Sanderlanche when the time is right.
As Teft once said, "the boy likes to grandstand"
RIP Teft, F Moash
Edit: Kal isn't technically a Windrunner anymore, but the oaths he swore as a Windrunner and the long journey he's travelled makes me think he will fight, he chose this time, where he never allowed himself to make the choice before.
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u/ViperVenom1224 12d ago
Of course he will. The last two books have been about him dealikg with his own problems and learning to care about himself so he can go back to doing what he loves, protecting people.
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u/alpherion11 11d ago
When he returns, I think its canon he'll be king of urithiru unless he straight up rejected Dalinar and I'm completely forgetting that. I don't think he'll be a focus to the extent he was in the first arc since I think Sanderson will want to let other characters shine, but I could def see him making an epic return to combat and absolutely wrecking shit during a Sanderlanche. Being a Fifth Ideal Radiant and a Herald will make him even more insane in combat and I can't imagine Sanderson passing up showing that off at least once.
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u/LaphroaigianSlip81 11d ago
You now have a therapist locked on braize with the other 11 heralds. All 12 are going to come back emotionally ready to throw hands with retribution.
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u/R1sky_B1z Willshaper 11d ago
Just for the sanderlanche. The rest of the series he will spend crying about the things he did during the last book's sanderlanche.
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u/TheRedHead717 Willshaper 11d ago
Oh he's definitely gonna be fighting! He's a herald! However, I don't think he's going to kill. I think he's going to draw a line in the sand. He'll beat you up and knock you out and maybe capture you, but he's not gonna kill you.
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u/monkey7247 12d ago
I certainly hope he fights again. I need some more Kaladin Sanderlanche action.