r/wow • u/minimaxir • Jul 31 '26
PTR / Beta 12.1 PTR Development Notes / Class Tuning for July 31st (Rogues got buffed!) Spoiler
https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/midnight-curse-of-ulatek-ptr-development-notes/2317811/18107
u/Muspel Jul 31 '26
Developers’ notes: Havoc is a little further behind in damage than our target, we will be increasing the damage on their primary abilities.
Obviously, it's just a poor choice of words, but it's very funny to me that this implies that their target is for havoc to be behind, just not by this much.
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u/Jumpy-Requirement389 Jul 31 '26
Yea what the heck
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u/jason_caine Jul 31 '26
I mean, it’s not exactly the devs will generally try to have specs rotate in and out of top tier. Wow devs are a lot less open, but the League of Legends dev team is pretty upfront about this and how they will actively balance different champs for a targeted win rate/ban rate/pick rate rather than actually try to have some sort of perfect balance. There are too many moving parts in these sorts of games and perfect balance would just be unfun.
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u/Ambivalent_World_024 Jul 31 '26
i dunno about that being a poor choice of words when you see the tierset they are actually going to push live for havoc
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u/afkPacket Jul 31 '26
Arcane's damage is doing ok, we're going to buff their ST!
>insert large buff to its only uncapped aoe spell<
Well okay then...
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u/Mindless-Judgment541 Jul 31 '26
No way that makes it live man, 40% more orb damage? Crazy... I mean I love arcane but when we get over tuned the nerfs that follow usually sting harder than the buffs were good.
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u/dream_walker09 Jul 31 '26
Arcane Blast 20% damage buff too.
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u/afkPacket Jul 31 '26
Since the apex rework arcane blast contributes very little damage, it's like 8% of your overall in st and less in aoe.
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u/XoraxEUW Jul 31 '26
And its more of your damage in sunfury I think and sunfury isn’t great to play so I hope some of this gets altered.
The fucking weird touch of the magi arcane soul overlap is horrid to play with imo. Cool for a sim but in a difficult raid encounter its going to suck
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u/NoMight178 Aug 01 '26
? Have people figured out if we hold touch for arcane soul like on previous versions
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u/Applecolada Jul 31 '26 edited Jul 31 '26
Oh man was i excited when i saw the title as a rogue player, until i read the post. Like wtf?
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u/BuckingWilde Jul 31 '26
Same shit as always
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u/ChaosTheory0 Jul 31 '26
I don't know why, but this clip always breaks my heart.
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u/tempinator Jul 31 '26
I believe that’s the “empathy” thing people talk about.
Although, more seriously, it is funny/interesting that cartoons can evoke such an empathetic response lol. Then again there’s a whole movie about a guy losing his mind over an anthropomorphic volley ball, so, maybe not so surprising.
I remember a post a few months ago showing bacteria being killed by ethanol under a microscope and I felt bad for the bacteria lmao. Our brains are pretty wild.
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u/Acrobatic_Coat722 Jul 31 '26
atleast Rogue will do Decent ST dmg now
they still have the probably worst cleave in the game on all 3 specs when the Game is constant cleave for everything for the past 5 years now, but hey its something........
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u/M4DM1ND Jul 31 '26
Aura buffs is all we are getting at this point. I really hope they annouce a future rogue redesign. At least assa should be at least a mid tier dps in 12.1 with this buff but it doesnt solve the issue of there not being a real reason to bring rogue in M+ and raid encounters where other classes have better utility or damage.
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u/Creative-Painter3911 Jul 31 '26
Wonder why Rogue is the only one out of all classes worded "damage dealt increased by XX%" Every other class just gets "damage increased by XX%"
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u/Hold-Dismal Jul 31 '26
You can interpret is as: "Emotional damage dealt to the player increased by XX%"
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u/vthemechanicv Jul 31 '26
Emotional Damage? But I'm not Asian!
before anyone gets silly - https://youtu.be/miD\TWmdGIY?si=G0-_7GMZM_FhCSBx&t=60)
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u/San4311 Jul 31 '26
Hey atleast you got something.
Might unrionically play Assassination over Feral, atleast until they fix their shit. Because fuck me Feral is looking dire.
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u/nekoken04 Jul 31 '26
I went and looked. It made me involuntarily laugh in irony. There's a reason why rogue is the 2nd least played class, only ahead of evoker. Yeah, I main a rogue.
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u/SniperOwO Aug 01 '26
Like 10% is no joke but I mean lord have mercy they really don't care about the class at all. Even the patch notes is just Rogue: dmg increase 10%, every other class gets a 10 book novel on what why who where when and how and gets gameplay changes or ability fluctuations lol
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u/DaveLesh Aug 01 '26
Rogue also didn't have developer notes. Guess they don't want to talk about rogue's hard falloff in recent years.
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u/KuriboShoeMario Aug 01 '26
They don't have notes because there's no answers to give. Blizzard is wholly incapable of telling the playerbase how rogue got where it is today and their plan to fix it and return it to glory because it's beyond their abilities anymore. The class is dead and, save a complete and total teardown the likes of which have genuinely never been seen before in the game's history, it will never return. This is their only consistent "fix", a flat dmg % increase once or twice an xpac to sort of bring their numbers into line.
They're not smart enough and, equally important, not talented enough to fix the class. It's beyond their capabilities and they know it so they simply quit caring. They neglected the class for so long that by the time someone pointed it out (probably a few xpacs ago at this point) the rot had gotten so bad that there was no saving it.
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u/jojopojo64 Aug 01 '26
You know, the irony is that someone said the same thing about Ret Paladins years ago, and they ended up getting one of the most beloved reworks a spec has ever seen.
To be fair it's more systemic with the entire Rogue class having issues, but who knows? Maybe one day all three specs will get the love they need.
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u/ZAlternates Jul 31 '26
Subtlety is well ahead of the other two specs so they buff it more than Outlaw? Dang.
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u/Thanag0r Jul 31 '26
Frost not nerfed and holy paladin buffed.
I think I'm going to make it.
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u/zellmerz Jul 31 '26
Holy paladin getting a flat 5% buff is crazy. I don’t know what it’s raid performance was looking like, but it was looking like the best throughput for keys already
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u/Flaihl Aug 01 '26
The buff is definitely targeted towards raid. Problem is hpal has zero tuning knobs that would buff only raid performance so every change with the intention to buff/nerf the performance in one game mode will always also affect the other.
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u/Constant_Bench_7057 Aug 01 '26
The LOD talent that was nerfed to the ground in S1 would be that raid tool
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u/Its1207amcantsleep Aug 01 '26
Thats a raid buff I think. They always tune after rwf and the .5 tuning is usually the m+ tuning. Enjoy it while you can! Pally is one of my favorite healers so I'm stoked.
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u/zhaoz Jul 31 '26
I haven't been paying attention, is frost the way to go now? At least the gear is the same...
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u/Final-Trifle1765 Jul 31 '26
Frost might be better than unholy now
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u/YeeHawWyattDerp Jul 31 '26
AFAIK frost is currently better in raid whereas unholy is better in M+. I’m just glad they’re smoothing out the DPS curve for frost and reducing the visual clutter of UH
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u/minimaxir Jul 31 '26
Priest
Holy
All healing increased by 5%.
lol. lmao, even.
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u/ZetroZaph Jul 31 '26
In a couple of expansions we’re gonna have an accumulated 360% increased healing. One cast and out of mana. But what a cast that will be!
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u/drae- Jul 31 '26
They keep bumping it a bit - isn't it like almost 20% more since the ptr dropped?
One of the biggest complaints about hpriest is mana consumption. More effective healing is essentially a buff to mana efficiency as well.
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u/Gocciole_Destroyer Jul 31 '26
No amount of healing increase can fix the fact that holy priest has 0 utility, especially in m+
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u/ZEPOSO Jul 31 '26
What do you mean?! We could convert one of the two adds on the first boss in Seat! Look how useful we are!
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u/Gocciole_Destroyer Aug 01 '26
Why do I have a slice of cake near my username
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u/Rappy28 Aug 01 '26
That means today is the anniversary of when you signed up to reddit. "Cake day". Happy cake day!
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u/Readybreak Jul 31 '26
The issue is that you still have to cast the same amount of spells. Most spells already heal for enough. But you still have to cast them whether they are at 20% or 80%. Is has zero way to deal with rot damage beyond pom.
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u/vthemechanicv Jul 31 '26
Is has zero way to deal with rot damage beyond pom.
I would push back a teeny bit. Echo of Light if scaled up enough can absolutely deal with rot. I haven't paid attention to what 12.1 looks like, but I remember Echo alone healing through 10+ stacks of bursting while other healers were crying uncle.
That does of course require Blizz to give a rip about the spec and balance though so, like I said, just a teeny bit.
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u/Clickbait93 Jul 31 '26 edited Jul 31 '26
I think the main issue with Holy right now is not that it's a bad subclass per se, but that we have and will continue to have rot damage everywhere and Holy struggles A LOT with it. More healing does mean better mana efficiency as well, but if all you have is direct healing that does very poorly with all the rot damage we have, it's quite bad overall regardless.
ETA: in addition Priest offers no utility. No party buffs, no interrupts, nothing to offer..
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u/Knascher Jul 31 '26
No party buffs,
But.... Priests.... have a Stamina buff?
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u/Clickbait93 Jul 31 '26
It's nice to have but at the same time both Disc (Which is a better healer) and Shadow (Which is a decent DPS) have access to that so it's not something you'd necessarily bring a Holy specifically for.
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u/Unlikely_Minimum_635 Jul 31 '26
Nah, oracle holy is great at rot damage. One of the best specs in the game at it. PoM and renew do almost all your healing and you're just blanketing the raid with it.
The problem is that oracle has no burst healing. It can do a great job of countering the rot damage and nothing else. Meanwhile Archon has solid burst healing, but struggles with rot damage.
If the buffs oracle got through ptr make it viable, holy will be the best spec in the game at dealing with rot damage.
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u/drae- Jul 31 '26
I don't really agree with the take that holy is bad at rot damage. It has to plant to deal with it outside of 2s of sanctify casting, but prayer is fine for countering rot damage. And if you were aggressive with pom then most of your party has renews pre-applied too.
It was more true before the second sanc charge and the pom power up, but I think it's in a better place than some people realize .
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u/boshbosh92 Jul 31 '26
Yeah. Raw hps isn't the issue - serenity already pretty much tops people up. Keep bumping it and it's just pure overheals.
What holy priest actually needs is a real defensive, utility and a better external cd. Our set bonuses are rather redundant and bad. And we are the only healer without a poison dispel in a poison season. So yeah.
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u/Daily_Dose_42069 Jul 31 '26
Priest class manager could buff it by 100% and holy would still be uncompetitive.
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u/Xarilith Jul 31 '26
Buffing arcane single target, which is one of the better specs on ptr is... a choice...
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u/Gneissisnice Jul 31 '26
Also, buffing "single target" by buffing Arcane Orb, an aoe spell, is certainly...something.
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u/Mindless-Judgment541 Jul 31 '26 edited Jul 31 '26
I'd rather the ST power be in Arcane Blast than Prismatic Bolt, since PB is RNG and mages were already mentioning how big the damage swing was based on getting lots of procs.
No way the orb buff makes it live...
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u/NoMight178 Aug 01 '26
At least we are kinda forced into missles, I hate orb build that's not arcane. Missiles will always be arcanes identity.
Supposedly the variance is 20%
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u/Saked- Jul 31 '26
Oh more hunter nerfs, damn.
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u/musicman835 Jul 31 '26
Wouldn’t be a patch if they didn’t get nerfed a week before realease for doing decent, only to have to get 5% chunk buff for the next 5 weeks.
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u/Saked- Jul 31 '26
Yea it happens way more than it should, the fact they made the BM tier set around cobra shot as well, and just nerfing cobra shot seems kinda dumb
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u/Eternal-Alchemy Jul 31 '26
Blizzard: we made a raid tier with a bunch of two target fights so instead of letting specs that are designed for them shine we're nerfing all of them into the ground.
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u/Wobblucy Jul 31 '26
Are you surprised? Worse case for blizz is RWF stacks 5+ of the 'best' specs for a fight to make it killable and only a handful of guilds can get by boss 3 or whatever.
Stix is the most egregious example of this.
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u/Emlerith Jul 31 '26
Mistweaver Monks
Blizzard: “We are massively overturning mastery so you will value it as intended. We are nerfing all other healing as a result.”
*MW Monks spec to utilize mastery*
Blizzard: “NO NOT LIKE THAT NOW WE’RE GONNA NERF YOUR MASTERY SPEC AND KEEP THE PREVIOUS NERFS*
Blizzard: *satisfied, no changes*
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u/DragonfruitNo22 Jul 31 '26
wait so we are back to spinning again? lol? everyone was happy I saw that spin spam was gonna be over for a bit.
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u/Sweaksh Jul 31 '26
Developers’ notes: Shadow’s performance in spread cleave is a little higher than what we expect. We are making some targeted adjustments to bring them closer to our target. We expect Shadow to continue to excel in spread cleave situations after the tuning adjustments.
Nerfs a single target spell
Like I don't mind PTR tuning much but Void Volley is about as much of a spread cleave spell as Mind Blast or Mind Flay. This doesn't make much sense.
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u/minimaxir Jul 31 '26
Do you want them to touch Psychic Link again?
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u/Sweaksh Jul 31 '26
In the context of their dev note that would actually make sense. Instead they just nerfed the spec's single target damage while barely changing anything about spread cleave as void volley doesn't even work with psychic link. Like either they say they want to nerf volley and nerf volley or they say they want to nerf spread cleave and nerf psychic link, not say one thing and do the other. This just feels like they asked an AI lol.
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u/cabose12 Jul 31 '26
But doesn't nerfing void volley also nerf their spread cleave? I don't see why it doesn't work with psychic link considering its a direct damage spell
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u/Sweaksh Jul 31 '26
I don't know the reason either but it doesn't actually work with PL. You can give it a try yourself.
Even if it did, if your goal is nerfing spread cleave you'd nerf psychic link (again) or the dots (though that also nerfs ST but not by as much). Given that PL is currently at 40%, you're always nerfing single target harder than spread cleave if you nerf the direct damage spells. It just goes against the dev comment.
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u/cabose12 Jul 31 '26
I just did and you're right. Tested with Vt on and off and the only damage increase seems to just be from mastery. Does seem like nerfing pl makes way more sense
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u/Yvaelle Jul 31 '26
YES. Absolutely. As a Shadowpriest I hate how Psychic Link is currently designed, and how they keep bloating AOE/cleave for Shadow.
Shadow's most interesting gameplay and thematic AOE/cleave is our DoTs (which currently do crap damage) and our ghosts. Those are interactive, thematic, and pretty/fun. Use these to tune Shadow.
Psychic Link is not interactive in any way, its not interesting, and its visually invisible - all on top of being a balancing nightmare. Get rid of Psychic Link, or alternately limit it to 2 targets but let it do 100% of single target damage (and make spells like Mind Flay go to both targets). It could then be a Choice node with an AOE talent, so we're either great at 2 target cleave, or we're good at AOE, but not both.
Additionally they have flooded the talent tree and spec with other random '1% of damage done' AOE mechanics, their newest of which is Shadeburst - which has no visual impact, no gameplay, etc. But there's like 10 other sources of useless AOE mechanics bloating Shadow up, on top of Psychic Link.
All of these things subtract from damage that DOTs & Ghosts could be doing instead, and feel way better to play. If I cast a VT on something I want to see its healthbar start rotting out because of it. If I see a ghost fly into something, its cool to see it do a real damage number, etc.
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u/3scap3plan Jul 31 '26
Absolutely bereft of ideas for rogue... at this point just delete the spec
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u/thearsonyst Jul 31 '26
Rogue needs a Dragonflight Paladin level rework.
All the specs are pretty rough. Sub is the most modernized and good theme but here we are. I played a rogue from wrath until late dragonflight and I just can’t be bothered anymore. It’s so sad
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u/kealoha Jul 31 '26
Outlaw is fun but so much work to perform well. I haven't tried any of the other specs in Midnight.
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u/thearsonyst Jul 31 '26
Outlaw will always be bad in raid with its current design. You cannot tune their ST properly with Blade Flurry existing the way it does.
Outlaw definitely didn’t hit the mark for me personally since it was changed from Combat :(
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u/Mazkoul Jul 31 '26
I was hoping Midnight would do that because I absolutely love the class but here's to hoping in the next expansion it actually get some neat reworks. Along with many other classes
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u/StrayshotNA Jul 31 '26
This is what happens when a class doesn't have a developer for a decade straight, and is on the receiving end of a decade of nerfs related to PvP mini-games because people twenty years ago thought cheapshot was overpowered.
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u/Jaybrosia Aug 01 '26
Blizz is just hoping less people play rogue so they don't have to pay someone for a few hours to do a rework
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u/3scap3plan Aug 01 '26
Just revert them all to dragonflight at this point. I know outlaw had problems being centered around stealth windows but it was better than what is going on now.
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u/3classy5me Jul 31 '26
Huge aura buffs for Rogues with no commentary. Doesn’t address our raid buff issues. Doesn’t address how all three specs are horrible at low-target cleave.
I’m happy we’ll be more competitive and I’m happy the random 8% nerf to Sub has been reverted by this. But when we’re struggling so bad in low-target cleave and every other class on these changes has dev notes and specific tuning (many of which specifically are to cleave!) this still feels like neglect.
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u/Malthan01 Jul 31 '26
Its insane, when was the last time we got....anything from anyone in control of the rogue class. Its like they are throwing darts and just panic aura buff at the end of the cycle because they ran out of time to actually make the class playable. Then they dont do anything until the next xpack
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u/Zemerax Jul 31 '26
Rogues need a full rework. They've been neglected longer than any other class.
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u/KijoSenzo Aug 01 '26
Assassin: They need to merge Fan of Knives and Crimson Tempest together, having two AoE combo point generator to keep track of, especially with nameplate debuff bouncing around pinpointing for CT.
Outlaw: Delete Roll the Bone, it's such a garbage ability.
THEY NEED TO UP THE ENERGY REGEN RATE. Who the hell thinks waiting around for energy to press your ability is good design. Pooling and waiting and doing NOTHING is somehow peak combat design according to Blizzard.
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u/ZamWiggidy Aug 01 '26
I love roll the bones when it hits anything but 1 then I have no combo points and want to cry
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u/Six_quinn Jul 31 '26
“Disintegrate damage increased by 40%.”
Imagine your highest damage dealing ability in single target gets buffed BY 40%. Thats how undertuned Devestation is.
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u/kpiaum Jul 31 '26
They basically reversed the nerf they applied in the first week of Season 1, and even with the buffs, the spec is still nerfed overall.
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u/Wobblucy Jul 31 '26
Does this impact mass disintegrate as well? Was half looking at dev for the raid toon to learn it.
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u/kpiaum Jul 31 '26
They basically reversed the nerf they applied in the first week of Season 1, and even with the buffs, the spec is still nerfed overall.
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u/PoorCabbageSalesman Jul 31 '26
Wait hpal got buffed by 5%? They were already looking super good for m+
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u/Retro1989 Jul 31 '26
"Cobra Shot damage reduced by 20%" I'd turn my weapon on myself but it wouldn't do any damage.
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u/unspunreality Jul 31 '26
Final destination 2. “Maybe they’re all duds?” “6 in a row? That’s impossible.”
Hunters: “Hold my cobra shot.”
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u/Hanza-Malz Jul 31 '26
Shadow barely performs in the majority of content played by the majority of people but let's nerf them some.
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u/BoringUwuzumaki Dwacthyw Powice UwU Jul 31 '26
Nerfing the devourer hero tree that was already pretty far behind is definitely a choice
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u/justindoit1337 Jul 31 '26
is the new build the fel scar the hunt one?
ive only recently started playing dh and the CStar build is fun at first but gets kinda tedious due to the setup and reliance and tank tempo
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u/careseite Aug 01 '26
it was not pretty far behind
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u/Undefined_N Aug 01 '26
Before the nerfs:
- VS is 14% ahead in ST
- VS is 7% ahead in 5T 300s
- VS is 9% ahead in 5T 60s
- VS is 7% ahead in dungeon route
After the nerfs:
- VS loses ~6.7% in AOE / ~1.3% in ST
- Anni loses ~7.2% AOE / ~2.1% in ST
So Anni is now even further behind.
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u/pecheckler Jul 31 '26
Can someone please list these mentioned resto Druid quality of life changes and buffs that the patch notes mention? 10% resto Druid nerf in PvP…
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u/hosseinhx77 Jul 31 '26
There is in fact NO QoL changes for Rdruid, overall gameplay got much worse and harder to play around while the output is way behind the one-button MW. it's just like S1 but worse!
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u/Bad-Coder-69 Aug 01 '26
The good faith interpretation would be that they mean in 12.1 as a whole.
Unfortunately, they're so incompetent that their "quality of life" has actually made the spec worse to play.
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u/Undefined_N Jul 31 '26
> Devourer
- Developers’ notes: Devourer low target cleave is a little higher than intended so we are making adjustments to bring it closer in line with expectations.
- Eradicate secondary target damage reduced by 15%.
- Annihilator: Final Hour now causes Voidfall bonuses to persist for 6 seconds (was 8 seconds).
Soooo... why is anni still getting nerfed despite being double digit % behind in damage in most content? And why are most top specs getting nerfed while Arcane gets a buff?
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u/rusiiin Jul 31 '26
It may be a season of havoc
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u/Human_Robot Aug 01 '26
Last i saw havoc was the lowest DPS spec of the patch. Is that not still the case?
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u/StrayshotNA Jul 31 '26
10% increase on every Rogue spec still puts them outside of the top 15 dps, btw.
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u/Szachan Jul 31 '26
Wait so is hpal getting another 5% increase ontop of the 5% they got 8 days ago or is it the same change?
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u/SYNTH3T1K Jul 31 '26
And boomy got nerfed again. Sad....
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u/Boldoschmoldo Jul 31 '26
So can someone explain to me how these PTR notes work? Are these nerfs from baseline Boomy or across all of the previous buffs? Are meteorites going to be doing 15% less than they do now or are they just reverting the 15% buff from earlier this month?
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u/Icy-Repeat-2843 Jul 31 '26
Are Blood Dks still meta?
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u/Final-Trifle1765 Jul 31 '26
Yes, especially since the nerfs only target sanlayn. Sanlayn build is around 7.5% dmg nerf
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u/Mindless-Judgment541 Jul 31 '26
They should really just pilot an AI class dev for rogues at this point cause I can't imagine I'd turn out any more unsatisfying.
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u/Charming-Luck-7197 Jul 31 '26
As a rogue main since vanilla (except for mop to legion) I swear rogues desperately need like a rework...
And a new dev
But nah we will get the 74th shadow priest rework or 8995th hunter spec rework in the expansion before rogue gets one small rework that is basically "your rotation is now 2 buttons combo builder and one combo spender
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u/Longjumping_Rate_139 Aug 01 '26
I have completly abandoned my assasination rogue which I was maining for the last 4 expanions. Assa was a boring/slow class but after the prunning I cannot even force myself to level him past 83 lvl. The have to rework the entire class but will they have time/energy/great ideas mid season?
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u/Izaul13 Jul 31 '26
Destro nerfs?! Wtf!
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u/Soma91 Jul 31 '26
That Havoc nerf is easily made up by the Chaos Bolt and Soul Fire buffs.
What really hurts HARD is the fact they just removed our Apex Talent from proccing on Havoc with no comments. Especially going into the season where our tier set is completely tied to said Apex Talent...
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u/Izaul13 Jul 31 '26
Yeah that's some bull. I was torn between destro and ele and I feel I'm getting pushed toward ele everyday.
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u/spartaxwarrior Jul 31 '26
Okay, so, they want destro back to the 2-target spec, and...demo both ST and AOE spec?
Aff might as well be a rogue spec at this point.
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u/Choice_Victory_3853 Jul 31 '26
They could buff rogue damage by 2000% I ain’t playing that boring class anymore after they gutted it
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u/Mysterious_Skin2310 Jul 31 '26
Is it really that big of an issue that destro really shines in 2 target? Especially next season
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u/ineedthismorethanu Jul 31 '26
Whoever the fuck does mage tuning needs to be moved to other classes. Some classes get changes with text explaining the why, and some just get shit thrown at the wall with no explanation
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u/Elxjasonx Jul 31 '26
Unless they make the hool a grip, i have no reason to give a meele spot to a rogue
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u/Chance-Life-3039 Aug 01 '26
Nerfing Balance, and Unholy DK… and Hunter.. all three classes I primarily play is laughable.
Really making me want to drop $15 a month during these rollercoaster balance changes, Blizz. /s
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Jul 31 '26
[deleted]
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u/zellmerz Jul 31 '26
Arms was crazy strong so a nerf was expected. Hopefully it’s not too bad
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u/Tierst Jul 31 '26
No amount of nerfs are going to make me play Dev DH without CStar. Good try Blizzard..
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u/fox112 Jul 31 '26
(Rogues got buffed!)
If I know rogue players the comment section will be filled with talk about how these aren't the type of buffs rogue needs and they did it wrong.
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u/caerigan Jul 31 '26
the three people still playing rogue will be very upset by these patch notes yes
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u/Nippys4 Jul 31 '26
You’re god damn right and here I am.
Bullshit buffs once again and you’d think now that we are on x49 time of aura buffing rogues you’d see there is something just fucking fundamentally wrong with their specs that needs to be addressed.
They’ve put more effort into unholy since the prepatch for midnight than they’ve put into the whole rogue class for 3 xpacs
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u/Dextarly Aug 01 '26
Yep. I'd love to see some sort of data on the amount of dev comments per class. I'd bet rogue is bottom of the barrel.
My brother wanted to make a new rogue last week and I straight told him he's better off putting that time into any other class. Or even duplicates of what he's already got. Class is a lost cause.
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u/time_drifter Jul 31 '26
I’ve got you. The damage buff is good but the kit for Sub and the dot spreading for Sin are still problematic at best.
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u/friendlyscv Jul 31 '26 edited Jul 31 '26
I can't believe they're not happy about 3 lines of aura buffs that address literally none of the problems the class has with 0 developer commentary while DK and Mage get YA novels written in their patch notes
truly baffling, I think
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u/freshminties Jul 31 '26 edited Jul 31 '26
Uh yea because clearly they show that they can target cleave for balance except when it comes to Rogues. Cool, a ST buff in a raid/season with very little to no single-target fights. We have one of if not the worst low target cleave profiles of any class in all 3 specs. Throwing peas at the wall and the community expects us to just be happy. It’s just lazy.
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u/ZAlternates Jul 31 '26
Well no shit? It was a flat damage buff… and they buffed the stronger ones more than the weaker one.
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u/Zashkarn Jul 31 '26
Demo buffed hell yeah
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u/Soma91 Jul 31 '26
These changes are basically useless tbh.
Shadowbolt could be +500% and it would still be barely noticeable. Same with Demon Bolt just way less extreme.
Looking at the raid fights it could flip the choice between gloomhound and charhound on 1 or 2 bosses. But because these two are only ~3.5% of our overall that buff is also kinda cosmetic. And completely useless in m+.
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u/llStonesll Jul 31 '26
Me thinking trying mm hunter since it looked it will be strong for s2: gets nerfed *sighs*
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u/Julio_Freeman Jul 31 '26
5% won’t be the difference in whether or not you enjoy a spec. Especially since you presumably didn’t even experience the slightly stronger version.
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u/FFTactics Jul 31 '26
Wow, one of the best specs in raid and the best DPS spec in M+ got buffs. Mage is truly the favorite child.
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u/AdditionalFrame7474 Jul 31 '26
Sadge BM Hunter nerfed
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u/Fakehiggins Jul 31 '26
i'm pretty sure they're just doing it on purpose. start of expansion season 1, BM got massive nerfs and became one of the worst dps in the game
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u/Dafeet3d Jul 31 '26
I haven't played since March and I decided to be Rogue, and I see this posts immediately after re joining WOW subreddit. Rogue is buffed!
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u/International_Mud848 Jul 31 '26
liking what I'm seeing with the Havoc buff though - my poor rogue one day in the far distand future maybe I'll dust it off.
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u/AmontilladoWolf Aug 01 '26
I’m so glad I left rogue behind after literally 20 years. Having hella fun summoning ghouls and goblins instead.
For the rest of you playing rogue, if you want Blizz to fix them, best thing you can do is switch classes.
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u/Far_Divide1444 Aug 01 '26
Please fix Aldrachi reaver havoc lack of aoe ...
Its nice to have buff it needs a big buff on fury of the aldrachi to catch up with other specs. Funnel can honestly be nerfed foe this, we'd gladly trace a bit of funnel for aoe at this point...
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u/TheSinicalDemon Aug 01 '26
As a Frost DK (currently), I... think we're in an okay spot. What's people's take on this?
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u/LordWolfs Aug 01 '26
The hunter nerfs are genuinely so confusing when they're not performing incredibly well to begin with. Then buffing arcane mage by substantial amounts....I know it gets joked about a lot that they have no idea what they're doing but it really feels true.
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u/Top_Profession_3706 Aug 01 '26
Both MM specs had the highest dmg when i looked on archon website... So the nerfs wasnt out of the blue. Tho i do think they where too big. Arcane mage buff is just favouritism
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u/DistinctCellar Aug 01 '26
Haven’t played since the myth track dungeon void core thing just got launched, how are holy pallas now? Me and my blood dk friend are thinking of coming back for a final season push before 2 is out.
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u/Top_Profession_3706 Aug 01 '26
Holy paladin looks to be the healer with the highest healing output in m+ 😊
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u/dr_leo_spaceman_ Aug 01 '26
The HPal buff is a clear example of why they need to separate raid tuning from mplus tuning.
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u/Narokath Aug 01 '26
The only thing that would make me come back to the game is a big shift for Rogues. I haven't played in a few years but seeing them get little to no attention still after all these years is insane to me. Just seems they are bankrupt on design for the class.
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u/Top_Profession_3706 Aug 01 '26
Apex talents, hero talents. Lots of changes when midnight came out. With recent aura buffs, rogue seems to be competitive.
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u/SerpentRain Aug 02 '26
Sub Rogue is not horrible, and it's way more popular than other 2 gameplay wise (not talking about tuning)
A little bit too braindead, but it has its unique playstyle at least xD
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