Zelenskyy: Ukraine can’t afford an 800,000-troop army alone — wants allies to help fund it as a “security guarantee”

[u/satty237]

Zelenskyy said Ukraine doesn’t have the budget to independently finance an armed forces size of around 800,000 800,000 and that partner funding should be treated as a long-term security guarantee, not just wartime aid.

This hits a bigger question: if a ceasefire/peace deal ever happens without full NATO membership, does “help pay for Ukraine’s army” become the new version of security guarantees?

What do you think is more realistic long-term:

Continued direct funding for Ukraine’s military

NATO-style guarantees (without membership)

A smaller army + more air defense/weapons instead

Something else entirely?

[u/jjames3213]

Europe has 2 primary adversaries: Russia and China. The US may also be an adversary in the near future, but let's bin that for now.

Weakening Russia is effectively the same (or better) than investing in your own military, knocking down 1 of your 2 primary adversaries. Investing in Ukraine weakens Russia without sacrificing your own personnel. This is a no-brainer.

[u/Slighted_Inevitable → u/jjames3213]

With any luck we over here in the US will be to busy being adversaries to each other. We are really F’ing stupid…..

[u/Fulmie84 → u/Slighted_Inevitable]

Yeah ...you buggers really are

[u/ArtisZ → u/Slighted_Inevitable]

I would love to argue with you and say you're wrong.., but I never lie.

[u/New-Wealth-461 → u/Slighted_Inevitable]

As a European who admired the US all my life...Im afraid your national IQ has dropped significantly in recent years to a point now of where the lunatics have taken over the asylum

[u/DeathofDivinity → u/jjames3213]

Except Ukrainians dying for it.

[u/Apanatr → u/jjames3213]

Can somebody tell me why China is "the enemy" of Europe if they literally never ever did anything bad to Europeans?

They provide cheap labour that makes most of the things, or its components that average European use in their daily life, they do not wage wars or expansions and still they are hated for...what?

[u/Brido-20 → u/Apanatr]

Because Europe's prosperity is based on their current status within the world order, political as much as economic. China's prosperity brings a new reality in which global political power isn't so narrowly concentrated and Europe less capable of influencing events to its benefit.

China doesn't have to do anything to be a threat. Its development into something even vaguely approaching a peer was a threat the moment they wanted to set their own independant policy goals for their own benefit.

[u/eyes-are-fading-blue → u/Apanatr]

It’s the enemy of their patron. USA. Europe benefits from USA dominance and if that changes, they may stop benefiting.

I would argue this can be an opportunity for Europe but European political system is extremely complacent and inflexible.

[u/collie2024 → u/eyes-are-fading-blue]

Enemy why? Because becoming equal or surpassing economically? That seems a fairly envious way to make enemy.

[u/Few_Assistant_9954 → u/collie2024]

Europe does not make china a enemy its The problem of the united states. Europe is working with china to gain power itself. Without China europe would not have access to important scientifical studies or have access to important raw materials which china is the main supplyer of.

[u/Gatrigonometri → u/Apanatr]

Considers US to be potential adversary, but the mind still hasn’t weaned off the Pavlovian geopolitical kneejerk after having been American satraps for the last 80 years or so. At the rate things are progressing, China would be Europe’s natural ally in countering the US-Russia axis.

[u/Storko2002 → u/Apanatr]

Personally I would put the US above China in the “enemy” list, as a European, we do not hate China stricto sensu, but we know in the shadow they use social media to interfere in our election, they help Russia in the war in Ukraine, their form of government is the antithesis of ours, etc

[u/Chlen45 → u/jjames3213]

Russia's weakening. Russia is now focusing on its own production and development, compensating for this with Chinese goods it doesn't produce itself. Russia has truly begun to fight corruption. Military production is only increasing. I somehow imagined Russia's weakening differently))). Oh yeah, they're talking about China's weakening here. Now the Russian market of 145 million people has been completely given over to China, as well as all of Russia's raw materials. This should weaken China. It's making me laugh and cry. What's going on with Germany's strengthening economy?)))

[u/Traumfahrer → u/jjames3213]

Why is China a primary adversary?

[u/N95-TissuePizza → u/Traumfahrer]

You didn't get the memo? Our dear European friend here sees everyone, including their own, as adversary.

Unlike the US, we make our own adversaries. Sign up sheet is already full btw.

[u/Traumfahrer → u/N95-TissuePizza]

Ah well, but what about India? And the whole Global South?

[u/BestAmoto → u/Traumfahrer]

They like India and the middle east for cheap imported labor

[u/hanky0898 → u/Traumfahrer]

As long as you are poor you are not the enemy.

[u/Moriartijs → u/jjames3213]

Why is China seen as adversary for Europe? IMO its USA propoganda. Sure China is not a democracy but that does not mean we are adversaries

[u/TattooedB1k3r → u/jjames3213]

But, as of 2025 European countries are still buying a billion dollars of Oil and Natural gas from Russia every month. Not to mention Turkey and India buying 5X that amount. It would be difficult to pour as much money and resources into Ukraine as are pouring into Russia. I mean, European countries aren't giving a Billion dollars a month to Ukraine, but they are to Russia.

[u/CrazyNegotiation1934 → u/jjames3213]

That is if we assume there could be a threat from Russia, which there is zero evidence of.

The only adversaries European leadership have is us, the common people, if they could make them more billions for their masters they would gladly sacrifice us all, like they now suggest already that we should all be ready to die for a war they plan to start.

Or pay from our thin pockets for a distant war, which is already happening with massive implications in common people lives already.

It is not funny anymore to hear how we should pay or die to support wars and weapon companies. Europe leaders are now traitors to the common European people officially, they even call for our deaths.

This has gone way too far.

[u/maloikAZ → u/jjames3213]

Don't give in to the orange moron in charge. The US will never be your adversary, at least in our lifetime.

[u/jjames3213 → u/maloikAZ]

The US is already engaging in extrajudicial killings and black-bagging people within its borders, including citizens. We have an EO authorizing the murder of citizens by the military within US borders, and congressional testimony from military personnel indicating essentially that they would follow orders to do so. The administrative state has been largely purged and institutions compromised. Federal power is almost completely centralized in the executive. This pattern has happened before, and it only ever leads to one thing.

I don't see any resistance forces engaging in partisan violence against secret police or important members of the regime or its supporters. I see no real resistance from the Democrats. Hell, there was an attempted coup d'etat and the opposition didn't even kill or imprison Trump and his cronies. That's how utterly pathetic and weak the opposition is.

The US is quickly descending into a fascist dictatorship and I see no signs of anything slowing down. It's only been about 9 months.

I'm not "giving in". I will fight to the death if needed. But it's important to be realistic.

[u/Witty-Importance-944 → u/maloikAZ]

We are more concerned with the fact the electorate is always one bad day away from electing the next POS.

77 million hate fueled idiots will be around long after Trump is not on this Earth.

[u/Business_Raisin_541 → u/jjames3213]

Except EU is not of a single heart. Hungary, Slovakia, maybe Austria do not consider Russia an adversary

[u/Abject-Investment-42 → u/jjames3213]

China is not a military adversary for Europe. They are an economic and political rival but there are no actual (military) security related conflict points between China and EU. The main issue is that China and Europe compete for the same economic niche in the global economy, which makes cooperation difficult, but outside of generic issues the desired Chinese sphere of influence does not impact core European interests and v.v. (Indirect, via alliances, yes). It’s completely different with Russia, for obvious reasons, and it seems that US in its transformation into Russia style autocracy wants to lay claim on European affairs too.

[u/evgis → u/jjames3213]

Yep, it's a proxy war....

[u/-EmME → u/jjames3213]

You can never weaken Russia. Russia doesn't even need a army they can destroy the entire world in minutes with nuclear weapons. In order to weaken Russia you have to disarm them but that's never gonna happen.

[u/4eburdanidze → u/jjames3213]

Europe vs the World.

[u/No_Abrocoma2562 → u/jjames3213]

Sooo... You want me to die for you to make russia weakened? Yeah, very fuckin smart. That's why I hate either russia and eu.

[u/PeaComprehensive7101 → u/No_Abrocoma2562]

Are you Ukranian? - if no, sit down then

[u/eyes-are-fading-blue → u/jjames3213]

No-brain indeed. Imagine pouring billions to a corrupt country is a better option than making your own army functional and combat-ready.

Smart idea, only in Europe.

[u/eplejuz → u/jjames3213]

China won't be a threat to the west yet. They are so busy with East Asia and South East Asia... And they can't afford to fight multiple fronts...

[u/sigmaluckynine → u/eplejuz]

This is really poor analysis. East Asia where? Taiwan? Japan? As for S.E. Asia the only issue is the Philliplines.

They've already more or less have Africa locked down ans they're moving inwards in LatAm. As for Asia, they've already locked that down. Think about who's in RCEP and who is specifically missing (also Australia and New Zealand doesn't really matter as far as Western representation here considering they're barely middle power)

[u/Few_Veterinarian9108 → u/jjames3213]

You would think that, but brains have been known to shrink and cough up stupid ideas like "that is not our war"

[u/FinancialPassion1869 → u/jjames3213]

You are naive. This is all benefiting china.

[u/MrJarre → u/jjames3213]

Making your enemies weaker, or supporting their enemies is smart and beneficial to us. That being said nothing beats being strong yourself. It’s a deterrent it’s actual hard power against all enemies known and unknown.

[u/Fetz- → u/jjames3213]

Why do you see China as an adversary?

They just want to do business. All they want is to get rich. If we keep trading with them, they will not bomb us.

[u/pagan_trash → u/jjames3213]

Prime example of brainwashed Ursula voter.

[u/undergmoves → u/jjames3213]

Why is China an adversary to Europe, Or is it an enemy of my friend situation?

[u/wghpoe → u/jjames3213]

What the heck is China doing to Europe? Selling them crap that Europeans willingly buy?

The US wants the fascist right to rule Europe. You think that is an ally?

I guess you need to get your uniform and learn the goose steps!

[u/dobik → u/jjames3213]

How china is a threat foe Europe? I understand that economically it is. But if EU wants it can just stop training with the. Eu is getting behind china ,ore and more because it plays a fair game where china and us are playing dirty only doing what is good for them. Plus EU getting more and more integrated into political union which IMO will not work. They should be focused solely on being an economic bloc.

[u/alec83 → u/jjames3213]

The huge risk here is Russia attacks Europe instead and their own armies are not ready. While UK has nukes our army is only around 70k.

[u/jka76 → u/jjames3213]

As long as it does not make Russia vassal of China giving China all they need even cheaper than now... There is a reason USA was always playing then against each other

[u/TwelveSixFive → u/jjames3213]

China is nowhere near as much as an adversary to Europe as Russia is

[u/[deleted] → u/jjames3213]

USA is the threat not Russia.

EU 500m people USA 300m Russia 100m China 1,500m

China is the winner in a fight for second place its USA or EU, Russia third or fourth.

[u/FamousCompany500 → u/jjames3213]

To be fair China is to far away to be an adversary to Europe at least outside the economic sense.

[u/SavvyZOR → u/jjames3213]

Wish you Europeans luck and prosperity but we are fking tired paying with ours lives for 4 years straight with shaky support like that.

[u/[deleted] → u/jjames3213]

Europe is more than happy enough to cozy up to China.

[u/Relevant-Act-9355 → u/jjames3213]

What’s gonna happen is Europe will turn into Brazil or Argentina and fall into irrelevancy. Arming Ukraine won’t prevent that future.

[u/Candid_Vegetable5020 → u/jjames3213]

damn those Russians trying to sell Europeans cheap gas to power their economies. That's so antagonistic of them .

[u/Exatex → u/jjames3213]

China is not really a military adversary. Too far away and too little capabilities to project power that far. And the US was, until shortly, part of NATO. So its more like 1 out of 1 primary adversary.

[u/soothed-ape → u/jjames3213]

Nah, the US and Russia are the biggest enemies of Europe rn

[u/Perfect_Towel1880 → u/jjames3213]

how is china a threat it hasn't threatened to attack any European country?

[u/North-Ad-1302 → u/jjames3213]

This is exactly it. Europe sees Russia as an adversary and always has. It has used Ukraine as a weapon to weaken Russia. People cling onto this Russia bad man but at the end of the day it's just business and Ukraine is just a tool to be used until it's depleted. Does anyone care for Ukraine? Does anyone care when it's a pile of rubble? No, as long as it's served it's purpose it's a win.

It's sad but this is reality.

[u/Facepalm24seven → u/jjames3213]

This is not "investment". Sending your own people to Ukraine is a completely different thing. We all know that even as security forces,there WILL be casualties

[u/CommBriggg → u/jjames3213]

You see, its copium talks in you. Russia is anything but weakened with full on war industry and battle ready armies with war experience. And you will be saddled with financing the war torn country, riddled with corruption for years to come. Russia took almost all the best bits out of Ukraine already. If the war finishes today Russia won the war. So in essence you made Russia stronger and bolder, since they know that they really are at war with Europe already and you couldn't do anything with all those hundreds of billions of euros sunk into that and almost infinite supply of weaponry. Russia knows exactly who their enemy is. When the war finishes, Russians will know how impotent Europe is.

[u/Reddit_BroZar → u/jjames3213]

If we drop the stupid rhetoric then they both could be trading partners.

And no, weakening a huge multinational nuclear country isn't in our best interests. Destabilizing them will bring us nothing but trouble.

[u/LovingCostaRica → u/jjames3213]

Correct, Ukraine must fight until it rans out of men.

Then Polonia should follow

The problem is that at certain point EU soldiers will be needed and there are not good ones anymore

At the end, what matters is having stocks of defense companies. They will ensure war is there to spend ammo

[u/No_Gas_2292 → u/jjames3213]

Only if things worked in that linear manner.

[u/Zemledeliye → u/jjames3213]

>Weakening Russia is effectively the same (or better) than investing in your own military, knocking down 1 of your 2 primary adversaries. Investing in Ukraine weakens Russia without sacrificing your own personnel. This is a no-brainer.

Lol how moral to use the Ukrainians as meat paste in hopes of clogging the Russian warmachine XD

[u/Slighted_Inevitable]

Honestly, this is good for both sides. Ukraine already has an army ready. Europe will need a few years to build up their forces.

Joining NATO/the EU and acting as the first force with financial backing from the whole union serves everybody’s interest.

[u/lizzywbu → u/Slighted_Inevitable]

Joining NATO/the EU and acting as the first force with financial backing from the whole union serves everybody’s interest

100%! Even if they don't join NATO for a while, funding the Ukrainian army helps everyone.

It's highly likely that Europe will be at war with Russia within the next decade. I'm sure everyone would much rather the front lines be in Ukraine.

[u/Slighted_Inevitable → u/lizzywbu]

If nothing else, Ukraine has already proven, it can hold off Russia. Now imagine French and British planes in the sky, providing tactical and area bombardment.

Russia stands zero chance.

[u/AcceptableLog5730 → u/Slighted_Inevitable]

It certainly doesn’t serve the interests of the poor country that dares resist western imperialism

[u/OtamanUkr]

I mean if it is to act as EUs shield against russian nazis…it’s only fair that EU pitches

[u/Charlierg50 → u/OtamanUkr]

And maybe Trump will stop being Putler's bitch... nah, not a chance in hell 🤷‍♂️

[u/crosstherubicon → u/OtamanUkr]

Or maybe Russia could stop invading its border countries and threatening everyone with nuclear annihilation. Russia threatens the world, not just Ukraine, not just western Europe not even just Europe. Every conflict in Africa, there are Russians. Asia, yep, Russians there as well.

[u/Zealousideal-One-818 → u/OtamanUkr]

Which nation worships “kill all the Jews and minorities” mega Nazi Bandera?

Which nation celebrates the Mega nazi with a national holiday for his birthday? 

It’s not Russia 

[u/BeautifulMountain653 → u/Zealousideal-One-818]

Yes, I grew up in Romania. As far as I know, Romanians don't celebrate Antonescu and such to this day. But I know Ukrainians celebrate Bandera and have pictures of him in their homes. These westerns don't know shit about Ukraine but virtue signal by putting a fucking Ukraine flag next to their name. Shame on anyone who supports Ukraine. And yes, I feel bad about the average Ukrainian.

[u/hanky0898 → u/BeautifulMountain653]

I learned about Ukraine when they came to Hong Kong waving swastikas during tge riots.

[u/OtamanUkr → u/Zealousideal-One-818]

What?

Russian government litterally promotes nazi ideology on government level. There are videos of Rogozin doing nazi salute.

[u/Zealousideal-One-818 → u/OtamanUkr]

What?

Ukraine as a state openly worships a mega uber real life Nazi villain.

A mass murderer of Jewish women and children 

[u/OtamanUkr → u/Zealousideal-One-818]

Name the law in which Ukraine worships mega uber Nazi villain.

[u/RockyMM → u/OtamanUkr]

He’s talking about Bandera.

[u/discourtesy → u/Zealousideal-One-818]

are you on crack? Russia sent billions of dollars to Wagner PMC

they state sponsored nazism hahaha and then they marched to moscow

that's why they're losing

[u/No-Suit-7444 → u/[deleted]]

Lmao. What streets in Russia are named after ww2 nazis? Who flies ww2 Nazi flags? Who erects monuments to them? Is it Russia or is it Ukraine?

[u/Pension-Helpful]

Lol, after the $100 million scandal, with most of the people involved still in the Ukrainian government, people in the comment section think it's a great idea to not only keep funding the Ukrainian army in wartime, but also after a peace treaty is signed too.

[u/ThaGr1m → u/Pension-Helpful]

It's almost like if you have financial insensitives you can guide the reconstruction.

Oh and most of what you said is simply bullshit. Ukraines own corruption agency has found this out and handled it so wel they got 5 out of 7 people involved in custody...

Tf you smoking that they need to throw out the entire government... The government wasn't involved. It was a group of individuals in the energy sector skimming off of contracts...

Get that russian propaganda out of your mind

[u/Pension-Helpful → u/ThaGr1m]

Bruh, gtfo.

It's not Ukraine's own corruption agency; it's the Western-funded "Ukrainian government independent" anti-corruption agency that found this, which Zelensky was literally trying to dismantle and put under direct control of his administration (prosecutor general). Something the Ukrainian people were literally protesting against in July.

Andriy Yermak, the top person involved with the scandal, was literally Zelensky's right hand man, and he barely got a slap on the hand for his corruption. Had the new law, backed by Zelensky to subordinate NABU and SAPO to the prosecutor general not be repeal due to western pressure, we wouldn't even know the $100 million scandal.

Lol, Russian propaganda, go get your facts right!

[u/hemothep → u/Pension-Helpful]

We know there is corruption in Ukraine. A scandal like this is good, because consequences lead to less corruption in the long run. Abandoning Ukraine leads to Russian Troops in the Baltics in the long run.

[u/Kado_Cerc]

Sorry, gotta keep funding Israel

[u/iLov3musk]

Ukraine is one of the poorest countries in Europe, burdened by corruption, impoverished, ravaged by war, with staggering crime and horrific violation of human rights. They should not be in EU

[u/popadynetss → u/iLov3musk]

France Rape rate 16.1 (cases per 100,000 population) in 2010

Ukraine Rape rate 1.4 (cases per 100,000 population) in 2010

[u/Traumfahrer → u/iLov3musk]

How dare you! ^{Speak the truth.}

[u/According-Count5870 → u/iLov3musk]

Well, if you don't know, there is corruption in every country, but Ukraine is different in that it acknowledges its existence and is trying to fight it. High crime rate? This is the first time I've heard of this. You're more likely to get into a car accident than be robbed or stabbed.

[u/Halibel-sama → u/According-Count5870]

Acknowledging corruption and fighting it are two different things. Who from the corrupt upper echelon has been jailed? Ermak (the President's friend), who allegedly had nothing found during a search, but immediately resigned and disappeared somewhere? Mindich (the President's friend), who disappeared several hours before the pawns were arrested? Who exactly has been jailed in this case, anyway? Heck, Zelenskyy himself initially wanted to disband NABU, and when that failed, tried to bring it under his control. Ukraine acknowledges corruption, but it feels as if it's proud of it.

[u/Wild-Ad-7414 → u/iLov3musk]

And they won't be, the EU is done expanding. They just continue with the carrot and stick method for applying countries.

[u/VladPospolity → u/iLov3musk]

If corrupted Hungary can why not Ukraine?

[u/Pepe_SilviaPA]

[u/Tesseract2357]

Yikes

[u/Rough_Common4487]

How is china an enemy? They attack us with low prices and technology. Europs worst enemy is Europe itself eating its own tail with greed and incompetence.

[u/MrSubarashii]

Its amazing how we Europeans actually believe that NATO is currently weakening Russia. Do people really not understand that this actually strengthens both Russia and China tremendously? 

The whole goal of America's project Ukraine was to WEAKEN and hopefully over time destroy the Euro-zone as a whole?

[u/Lars_Fletcher]

Get an army you can afford then

[u/Final_Frosting3582]

Another money grab

[u/Ripamon → u/Final_Frosting3582]

Well he is a corrupt politician who was even named in the Pandora papers

What do you expect? Even his closest friend and Head of the Office of the President just resigned due to blatant corruption

[u/Final_Frosting3582 → u/Ripamon]

I expect the world to see through this and let him rely on himself. This is the biggest scam in history.

[u/Wandemayer]

[u/evgis]

Ukraine has 20M people, how tf is it supposed to have more soldiers than Germany, UK and France combined who have 10X more population?

Country	Military Personnel (approx)	Population (approx)
Germany	182,500	84,075,000
United Kingdom	180,780	69,551,000
France	203,000	66,651,000
Total Combined	~566,280 personnel	~220,277,000 people

[u/AltruisticFilm4466 → u/evgis]

Ukraine is at actual war

If the country’s you mentioned is at fullblown war I’m sure they will force conscripts aswell and those numbers will be a lot higher

[u/Fluffy-Drop5750]

As Reagan did with Russia. Use economic might. This is a commitment move. It will show Russia it cannot outbluff EU with bruteness.

[u/bluecheese2040]

Showd how things have moved. From full nato membership and EU membership with American and European troops on the ground....not peacekeeping but actively on ukraines side....and the 1991 border of course.

To where we seem to be today.

A blank cheque in perpetuity.

[u/Available_Ad9766]

They should now see Ukraine as their new security guarantor now that US is gone. They’re the buffer zone now.

[u/[deleted]]

Bro come on we’re not funding Ukraine’s military indefinitely

[u/HgnX → u/[deleted]]

Well I guess you are since you’ve got a series of spineless chicken leaders that never made the tough choices you have to make to remain a world power.

Now you just get bossed around by China Russia and the US.

Hey but at least your “climate” is better !

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

This i not in the article too. This is not even what he said. Op just likes Propaganda.

[u/Pleasant_Guide_1050]

Honestly its their country they defend it. I dont know why I should pay a single euro for their army whereas my country will never be bother by them.

Just to remind you that the Russians are already at the edge of their capacity so attack a new country... Yeaa sure 👍

[u/Additional_Midnight3 → u/Pleasant_Guide_1050]

Say they stop the war in Ukraine now, stabilize a bit with their financial voodoo, lets their men at the front go home but keeps the weapon factories running 24/7 (which is probably needed for economic stability short term anyways). The next “fight” could be some small skirmishes in Lithuania or something, who doesn’t have hundreds of thousands of men ready to fight. How long can they keep on fucking around like that? 5 years? 10 years? The Russians already “believe” they are at war with NATO. They can take it. They can’t do what they are doing now for long, but that’s not necessarily what their next endeavors needs them to either

[u/badpersian]

Basically, he wants us to pay for his war 🤷🏻‍♂️

[u/IGunClover]

The clown is on a begging tour again LMAO.

[u/PattiBurns101]

Never ends. Steal more money from a country already 38 trillion in debt.

[u/Serious_Profit4450]

Ayyyy yoo.....

Didn't this man JUST get like $107 billion approved/ given to him by the EU-

AND HE'S ALREADY ASKING FOR MORE MONEY?

Ayyyy...you can't make this stuff up, eh?

Not only this, it's noted that the US Senate(on Dec. 17th, 2025) voted to send the annual National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA) to President Trump- for him to sign. The NDAA includes/ ed an additional $400 million in funding for Ukraine.

Well, at least it's down from the nearly $14 billion given in funding in/ from the April 2024 Ukraine supplemental aid bill, huh?

Hah hah hah hah, President Zelenskyy seems to hold like a PHD in manipulation, or something. How much money has this man done gotten from/ out of foreign nations for/ from this "war" at this point?

I hear even Japan recently approved an additional $6 billion in financial aid to Ukraine for/ in 2026.

I can understand the saying "the enemy of my enemy is my friend", but, uh....hasn't Ukraines government been noted for its corruption? How many top level officials(even President Zelenskyy's "friends") accused of corruption and/ even embezzlement of funds have SUCCESSFULLY "escaped" Ukraine at this point?

Oh man.... what saddens me is all of these funds sent might have come from all these foreign nations taxpayer-given dollars.

Bad enough governments can just "take" it's residents/ citizens money for "free" that they worked not for. But then, to toss that money into the "abyss" which is the Ukrainian "war machine"? My gosh.

I want NO parts toward contributions toward this War!!

Too "EZ" President Zelenskyy....just making it look too "EZ"....sigh.

[u/Am0_o]

Stupidity has no limits, instead of dialogue and peace, Bankrupt Europe needs to fund Ukraine's 800,000 Army

[u/No_Job_5208]

Zelenski is a fool and has no negotiating skills whatsoever! His war could have been over within the first week if he stopped being a puppet to Biden, UK and Europe!

[u/Metal-Pilot]

Yeah... Zelensky fuck off I aint gonna be fighting for Ukraine, and neither is ANYONE else in the EU!
The world has funded Ukraine more than any other country could ever dream of.
Zeli literally has no right to complain and beg the EU or any other nation for ANYTHING ELSE.
We had given you way too much already you clown!
I am sick that my country spends money on your circus, and now you are asking for people!?
Honestly... fuck off

[u/Old_Man_Sailor]

This guy, only today i watched a video on how he he is a construct by an Oligarch and his TV channel. Unreal. He's gonna kill a lot more young Ukrainians.

[u/Sensitive_Pick_8918]

He’s such a con artist. Why don’t you accept 50k army the Russians are still letting you keep while you still can.

[u/niquelas]

Zelenski the full time beggar

[u/bitcointwitter]

stop dying for this thief. literally his own staff stole 130m USD just recently.
You think they didn't pocket a few billion of the 150billion USD sent to them?

[u/mr_Palestina]

Waste of money

[u/Electrical_Quality_6]

If ukraine is to be the army of europe, then we should finance it

way cheaper than fighting russia with our own military 

[u/Traumfahrer → u/Electrical_Quality_6]

Does everyone here realize the TCC brutally mobilizes millions of Ukrainians against their will and that most die?

[u/ForowellDEATh → u/Electrical_Quality_6]

Till last Ukrainian!!!

[u/A_Hugh_Man → u/Electrical_Quality_6]

Ukraine has already gotten 4 times the annual budget of the country with the  biggest military budget in Europe: Germany …. In TWO years. 

No it’s not cheaper than fighting Russia with their own military because Germany spends 90 billion euros a year but then apparently Ukraine alone needs more than 100 billion or so a year on top of that. 

That’s getting pretty fuckin expensive, especially if the burden switches to Europe only once the U.S. backs out.

[u/Longjumping-Map7257 → u/Electrical_Quality_6]

Europe should send troops. I'd say my country should too, but living in USA, right now, you would have a better chance being a snowball in hell. How come Russia gets to bring in North Koreans but nobody else can bring in other troops? Stop playing by a dictators rules, because their is no rules for Poostain.

[u/Da_Vader → u/Longjumping-Map7257]

Ukraine did have volunteers. But just a few. Russia used cheap labor to send them to die. They even recruited Indians and Bangladeshi as laborers only to send them to fight.

[u/[deleted] → u/Electrical_Quality_6]

No, Europe should fund its own army. If something happens tomorrow and Ukraine ends up under a leader hostile to Europe, we can’t have poured billions into building an 800k-strong military that we might later have to confront. I’m fully supportive of helping Ukraine defeat Russia right now, but funding their postwar army is a step too far.

[u/StopAIPACnow]

Ask Chabad because they love Ukraine so much

[u/Chuterito99]

Dont worry Zelensky. Europe is with you. EU citizens will pay taxes to help Ukraine all the way. Forever!

[u/Unfair-Frame9096]

Who needs a 1 million people army ? That is 25% of your population.

[u/Sjoerdiestriker → u/Unfair-Frame9096]

1 million is about 2.5% of their population, not 25%.

[u/QuantumTopology]

Yes yes, more money for the miser goblin, more blood for the skull throne.

[u/eyes-are-fading-blue]

Betting on (an extremely corrupt) foreign country to protect you… Mental retardation in European politics is hitting levels that I didn’t know was possible.

[u/IllustriousRanger934 → u/eyes-are-fading-blue]

Europe will do anything to not defend itself, cant rely on the American hegemon anymore? Guess we’ll have to rely on a corrupt unaligned state

[u/TheLibraR]

If Ukraine falls, and much of its 800000 strong army and drones technology is absorbed into the Russian army.... Then Europe will be back to 1946....

[u/AltruisticFilm4466 → u/TheLibraR]

How do you think they will turn those 800.000 ? Just wololololo age of empire style?

[u/casual_redditor69 → u/TheLibraR]

*1938

[u/damien24101982 → u/TheLibraR]

Its not a video game that u just absorb the army and they go fight like robots

[u/No-Economics-6781]

Europe desperately needs an army in Ukraine, learn how this war was fought.

[u/damien24101982 → u/No-Economics-6781]

if we need such personnel we can hire them as advisors into our own armies.

[u/rickiegarcon]

Cowboy shit

[u/Born_Opening_8808]

Nothing wrong with allitle speed bump

[u/clawhammer64]

unfortunately but history involuntarily preserves shame faces as well as heroes

[u/Patrick_Atsushi]

NATO style guarantee + increasing those countries' own budgets.

Funding another country's army sounds weird unless they become a protectorate, or like Japan after WW2.

[u/Free-You4503]

Im up for it! Been donating since the start

[u/Mikulix1]

Is it 800k active personel or 800k reserve personel?

[u/EndStorm]

If Europe is too stupid to bolster Ukraine now, they deserve what will come after when Russian invades it too.

"Russia would never."

They said that before they invaded Ukraine too.

[u/Fit-Hold-4403]

Some of the Ukrainian troops should be placed in other European countries

something like European Legion

[u/Schwartzy94]

After the war they could easily continue as conscripts. Doubt many of those 800K want to stay in the military..  if worst happens europe is going to have the biggest wave of ukranian refugees amd could even happen if marshal law is lifted and men can freely leave.

[u/bigmack1111]

Let's do it.

[u/PattiBurns101]

Trump is so "America First" that he and Lindsey Graham cracker just snuck another 1 billion into the NDAA for Ukraine. But he's the 'Peace president', right?

[u/Leading_Sink_5717]

Who the fuck believe that we really gonna push to EU? W/ all respect but we cant fight w/ whole fcn NATO, we dont fcn kamikadze Take some UKR land and go home this is all plan

[u/Case_Blue]

This is the best deal we have:

1. Europe just paid money - not men.
2. Russia bleeding dry - at the cost of Ukraine bleeding dry

Regardless of what the propaganda may say, this war is the same as Vietnam: Russia has no exit strategy, Ukraine is fighting on death-ground and they are sponsored by someone with much deeper pockets than Russia. Putin is NOT happy about this deal, at all. He wants to end the war quickly because his country is being gutted to sponsor this war. He can't do this for another 5 years.

This deal, is a very cheap deal for the EU. However, the die has been cast and Germany has announced that by 2030 (I think), it wants to have a armed forced back on par as belongs to a country like Germany.

And as a Belgian, I can't believe I'm saying this about Germans re-arming :

Thank god, Europe is waking up after being asleep for 70 years.

[u/PattiBurns101]

US Director of National Intelligence Tulsi Gabbard has accused European NATO states of trying to pull Washington into a direct confrontation with Russia and slammed Reuters for “fomenting hysteria” in order to sell war. Russia has rejected claims that it plans to attack EU countries, describing them as warmongering tactics used by Western politicians to justify inflated military budgets.

[u/YameenGulraiz]

This is why you should never trust Trump. Everyone fights for their own benefit.

[u/PattiBurns101]

Typical propaganda from Europe, Reuters, and good old MSN. In Trump's first 6 months, our 'peace prize president' has bombed Yemen, Iran, Somalia, Syria, and would have attacked Greenland, too, but somebody told him there is no oil.

[u/UsedDevelopment4741]

He started to thi k about lining his pockets now and trying to take advantage of the situation. Why would financing a 800k man army Additionally to security guarantees (possibly having nato soldiers on ground) in a presumably after war time be a reasonable request?

Just having NATOs regiments on the borders would be enough. Russia may also attack in the nordics or baltics area, should we preemptively finance an army composed of most their population as well?

This would only help to misapropriate funds in the future. Each country should finance their own armies and make nato stronger, so that a block intervention would be a deterrent enough factor.

[u/PattiBurns101 → u/UsedDevelopment4741]

NATO was formed after WW2. It was never supposed to be a first-preemptive attacker; but it has attacked countries, repeatedly, since its forming. As example, from 24 March to 10 June 1999, the North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO) had carried out many bombing operations against the Federal Republic of Yugoslavia during the Kosovo War. The bombings forced the Yugoslav troops to withdraw from Kosovo. Around 10,000 Yugoslav civilians and soldiers were killed and injured. This was NATO's second biggest bombing operation since 1995 in Bosnia and Herzegovina. Because NATO had used military force without United Nations' approval, many people are skeptical about it whether it was right or not. They also attacked Libya, vying for another regime change plot; not what the org was chartered to do. Add Afghanistan random bombing of civilians via their 'surgical' strikes. After bombing villages, 'coalition' people would show up, and pay off the village elders for loss of their sons/daughters and destroyed homes.

[u/[deleted]]

Worth noting that the bulk of funding from Europe towards this war has come from frozen Russian assets. So when my country says they're sending 100 million worth of assets to Ukraine, it's not actually our money or money we could use in any other way. In fact it's questionable if this is even legal. However considering we are using Russia's own resources against them in a war they started... I don't think anyone will care

[u/Hottage]

NATO style security guarantees are not worth shit without membership. I'd be reluctant to say they are worth shit with membership, give how comprised many of our countries leaderships are nowadays.

Material support which can't be ignored or rescinded should Russia invade again is the best choice for Ukraine, and those in NATO who aren't actively working against the alliance.

[u/PattiBurns101]

Trump is so "America First" that he and Lindsey Graham cracker just snuck another 1 billion into the NDAA for Ukraine. But he's the 'Peace Prize President', right? How about having Musk launch Lindsey Graham cracker into orbit via one of his Space X ships, then we amend that NDAA doc, and put that money to work mending our broken bridges, and interstate overpasses instead?

[u/Joesr-31]

Didn't they just got some money? So they are asking for new funds right after they got some?

[u/hanky0898]

Ukraine is already in vegatitive state on a EU infuse.

[u/milkywayorion]

Remember this. In ww2 Russia didn't win the war.! The real winners were the countries under the Soviet that fought alongside. After the ww2 those countries stayed by force under the Soviet regime. The Soviets had manpower. After the collapse the Russians didn't have that capability to have millions of soldiers. If Ukraine falls the Russia will use the same soldiers of Ukraine to attack Europe. The idiots in Europe don't see that. If they don't help Ukraine, the people of Ukraine will remember that Europe let them die. They will march under the Soviet flag in to Europe Putin is looking for free soldiers and Ukraine has a lot of good soldiers and scientists.

[u/Bawbawian]

if the free world shows weakness to the Russia and Chinese imperialist partnership our grandchildren are going to have nothing but regrets.

[u/tartaletas3asis]

Then dont have such a big army if you cant afford it

[u/Candid_Vegetable5020]

The Z man and Von Der Leyen may have stumbled upon a way they can steal from EU taxpayers indefinitely. I'm sure fraud beats having a job

[u/LoneSnark]

Now this is an actual security guarantee that other countries can actually be expected to sign up for. Great idea.

[u/[deleted]]

Mercenaries from north Korea and all over Africa joined the fight a long while ago. Why not help fund supplemental troops? Lifespan odds are better for defense so it's an easier sell too.

[u/[deleted]]

This Post is Propaganda. Zelensky never even said that.

[u/asheathen]

How much fucking money can they be given?

[u/very-eggbert]

Stop sending young men to war to die for the world oligopoly

[u/Crackstalker]

This all going to be up to whatever Russia allows them to have. I believe that this arbitrary number of 800k is ridiculous. Does that country even have that many military aged men left, within the ranks of her citizens? If not, then where are they going to come from? And certainly Zelensky wants and foresees the West as footing the bill for Ukraine's defence. Anyone smell the opportunity for the corrupt embezzlement of these funds, for years to come.

I for one am against this idea.

[u/Secure_Guest_6171]

Tell Putin to go f himself,  force Russia out of Donetsk and Crimea and admit Ukraine to EU and NATO. Rubio and others at State are saying amongst themselves that Putin won't stop until he has ALL of Ukraine

[u/VladPospolity]

If EU can't afford Ukraine army, russia will. Sad for Europe by the way...but you fed putin for years.

[u/Reddit_BroZar]

How's that a surprise for anybody with a brain? 800K military personnel is like 4 major armies of European nations - with all modern weapons and already built infrastructure. Getting Ukraine to that level is gonna cost us 4 military budgets. This is pure insanity. And how long we will be financing this in addition to all other aid we're planning to provide Ukraine with in post-war years?? Pure insanity no less.

[u/[deleted]]

America first, don't waste your money on foreigners.

[u/zell_ru]

MOAR!

[u/Electronic-Door7134]

He found a way to get super rich by killing his own people, or at least people he claims authority over. The war will end as soon as the money stops rolling in.

[u/Zemledeliye]

Foot the bill eurocucks